Overseas airspace – how did I ever live?
What would be the calculated 'problem' going to Raine Island in a helicopter with no floats??, just like fixed wing...dont float for long. Islands and sand cays along the way much more user friendly for a chopper than an aircraft if needs be.
When mapping one long past November, the beach fringe and adjacent water was full of black dots...10 thousand green turtles waiting for sunset to come ashore and lays their eggs.
Like a visit to an alien planet...and couldn't land. Very special.
Apparently on the island the bird lice are diabolical !!
But to get back to the thread..In Oz the air is different and bureaucratic complexitisation is a must and although more complications make things less safe, those that (claim to ) know..the self appointed "experts".. are keeping Oz free of lost, crashed and missing aeroplanes.
Are we to just be thankful, and just suck it up...or should we seek change as per the rest of the the globe?. In CAsA and ASA, have they heard of the KISS principle ??
I'm for CELP. Cheaper, easier, less paperwork.
When mapping one long past November, the beach fringe and adjacent water was full of black dots...10 thousand green turtles waiting for sunset to come ashore and lays their eggs.
Like a visit to an alien planet...and couldn't land. Very special.
Apparently on the island the bird lice are diabolical !!
But to get back to the thread..In Oz the air is different and bureaucratic complexitisation is a must and although more complications make things less safe, those that (claim to ) know..the self appointed "experts".. are keeping Oz free of lost, crashed and missing aeroplanes.
Are we to just be thankful, and just suck it up...or should we seek change as per the rest of the the globe?. In CAsA and ASA, have they heard of the KISS principle ??
I'm for CELP. Cheaper, easier, less paperwork.
Dick, they've been involved in combat operations, on and off, for over a decade now, doing stuff you wouldn't have the faintest understanding of. Maybe news of that didn't make it through to the beach house at Tuckers Rocks. And maybe, rightly or wrongly, they feel they've got more important things to worry about than you, your beach house, your aircraft, and your opinions on what they should be copying. Just a wild guess.
I'm all for things being better, simpler, and more efficient. I just don't think you'll achieve it with an endless cycle of banging on with a load of fatuous drivel (which is what Dick's comment was) on internet forums. Still, it's a free country, so carry on and be sure to let us know how it works out for you.
If we ever have a war we are going to be in dire straights if the existng RAAF people are in charge
C'mon Dick, not again, please. It's stuff like this that writes you off in the credibility department before you even start. You have good ideas (often at least) and are obviously a good bloke, but there's no need for obvious garbage like that the above which has no basis in reality.
While I love to join in these discussions I fear that Dick and the rest of you are right - nothing will change so why does he keep bothering us with these repetitive posts?
Because he is right that's why!
I am amazed that you all would rather critisise a man who has seen what the flying world could look like and come back to tell you about it, instead of backing him to the hilt and demanding that our politicians do something.
Hours of diversions are racked up every year by civilian pilots, private and commercial, flying around holes in the sky populated by one military aircraft. The USMC has more aircraft than the entire Australian ADF and does not have a restricted area to it's name. It has Military Operating Areas but they appear and when used, disappear allowing civilians to get on with their flying lives. In the UK there is a line of military bases stretching all the way from London up to Scotland. They accommodate fighters bombers and trainers and they do not have even a restricted area round their bases never mind about where they fly their missions. (Except for the Scottish Highlands)
Both these countries have reacted to the availability of surveillance to free up their airspace and treat it like a national asset, part of the nation's infrasctructure, to be used by all efficiently and for the good of the country. Australia is stuck is some kind of 1950's time warp ruled over by Sir Donald George Anderson. All pilot's are idiots and have to be protected from themselves. The military believes that it's needs are greater than those of the nation and people they serve. They simply don't understand that you do not need an R Area as big as Germany so that two F18s can play catch with each other. They don't care that civil airliners have to fly dozens of extra track miles so that their Hornets can bomb a target at Evans Head, when that target could be out near Longreach miles away from busy East Coast air routes.
Who will change all this 1950s thinking - well actually no-one because we don't get out much when it comes to comparisons. And when someone does we treat them with contempt and vilification - after all what would they know, life was truly great when we had Flight Service everywhere!
Because he is right that's why!
I am amazed that you all would rather critisise a man who has seen what the flying world could look like and come back to tell you about it, instead of backing him to the hilt and demanding that our politicians do something.
