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Overseas airspace – how did I ever live?

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Overseas airspace – how did I ever live?

Old 10th Mar 2017, 21:45
  #41 (permalink)  
 
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Throw in a couple of inbounds on different radials and delaying Dick becomes the most efficient use of the airspace.
Not in Dick's mind, it doesn't!

Last edited by Arm out the window; 10th Mar 2017 at 22:07.
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Old 11th Mar 2017, 07:27
  #42 (permalink)  
 
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There was a time.... Had occasion to take a 172 into Mascot. Called inbound at the reporting point - the racecourse? Got back a question - 'What speed can you maintain to touchdown?" Got the meessage, height to lose and full throttle gave me "120 kts" "Right, track direct to RW xx, maintain 120 kts, take the first high-speed taxiway. You are following a DC9 and I have a 727 behind you".

Never happen now.
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Old 11th Mar 2017, 11:17
  #43 (permalink)  
 
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You couldn't afford the fees!
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Old 11th Mar 2017, 15:32
  #44 (permalink)  
 
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Yeah FL235, I can see the look on your face just before you hit the ground/water after being turned on to your back due wake turbulence....Oh and by the way, first high speed off any runway in SY is going to put you nose to nose with 300,000 kilos of angry outbound aluminium. Never happen now!
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Old 12th Mar 2017, 00:20
  #45 (permalink)  
 
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I can see the look on your face just before you hit the ground/water after being turned on to your back due wake turbulence.
I have also had similar to FL235 - inbound via Mona Vale and asked for max speed, sighted the DC9 I was following, made sure I stayed above the DC9's profile and landed after it's touchdown point - no wake turbulence.
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Old 12th Mar 2017, 01:34
  #46 (permalink)  
 
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can we hire a team from the FAA to sort CASA out? Is Dick willing to put up the cash? CASA won't.
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Old 12th Mar 2017, 09:16
  #47 (permalink)  
 
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FL235,

Somewhere I have a photo I took after we landed at YSSY in an Archer during 1984. Prior to departure, we were at the holding point and behind us was a South African Airlines B747-200.
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Old 12th Mar 2017, 10:32
  #48 (permalink)  
 
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I think that 1983 was pre-radar in Darwin - you remember that it was when anybody could fly drugs into Australia from Indonesia because we had no means of detecting them. (Actually I'm not sure we can now - after all they probably ignore the ADS-B mandate). So pre-radar the C130 presumably wanting the same track as Dick, would have had to wait for Dick, on an amended route, was outside a lat/sep point. If Dick could be given a track that was more than 40 degrees different to the runway heading that would not apply. The simplest way would probably have been to turn Dick back over the field to depart behind the C130, then everyone departs on track. In the US VFR Dick would have been traffic information in Class E airspace, or as it was known then, VFR exempt.

Crazy but that's what we did. If Darwin had been uncontrolled the C130 driver would simply have taken off and kept his/her eyes open for Dick's helicopter.
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Old 12th Mar 2017, 10:46
  #49 (permalink)  
 
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If Darwin had been uncontrolled the C130 driver would simply have taken off and kept his/her eyes open for Dick's helicopter.
Yep, eyeballs out. Way to go...
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Old 12th Mar 2017, 12:26
  #50 (permalink)  
 
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I moved from the UK in 2013, after years of private flying there. I have flown all round the UK, Europe, the US and continue to fly regularly in the US. The airspace here is ridiculous. The idea that Williamtown could straddle the main East Coast route with this massive swathe of airspace is absurd.

And don't get me started on Mode S. If I have to replace the transponder on my Cub it will have to be a Mode S installation for $$$.

And then there is SIDS...

I completely applaud Dick Smith's position on the airspace and regulatory issues. And the reason he sounds like a cracked record is apparently nothing ever changes.
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Old 13th Mar 2017, 00:41
  #51 (permalink)  
 
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Until everyone/pilot/operator in this country buys a copy of the FAA regs and abides by them....and when CAsA turns up on the doorstep, tell'em ..'you're not needed, wanted or capable, everything is working just fine...so piss off !!

Will never happen of course, so the 'entrenched authoritarians'/Iron Ring/control freaks etc will continue to deny normal freedoms and the ordinary citizens' common sense.
They just hate the idea that aviation citizens can think for themselves.

Woe to the Industry and the taxpayer, regulatory revisions will go on forever..its a career thing for the 'public sector "workers".

And of course its blindingly obvious after 30 years and $350mil..and counting, what answer do you get if you ask..'Is it any safer today than it was back then?'

What have we got for out troubles, more bureaucratic complexitization,(thus less safe) more regs, more bs, more paperwork and more costs.

Something has to give eventually.
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Old 13th Mar 2017, 02:56
  #52 (permalink)  
 
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So there you have it, pilots from different parts of the world confirming that Australian airspace is an over regulated basket case. And you have Australian pilots and ATC's that haven't seen or experienced anything else defending over regulation and the nanny state. Keep going Dick
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Old 13th Mar 2017, 02:57
  #53 (permalink)  
 
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Something else that
"Would Never Happen Here"
The yanks have this really strange idea that everybody is entitled to use the US national airspace, it is NOT a matter of $$$$$$ talks and little aircraft can sod off.

