Proposed wind farm impacts Cobden ALA future
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Some of you none believers need to go and live by them. Many poeple have moved out and had their houses purchased by the wind turbine companys. They employ poeple to go around and turn light on and off etc to matian the appearance that some one still resides there.
They insulated lots of houses and puting in doulble and trple glased windows.
The tip speed on the large turbines is near reaching the speed of sound.
All this for less than 18% efficiency.
60 billion and counting for subbities of tax papers money and in sa the higest electricity prices in the world all this as we continue to export coal to the world to produce cheap power.
We are f$%=ed
They insulated lots of houses and puting in doulble and trple glased windows.
The tip speed on the large turbines is near reaching the speed of sound.
All this for less than 18% efficiency.
60 billion and counting for subbities of tax papers money and in sa the higest electricity prices in the world all this as we continue to export coal to the world to produce cheap power.
We are f$%=ed
The tip speed on the large turbines is near reaching the speed of sound
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The evidence presented to you was empirical evidence recording the observations of highly qualified scientists working in the field as compared to anecdotal "evidence" provided by people with a barrow to push.
It seems you just don't want to accept it?
You only have to go to Delhi or Beijing to see the effects of coal smoke pollution and it's horrific effect on the population. Wind is just one of a number of ways in which clean energy can be produced and I agree that siting turbines near an airport is irresponsible. I also think we need to encourage investment initiatives to look into new sources and better utilise the existing ones, and sell the technology to a world market.
My last electricity account was $72 for 3 months because I have solar panels. This is the brave new world and I'd like to be part of it for a while longer.
How about you?
Kaz
No doubt we could discuss 'empirical' really means, including the difference between 'can' and 'may', and lots of other things but I'm very mindful that this is an aviation site and there's a limit as to how far we may reasonably digress. So to that end I think I'll probably stop at this, but for one further observation, apropos of the two previous posts to yours, kaz3g.
In my most recent involvement with a noise generator the machine in question did one rotation in around 0.83 seconds and the 'whump' modulation was ~100Hz. The rotor tip speed was ~300km/h and although not near the speed of sound it managed to pollute the environment for more than 3km around. This adversely affected the lives of a number of people living within this area, and had done so for some years.
There was neither benefit, nor compensation, afforded to those affected. In fact all the profit accrued to others in a city some distance away - so why not site the things right there?
FP.
Last edited by First_Principal; 22nd Dec 2017 at 02:19.
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Empirical evidence is information acquired by observation or experimentation. Scientists record and analyze this data. The process is a central part of the scientific method. Live Science Jul 27, 2017.
The evidence presented to you was empirical evidence recording the observations of highly qualified scientists working in the field as compared to anecdotal "evidence" provided by people with a barrow to push.
It seems you just don't want to accept it?
You only have to go to Delhi or Beijing to see the effects of coal smoke pollution and it's horrific effect on the population. Wind is just one of a number of ways in which clean energy can be produced and I agree that siting turbines near an airport is irresponsible. I also think we need to encourage investment initiatives to look into new sources and better utilise the existing ones, and sell the technology to a world market.
My last electricity account was $72 for 3 months because I have solar panels. This is the brave new world and I'd like to be part of it for a while longer.
How about you?
Kaz
The evidence presented to you was empirical evidence recording the observations of highly qualified scientists working in the field as compared to anecdotal "evidence" provided by people with a barrow to push.
It seems you just don't want to accept it?
You only have to go to Delhi or Beijing to see the effects of coal smoke pollution and it's horrific effect on the population. Wind is just one of a number of ways in which clean energy can be produced and I agree that siting turbines near an airport is irresponsible. I also think we need to encourage investment initiatives to look into new sources and better utilise the existing ones, and sell the technology to a world market.
My last electricity account was $72 for 3 months because I have solar panels. This is the brave new world and I'd like to be part of it for a while longer.
How about you?