Hours of diversions are racked up every year by civilian pilots, private and commercial, flying around holes in the sky populated by one military aircraft. The USMC has more aircraft than the entire Australian ADF and does not have a restricted area to it's name. It has Military Operating Areas but they appear and when used, disappear allowing civilians to get on with their flying lives. In the UK there is a line of military bases stretching all the way from London up to Scotland. They accommodate fighters bombers and trainers and they do not have even a restricted area round their bases never mind about where they fly their missions. (Except for the Scottish Highlands)
Both these countries have reacted to the availability of surveillance to free up their airspace and treat it like a national asset, part of the nation's infrasctructure, to be used by all efficiently and for the good of the country. Australia is stuck is some kind of 1950's time warp ruled over by Sir Donald George Anderson. All pilot's are idiots and have to be protected from themselves. The military believes that it's needs are greater than those of the nation and people they serve. They simply don't understand that you do not need an R Area as big as Germany so that two F18s can play catch with each other. They don't care that civil airliners have to fly dozens of extra track miles so that their Hornets can bomb a target at Evans Head, when that target could be out near Longreach miles away from busy East Coast air routes.
Who will change all this 1950s thinking - well actually no-one because we don't get out much when it comes to comparisons. And when someone does we treat them with contempt and vilification - after all what would they know, life was truly great when we had Flight Service everywhere!
How so? Was what I wrote inaccurate in some way, or did you just not like reading it
BUT:
And maybe, rightly or wrongly, they feel they've got more important things to worry about than you, your beach house, your aircraft, and your opinions on what they should be copying. Just a wild guess.
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: AUS
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hey,
I am brand new here..like 10 seconds ago. So bear with my simplicity...
What I do have to offer is Dick is plainly a highly experienced pilot, with serious aviation experience and also time in that black hole of bureaucracy we call CASA.
Go Dick! After 45 years of living you are the type of entity that encouraged me to take up PPL.
If you can press upon the suits to bring back the 'glory days' of flying instead of shutting it down to some elites, I am always open to hear your comments.
PS, If I ever have an EFIF can I use your Gundaroo strip ? Or just practice my TandG there maybe?
Thanks Dick, keep up the honest flying retrospective, maybe one day the strangling beast of CASA will allow those who really want to, fly !
Ramjet_AUS
I am brand new here..like 10 seconds ago. So bear with my simplicity...
What I do have to offer is Dick is plainly a highly experienced pilot, with serious aviation experience and also time in that black hole of bureaucracy we call CASA.
Go Dick! After 45 years of living you are the type of entity that encouraged me to take up PPL.
If you can press upon the suits to bring back the 'glory days' of flying instead of shutting it down to some elites, I am always open to hear your comments.
PS, If I ever have an EFIF can I use your Gundaroo strip ? Or just practice my TandG there maybe?
Thanks Dick, keep up the honest flying retrospective, maybe one day the strangling beast of CASA will allow those who really want to, fly !
Ramjet_AUS
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Queensland
Posts: 686
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Now let me see if I've got this right. We have a military in order to protect us from nasty people who MIGHT come over here and steal all our money and take away our freedoms such as flying.
In order to pay for their horrendously expensive toys the military then take all our money and remove our freedom to fly so they can practice using their toys in the most populated parts of the country.
I sometimes think we should negotiate with the nasty people and see if they can come up with a better deal. It is obvious our military isn't going to change.
In order to pay for their horrendously expensive toys the military then take all our money and remove our freedom to fly so they can practice using their toys in the most populated parts of the country.
I sometimes think we should negotiate with the nasty people and see if they can come up with a better deal. It is obvious our military isn't going to change.
Thread Starter
Showa Cho, you ask about me being held outbound from Darwin.
Perhaps le Pingouin or another one of the controllers could tell me. Here is the exact quote from page 226 of my book ‘The Earth Beneath Me’ which was published in 1983:
Remember, this was years before I had written ‘Two Years in the Aviation Hall of Doom.’
Also remember back in those days we had ‘controlled’ and ‘uncontrolled’ airspace. One of the chapters in my book was about how air traffic controllers would separate VFR helicopters from VFR helicopters using IFR standards in primary control zones. Naturally, in those days if they wanted to separate a VFR helicopter from a Hercules, they probably had to do it procedurally in some weird way.
