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The Head of CASA AVMED Resigned Too Soon...

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The Head of CASA AVMED Resigned Too Soon...

Old 9th May 2015, 22:53
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The Head of CASA AVMED Resigned Too Soon...

I note this morning that the Federal Government has announced the introduction of a nationwide E - Health record for every Australian , this time with an "Opt Out" provision only.

Budget 2015: New 'opt out' e-health system to see all Australians given electronic record - Federal Budget 2015 - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

My First thought is that our beloved former head of CASA Avmed resigned Four months too soon. What a smorgasbord of medical conditions will be revealed to CASA!!!! How many thousands of medical certificates can now be cancelled when all is revealed!

The teenage pre menstrual problems listed as "depression", the blokes who consulted a psychiatrist Twenty years ago. The teenage flirtation with marijuana that led to heavy prescriptions of SSRis. The undisclosed cancers and surgery. The "doctor shopping" to avoid disclosing your full medical history to a DAME!!!

All gone at the stroke of a key!!!! "Opt Out" you say? CASA will fix that, you opt out then no medical certificate for you! Privacy? Fiddlesticks! Look at what Andreas Lubitz did!

Think of the court cases! Think of all those pitiful AAT hearings! Think of all that, and available at the press of a few keys! "OK today boys, we are going to look for any pilot who has ever recorded a high reading on a liver function test or been prescribed Librax of valium at the same consultation, ready boys! Go!".

And tomorrow they go after anyone holding a medical certificate who has been treated at a ski resort for a broken bone, then we go after pilots with elevated PSA, the list is endless.

Everyone has something in their medical records that requires detailed explanation and Avmed is going to seek the rights to pore through yours, sure as eggs is eggs.
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Old 9th May 2015, 23:09
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Everyone has something in their medical records that requires detailed explanation and Avmed is going to seek the rights to pore through yours, sure as eggs is eggs.
A little dramatic there Sunny. I don't think your average 18-21 CPL student has much to worry about. I don't think my tonsil removal and wisdom teeth removal 20 years are going to bother my medical either.
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Old 9th May 2015, 23:27
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Will repeat doses of the clap call cognitive ability into question?
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Old 10th May 2015, 00:22
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IF brought to bear, an absolute and intolerable invasion of privacy.
It must be resisted now by every means available

The doctors' code of confidentiality must be upheld with every piece
of armoury to hand.
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Old 10th May 2015, 00:58
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CASE STUDY -

(CASA EXCESSES)

A commercial pilot, flying for a living the last twenty years, found his wife increasingly irrational and hard to live with. Last year the trauma came to a head when she became alternately violent and depressed. Jim got a referral and took himself off to a recommended shrink to discuss the problem.

The following month, renewing his Class One medical, he mentioned in passing to the DAME, whom he has known and been to for years, that things were getting worse at home and that he had been to the psychiatrist for advice.

A week or two later Jim received a notice from Avmed suspending his medical pending an investigation into HIS mental state. It was three months before he got his medical back. There was no explanation and no apology.

Some bastards need stringing up.

And if this one does not start the alarm bells ringing
the lights are on but no one's home

Last edited by Fantome; 10th May 2015 at 07:58.
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Old 10th May 2015, 01:20
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Perhaps we need to see some detail before making assumptions of where this might go?

Patients will have the power to suppress parts of the record they do not wish to be seen, as the health record will be controlled by the patient.
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Old 10th May 2015, 01:27
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Perhaps Kaz, you didn't read or comprehend Sunny's post. Want to bet there will be -
"All gone at the stroke of a key!!!! "Opt Out" you say? CASA will fix that, you opt out then no medical certificate for you! Privacy? Fiddlesticks! Look at what Andreas Lubitz did!" Do you trust them that much?
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Old 10th May 2015, 05:32
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Should it be on the cards that because of Andreas Lubitz's action any history of depression will be debarring, now is the time to assess in detail what
the rule makers propose.

The blackdog has lurked round so many men and women in so many fields
that the evidence has to be there to counter arbitrary claims that there is a risk to air safety. To make such claims as justification for sanctions or suspensions amounts to the premature wielding of a very big stick.
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Old 10th May 2015, 06:22
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Article said
Patients will have the power to suppress parts of the record they do not wish to be seen, as the health record will be controlled by the patient.
Wonder what that would mean in the real world. I'm from the government and here to help?
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Old 10th May 2015, 06:54
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The gov will have to change the regs to permit CASA to do that, CASA just can't do as it pleases there.

Re what you had 20 yrs ago, fair break, what record? A paper record would be about it and archived at that. And those computerised records since? Good luck to CASA re different systems etc.
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Old 10th May 2015, 07:46
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Originally Posted by Sunfish View Post
I note this morning that the Federal Government has announced the introduction of a nationwide E - Health record for every Australian , this time with an "Opt Out" provision only.
Great isn't it. They spend billions of dollars on a defacto "Australia card" promising to save billions and be totally private (but every Govt dept and his dog would have access to it) and the public reject it.

Rather than drop it, they now make it mandatory (and say you can opt out of parts if you want to).

I guess, much like every other failed government initiative, it won't be long before health funds, and life insurers won't cover you, and employees hire you, or doctors bulk bill you, unless you quote your "ehealth" record and give them access to it!
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Old 10th May 2015, 08:26
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As a medical student, I can see the benefits of this, if someone turns up in emergency alone, unconscious, you can look up their medical history with may assist with a quicker diagnosis of the problem, and therefore quicker treatment, and potentially save their life.