Kaz
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The subsidy is available to everyone and I sell my electricity back to the grid at less than half the retail price thus lowering costs to the energy retailer. Put some pressure on Mr T to ensure those savings are passed on to all consumers.
Kaz
Kaz
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This image is constructed from information contained within the aviation impact statement of which a link was provided in the first post of this thread. The gradient % is calculated from the blade tip to the end of the asphalt on RWY 36. It will be accurate enough for the purpose of this illustration.
The red lines represents the approximate flight path of the king Air 200 on 1 engine, in nil wind conditions taken from the end of the asphalt on runway 36, not at 50'.
Google tells me the B200 Vyse climb is 740 fpm ~ 366’ Per NM (121 Kts GS) This is slightly better than a conquest II and a lot better than a Bandierante. These types have been into Cobden.
Required head wind component to touch blade tip (1 engine inoperative) is approximately:
#11 52Kts
#10 30Kts
# 9 20 Kts
# 8 12Kts
A local impressionist has provided his interpretation of the situation:
The red lines represents the approximate flight path of the king Air 200 on 1 engine, in nil wind conditions taken from the end of the asphalt on runway 36, not at 50'.
Google tells me the B200 Vyse climb is 740 fpm ~ 366’ Per NM (121 Kts GS) This is slightly better than a conquest II and a lot better than a Bandierante. These types have been into Cobden.
Required head wind component to touch blade tip (1 engine inoperative) is approximately:
#11 52Kts
#10 30Kts
# 9 20 Kts
# 8 12Kts
A local impressionist has provided his interpretation of the situation:
Last edited by Paul O'Rourke; 1st Jan 2018 at 22:01.
Ha ha.. laughter is the best medicine, especially if yr dealing with the Fort. !!
Saw a cartoon somewhere Barnstormers?? where Father Xmas,
Rudolph etc all sliced and diced..
Humungeous turbines also going up on the ranges, Mt Emerald,slightly nw of nr Walshs Bluff abt brg 170 deg from YMBA so I guess any aircraft will certainly need to keep well clear once they start turning.
Altho the prevailing winds are SE in winter and from all points once the Trades quit ,with a distance of only 5-6 miles from the strip...could get very entertaining at times.!
If we get a cyclone this summer will be very educational to see the end result..!
Pretty sure all this massive expenditure will kick power users in the hip pocket nerve.
Saw a cartoon somewhere Barnstormers?? where Father Xmas,
Rudolph etc all sliced and diced..
Humungeous turbines also going up on the ranges, Mt Emerald,slightly nw of nr Walshs Bluff abt brg 170 deg from YMBA so I guess any aircraft will certainly need to keep well clear once they start turning.
Altho the prevailing winds are SE in winter and from all points once the Trades quit ,with a distance of only 5-6 miles from the strip...could get very entertaining at times.!
If we get a cyclone this summer will be very educational to see the end result..!
Pretty sure all this massive expenditure will kick power users in the hip pocket nerve.
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Could someone from Cobden go on a flight using a Go Pro to show us from takeoff to landing how it looks from the cockpit and how it will effect flying . A voiceover pointing out exactly where the turbines will be would be helpful.
It's a bit hard to tell what's going on from 2,000 km away.
It's a bit hard to tell what's going on from 2,000 km away.
1. Do you fly a twin engined fixed wing aircraft?
2. Would an operations manual allow one to utilise this aerodrome if the the turbines were in place, in the context of a OEI emergency?
3. Does the turbine composite suffice for your movie request?
It is good to see the shire supporting the Cobden aerodrome over this development.
Local councils just reckon the Mt Emerald project is a bottler, never a mention of the ultimate cost to the electricity user, or any compo for those nearby affected.
Tourists will flock,.. of course ! And it is a spectacular bit of engineering.
As for the other flocks, of great numbers during certain times of the year, magpie geese, ibis and brolgas that pick over the agricultural areas of the Tablelands...they'll just have to choose a different altitude or track on the way to and from the roost ...or some will get the chop.