Just fancy that, you fly by right, not by a bureaucratic grant of a "privilege" that can be limited, circumscribed or just plain withdrawn at the "whim" of "somebody" further up the food chain that pulls more lobbying weight.

And the US military DO NOT have first right of refusal on the whole lot, with civil with what's left.

And, as I have pointed out so many times, all that military restricted airspace around the Australian coastline but outside the 12 mile limit has precisely NIL legal validity ---- hence the USN regular "freedom of navigation" exercises within Australia's economic zone.

Tootle pip!!
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Old 28th Mar 2017, 06:45
  #54 (permalink)  
 
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Just catching up here, for those that are too young to know what it was like, even with the dopey old system, the buzz and activity, growth and flying businesses starting up everywhere despite the Can'tberra idiocy I can assure you that there are those of us that want better for our country and if repetition comes with the territory please try to understand the passionate frustration.
The attitude, Penguin perfect, quote "Throw in a couple of inbounds on different radials and delaying Dick becomes the most efficient use of the airspace."
Once upon a time: Had charter to Tulla, "can't take your IFR plan we are a bit busy" "ok says I, I'll go VFR and hope you can fit me in so my PAX don't miss their Qantas flight". Led by the nose all around the ML CTR quite likely by Le Pen... as above, finally a clearance the last airliner landing twelve miles from me.
Since then gradually they have had imposed on us the worst aviation system in the developed world. The most unworkable rules, strict liability criminal sanctions for all sorts of ordinary behaviour that in the US wouldn't even rate a mention, let alone penalties. Huge fees and extended delays for completely unnecessary permissions, i.e. flying school AOCs (one Grade 3 application nearby to me $8000 upfront, Jeff Boyd tells me should be ok with the new CASA standard ops manual!) months and months still not done.
Have you any idea how bad it's got?
Maintenance criteria and apprentice qualification expense hurdles all beyond reason and are causing the slow death of GA and the loss of experienced personnel. AVMED is now AVMAD, and, with our tax dollars, they are fighting a rearguard action to prevent even the loss of one bed feather. SIDS, control cables, wing bolts and engines out of twelve year calendar. Millions of dollars thrown into the bin to satisfy the gorging machine of Aviation Hearse (spelling error?).
How could this happen? Pretty simple, 1980s Thatcher (hero) set the stage for an amazing revival of Britain with privatisation. Our devious bureaucrats jumped on the band wagon with Government Business Enterprises. What a fantastic idea! These independent umpires, not subject to Public Service rules, could set fees for service and completely remove the Minister from responsibility from the black smoking hole that will occur one day.
Brilliant!
The Board of Management would set the salaries and conditions, the fatuously titled Director of Air Safety would do everything else and the Board would do nothing.
Too bad they did not see that the Westminster system was being totally trashed. That it cannot work if the Minister has no responsibility. That it cannot work when the administration has no political incentive to make it work in an acceptable manner to the reasonable citizen.
So the Act must be changed with 'promote and foster', as per Air Services, and the idiotic Statement of Expectations must go in favour of, at the very least, Statement of Directions including sanctions for non performance against KPIs.

Last edited by Sandy Reith; 28th Mar 2017 at 06:57. Reason: Tidy up, again add wing bolts
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Old 28th Mar 2017, 09:50
  #55 (permalink)  
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There was definitely radar at Darwin when I was held on departure orbiting at the NDB.

Remember in those days ATC separated everything from everything in controlled airspace.

Still almost the same at Williamtown. Amazing how the military will not empower there ATCs to make expert judgements. Heathrow and Gatwick D airspace so ATCs can use there skills to facilitate the safe and expedient operation of traffic.
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Old 28th Mar 2017, 10:23
  #56 (permalink)  
 
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Remember in those days ATC separated everything from everything in controlled airspace.
Yes, that was stupid. Much better now, playing dodgem cars with unadvised lighties.
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Old 29th Mar 2017, 06:43
  #57 (permalink)  
 
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ATC of old, mostly in the '80s and '90s

I should say that my memorable and undesirable ATC excursions were the exception. At other times generally business like and we all just got on within the old fashioned way prescribed by the union and the upper echelons in charge. However there were the odd slip ups between ATC and Flight Service handovers, after one such handover ex ML Departures given traffic by FS in the same cloud, altitude and position. ATC used to call the Flight Service officers 'smellies', I expect it made them feel so superior. We really liked the FSOs.
On occasion terrific help was encountered, eg charters when timing for flights was critical or on one memorable VFR flight into MB given special VFR ("instructor request" was the informal key) when it was closed to IFR. Also especially helpful were the Met Bureau types who would at times tell me that the forecast wasn't quite right for my flight and he'd give me a better wind.
We could write books.
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Old 5th Apr 2017, 03:46
  #58 (permalink)  
 
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Gee, I wish our ATC were as good as this;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xPo5...ature=youtu.be
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