As a pilot, I can see the downsides of this, pretty much every pilot has at least 2 doctors they see, one for their medical, whom they see to have their medical renewed only, whom only knows about the perfect health of the pilot, and another they see every other time, when they have the flu, they they break their hand or leg, or any other ailment. Because if the DAME found out about your day to day issues, CASA would likely rip up your medical in a second pending 'investigation'.

I know someone who was going for their medical to enter the airforce, and had an abnormal heart beat in the airforce medical. They did not get into the airforce, but they were also grounded for several months by CASA, and had to spend big money proving that it was not a problem to CASA.

Remember, according to the regs, if you have an illness that stops you for flying for 7 days or more for a Class 1 (30 days for a class 2) [CASA 2015], then you are supposed to go to your DAME before you fly again to get the OK to fly. So that flu you had last week that kept took you down for a week, you had better had seen a DAME before you took the stick in your hands again, or you just contravened a CASA regulation. Hold a Class 2 and broke your hand or leg, then better see your DAME before you fly again.

CASA 2015, 'Reporting Medical Conditions to CASA', CASA, viewed 10 May 2015, Civil Aviation Safety Authority - Reporting medical conditions to CASA
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Old 10th May 2015, 12:16
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Take a look at the oher thread on the 182 failed go around with a pilot with a heart condition that he didn't tell the DAME about and think about how the story would have been different if disclosure was guaranteed... He probably wouldn't have been flying, but is that a good or bad thing?
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Old 10th May 2015, 13:05
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I'm a Dame, PPL and Gp. As the posts indicate, this is a fascinating developement , especially if CASA manages to get itself designated as an organisation able to access the electronic medical record. The variance or doubts generated by regulatory clinicians viewing a personal medical when not involved in a direct supply of medical care will pose big problems for all . The Australian aviation system works quite safely now with sensible self disclosure and local DAMES who know their clients. Unless there are sanctions for opting out of the electronic record, it seems reasonable for commercial pilots to opt out of the proposed system of until its very very clear how the record will be used.As part of this however, pilots should choose carefully the type and quality of medical care they receive. Pilots and their clinicians need sophisticated understanding combining good medical decisions as well as their statutory obligations.
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Old 10th May 2015, 15:37
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If you hide a medical condition from your DAME just so you can enjoy yourself at the risk of others, you do not deserve to call yourself an aviator. Be responsible because other people's lives are at risk, not just your own!
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Old 10th May 2015, 16:05
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I don't think anyone here is suggesting continuing to fly if you have a known and potentially grounding ailment. The concern is that Avmed have demonstrated a knee jerk, punitive and non expeditious pattern of behaviour. This has led to a culture of under reporting of medical issues because of how they have been mishandled and unnecessarily detrimental to pilots careers before.
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Old 10th May 2015, 22:27
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Take a look at the oher thread on the 182 failed go around with a pilot with a heart condition that he didn't tell the DAME about ...
Rumour based on hearsay based on scaremongering based on speculative opinion.

Herein lies the problem.

ATSB reports are a bunch of hearsay cobbled together to support a pre-determined outcome.

Any normal human being has "conditions" that can be scaremongered into a risk to aviation safety.

Avmed appears to me to believe that its opinion, informed by a 10 minute review of pieces of paper and without any examination of the individual involved, is an objective truth.

I don't think your average 18-21 CPL student has much to worry about.
Really?

18-21 year olds never suffer depression, never experiment with drugs and never have a big night out?

Your turn will come, S7700.
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Old 10th May 2015, 23:23
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Take a look at the oher thread on the 182 failed go around with a pilot with a heart condition that he didn't tell the DAME about
He had a heart condition that was detected in the autopsy. It was not detectable in normal tests for a class 1 medical (does that include ECG?)

It is not clear that the pilot knew he had the condition - the lack of information in the report suggests he did not. The report also says that there is no evidence that the condition contributed to the accident.
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Old 11th May 2015, 00:32
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Really?

18-21 year olds never suffer depression, never experiment with drugs and never have a big night out?

Your turn will come, S7700.
I'm referring to your average heart condition, cataracts, etc... the aged related nuggets that nobody wants the DAME to know about. Anyone can do drugs or get depressed, at any age....

My turn will come and when it comes I'll hang up my flying boots as I'm not a medical expert and I don't know if my future heart condition will cause me to pass out and take out innocents on the ground. Trouble is that we all feel great until something happens to us

PS: We don't actually know if the 182 pilot knew about their condition.
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Old 11th May 2015, 01:03
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Judging by some of the responses here there are a few fliers who are not hearing the warnings to go very very cautiously, lest you too become a victim.

As far as the assessing of your fitness to fly, your DAME, your DOE (ophthalmic) and all other prescribed examiners who give you the once over, these are the examinations that are the prime determinants as to whether you are fit or whether you have something wrong with you. If your DAME is up to scratch he will know if you are not fit to fly.

Anxiety should not be a part of your days and weeks leading up to a medical.
For many it is, even when a ball of health. There is enough posted here to confirm the diagnosis of severe bureaucratic malaise.

On another tack, concerning the handling of stress, it is of increasing importance that everyone who feels that stress is affecting personal health adversely , actively seek remedies. Cannot stress this too strongly.
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