Sound frequencies from the blades might make them steer well clear, hopefully.
As for the tin and plastic 'birds' drivers,...must exercise those amazing Mk 1 eyeballs.
Tourists will flock,.. of course ! And it is a spectacular bit of engineering.
As for the other flocks, of great numbers during certain times of the year, magpie geese, ibis and brolgas that pick over the agricultural areas of the Tablelands...they'll just have to choose a different altitude or track on the way to and from the roost ...or some will get the chop.
Sound frequencies from the blades might make them steer well clear, hopefully.
As for the tin and plastic 'birds' drivers,...must exercise those amazing Mk 1 eyeballs.
Firstly TopDrop says “A 60 meter radius blade would have to do 1 rotation in 1.1 seconds for the tip to be at speed of sound. Normal rotation time on large turbines is 3 to 4 seconds - nowhere near the speed of sound”
The planned turbine blades for Cobden are 80 metres, tip speeds might be quite high, and total height above ground almost 600 feet. Would you buy a farm at average prices with these monsters all around you? You’d expect a discount wouldn’t you.
To those who support the wind farm concept I don’t read any thoughts or care to the disadvantaged farmers nearby who get no compensation. In other areas they have sold out at lower values. Is this fair?
In Victoria the rule is no compensation if your dwelling (not any other part of your farm) is further than 1 km. At the Cobden proposal one farmer’s house is 1km and 6metres. Gosh what a coincidence? No compo! Three towers virtually surround and overlook the whole property. Quite apart from the visual effects, possible noise, maybe effects on stock, potential damage or fire from defective turbines or just ask the local aerial ag operator if he can apply fertiliser, insecticide or herbicide at the same price as before?
Is this fair? Perhaps Australian’s don’t value private property and a fair go for hard working farmers. No matter, Government won’t ever put them near any major population areas.
The planned turbine blades for Cobden are 80 metres, tip speeds might be quite high, and total height above ground almost 600 feet. Would you buy a farm at average prices with these monsters all around you? You’d expect a discount wouldn’t you.
To those who support the wind farm concept I don’t read any thoughts or care to the disadvantaged farmers nearby who get no compensation. In other areas they have sold out at lower values. Is this fair?
In Victoria the rule is no compensation if your dwelling (not any other part of your farm) is further than 1 km. At the Cobden proposal one farmer’s house is 1km and 6metres. Gosh what a coincidence? No compo! Three towers virtually surround and overlook the whole property. Quite apart from the visual effects, possible noise, maybe effects on stock, potential damage or fire from defective turbines or just ask the local aerial ag operator if he can apply fertiliser, insecticide or herbicide at the same price as before?
Is this fair? Perhaps Australian’s don’t value private property and a fair go for hard working farmers. No matter, Government won’t ever put them near any major population areas.
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Today, 3/6/2019, VCAT handed down its verdict over the Naroghid Wind Farm Pty Ltd application, PA 1700276, for a planning permit to build turbines close to the Northern end of runway 36 Cobden.
“NO PERMIT GRANTED”
Many stakeholders and community citizens owe a debt of gratitude to Norton White (Sydney) for their considerable assistance on this matter. Let’s hope this is the end of it.
One point of interest/concern is the inference turbulence experienced at a registered/licensed airport could suddenly be mitigated if it were at an ALA.
“NO PERMIT GRANTED”
Many stakeholders and community citizens owe a debt of gratitude to Norton White (Sydney) for their considerable assistance on this matter. Let’s hope this is the end of it.
One point of interest/concern is the inference turbulence experienced at a registered/licensed airport could suddenly be mitigated if it were at an ALA.
I was visiting the upper floors of a Gold Coast high rise the other day and stood on the veranda to have a look-see at the view. Blowing a gale it were. I’m told thats what happens most days. Seems a perfect place to put up wind power generators..
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Checkboard - great photo! Is there a source for that (might need it in Court one day)?