I would love to have the comments on why this happened.
Perhaps le Pingouin or another one of the controllers could tell me. Here is the exact quote from page 226 of my book ‘The Earth Beneath Me’ which was published in 1983:
“I lifted off the tarmac at 8.45am and was then asked by the controller to “hold” over the NDB for several minutes while an RAAF Hercules took off! I found this archaic procedure quite incredible. It was the first holding I had to do since leaving Fort Worth, and I had landed at much busier airports than Darwin. Still, that is Australia. A great country but with some maddening quirks.”
Remember, this was years before I had written ‘Two Years in the Aviation Hall of Doom.’
Also remember back in those days we had ‘controlled’ and ‘uncontrolled’ airspace. One of the chapters in my book was about how air traffic controllers would separate VFR helicopters from VFR helicopters using IFR standards in primary control zones. Naturally, in those days if they wanted to separate a VFR helicopter from a Hercules, they probably had to do it procedurally in some weird way.
I would love to have the comments on why this happened.
AAAhhh..... "Also remember back in those days we had ‘controlled’ and ‘uncontrolled’ airspace""
Please stop that Dick, Please...... I'm getting all 'teary'........
Cheers
Please stop that Dick, Please...... I'm getting all 'teary'........
Cheers
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Melbourne
Age: 60
Posts: 952
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
C'mon Dick, not again, please. It's stuff like this that writes you off in the credibility department before you even start. You have good ideas (often at least) and are obviously a good bloke, but there's no need for obvious garbage like that the above which has no basis in reality.
I get the idea from your posts that your first professional job after leaving school/uni is the RAAF.
Have you ever worked outside Australia, or have you ever worked professionally in the private sector?
And if you've been deployed, was it purely with other Australian forces, or was it in a "Combined/Joint" setting?
I ask these questions because I've done all the above (replace RAAF with Army), and IME:
If we ever have a war we are going to be in dire straights if the existing RAAF people are in charge
My experience in Iraq was that the Americans and English were there to conduct Counterinsurgency operations; most of the rest of the coalition forces were there to 'wave the flag', as it were. The Australians were, by and large, little more than cadets playing at war games and getting in the way of the Americans.
As far as the Australian forces were concerned, results (such as conducting operations, actually interdicting insurgents, etc.) never mattered. So long as every procedure was carried out to the letter. In other words, A Battalion could tour Iraq, not do anything constructive at all (and some did just that), but the commander would get a commendation on a job well done because all the procedures were adhered to. (And before you reply, you may just want to question WHY the Battalion didn't do anything constructive).
So, yes, IMHO, if we were ever to be invaded...
By the time the powers that be had decided what colour to make the cover on the report, the foreign powers would be raising their flag in Canberra.
DIVOSH!
Dick, you would need to ask a RAAF ATC your question. They run Darwin, although you might need a time machine to go back 35 years to get your answer.
Dick's point is that the question should not have to be asked of and answered by the RAAF.
I agree on that point.
I agree on that point.
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 58
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If there is a more efficient and effective way we can run the airspace then we really need to do it. I agree that the current system needs work. The problem is I just don't know what the correct answer is. But if the current attitude that because they are VFR and not paying for the service and therefore don't matter could disappear then that would be fantastic.
Di Vosh,
My experience would indicate that its usually the hands of politics and government that restricts leadership from doing what it wants, rather than leadership itself. That said, I've had some bosses in my limited time that would apply to your description.
Maybe I've been drinking the koolaid too much, but generally I think most of the "bad" things I've seen done or implemented usually come with an agenda from someone outside the chain.
My experience would indicate that its usually the hands of politics and government that restricts leadership from doing what it wants, rather than leadership itself. That said, I've had some bosses in my limited time that would apply to your description.
Maybe I've been drinking the koolaid too much, but generally I think most of the "bad" things I've seen done or implemented usually come with an agenda from someone outside the chain.
Well who else is going to answer it? The civvies will probably have an idea but weren't involved at all. I think we all would agree it was for separation purposes of some sort, and not just for spite. It doesnt have to be a busy airport, you just have to be in the same place at the same time. You might be the only two aircraft in the sky. If they'd refused his take off clearance until the Herc had departed, would he be happier? They just got him out of the way of something bigger, heavier, and faster, and then let him go. It was a few minutes holding 35 years ago. Move on.