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To all those looking for a new job.

Old 10th Apr 2015, 13:46
  #21 (permalink)  
 
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Wanted Apprentice Panel Beater.
Minimum Year 10 Pass in Maths and English, and a knowledge of basic hand tools.
Award wage and entitlements.

Take a punt on the number of applications!
Zero...............?
The name is Porter is offline  
Old 10th Apr 2015, 13:47
  #22 (permalink)  
 
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Pilot A
200 hours
Cpl with MECIR
University degree in aviation (about as useful as the resumes in your bin)
Never held a job and has always lived with mum and dad

Pilot B
200 hours
Cpl with MECIR
Basic high school education
8 years experience in sales, customer service, etc.



Based on your statements, you buffoons would rather bin applicant B and call Pilot A. And you wonder why you can't find a decent pilot to fly your clapped out Cessnas? And no I am not a job seeker, I've done my time in GA and posts like this make me glad I have moved on
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Old 10th Apr 2015, 13:56
  #23 (permalink)  
 
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What is a 'Frozen ATPL' by the way? Is it another thing Australian aviators made up to make themselves sound better? Do you get half an epaulette for that? Or a full one?
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Old 10th Apr 2015, 14:17
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Frozen ATPL

I'm guessing that under CAR 5 since there was no flight test for ATPL until Part 61 (with the theory questions being the main hurdle) it became convention.

I would dare say that the notion of Frozen ATPL now no longer exists.
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Old 10th Apr 2015, 14:22
  #25 (permalink)  
 
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going to guess Andy has had a lot of replies to his last AFAP ad that haven't met his satisfaction
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Old 10th Apr 2015, 14:30
  #26 (permalink)  
 
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jas24zzk

Good post and this about sums it up.

If an outfit cant be assed to respond to an application, when looking for pilots, how are their pilots treated when they aren't wanted.

A company's pilots and engineers are their most valuable asset, apart from the aircraft.

There was a story I heard years ago, a Chief pilot who was overworked and stressed grabbed a half a stack of CV's from his desk and threw them in the bin. He was quoted as saying, "the last thing I need is someone down on their luck" or words to that effect.

Over qualified? How the hell can one be over qualified? What they really mean is they wont pay for experienced people, or scared their jobs maybe under threat to someone with a damned sight more experience than them. I was no threat to anyone. Never again after 2 "management" positions. It's a 24/7 job most of the time and the extra money just ain't worth it. I did consider it again but wanted 35% salary increase over line flying and nothing less. That's what you need to compensate for the BS.
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Old 10th Apr 2015, 14:48
  #27 (permalink)  
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Lets clarify some points for those that have no idea what they are talking about..

We have 4 Cessna Caravans, 3 of them were brand new when they arrived here the 4th had 2000 hours when we picked it up..

We have 10 further C208B EX on order with Cessna

They are all G1000 with most of the bells and whistles.

We also have a PAC750, DHC-6/300, 4 x AS350 Squirrels and a KA32 Kamov Helicopter.

Yes for a change i am not in the jungle where i spend 90% of my year, I am lucky enough to be in a major city for a change unfortunately only for 5 days.

Our pay rates are far beyond any GA company in Australia and some of the best in this country.

I dont see too many Aussie GA operators paying net US$4000 to US$6000 per month for flying a Caravan or PAC750

DEADCUT we had taken a few with lesser hours but these were guys we had offered positions too long before the most recent adverts. We will continue to take those we offered positions to prior to the current requirements but that will take time.

vee1-rotate - if you read our add you would have seen it clearly states do not apply if you dont meet the minimums. We have got the odd email from people that have said "I am only a few hours short of meeting your requirements. Would you prefer i wait until next time or can i send you my CV".. Our reply to most of those was to send them through and yes we employed one after he went home for a few months and got the hours we needed.

17pdboost - with the experience you listed i would assume you weren't 16 or 17 when you did it and would welcome that sort of information.

Sop_Monkey - 99% of the time we do reply to all emails, most of them "thanking them for sending their CVs but unfortunately you do not meet our minimum requirements". Unfortunately those emails can sit in my outbox for weeks at a time waiting for some semblance or reasonable internet.

Jetdream - Seriously i dont care who paid for their training, to be crystal clear i paid for all of my own training.

Decoder - We are not advertising for pilots looking for their first job, i thought that would be obvious from our STRICT MINIMUM REQUIREMENTS.

50/50 - Wow... Luckily we are not offering A$40k and we dont fly clapped out 182s, we fly new G1000 Turbine Caravans into some of the most challenging airstrips in the world.. Our Junior Captains are taking home a pay equivalent to getting A$82K and our Senior Line Captains are taking home A$133K based on the current exchange rates.

How many pilots in GA with 1500 hours are getting paid A$82K as a line pilot as soon as theyre checked to line.. I am sure their are a few but not many.

And seriously I would love to hear from those with 2000 - 2500 hours flying single engine aircraft in Australia earning A$133K

As well as our fair and reasonable pay scale while our pilots are on tour they have meals and accommodation provided so for 6 weeks every 2 months they are spending very little money.

As Mach E Avelli put it the reason of the original post is to educate those wanting to apply. If you dont want to take our suggestions that's your choice.

megle2 - Maybe a few more reds are in order.

FYI - Our add clearly states we are not hiring copilots. Every day we receive at least 10 CV's from 150-200 hour pilots who have never flown outside of their flight schools. Some of these people "Tell Us" they dont need the minimum hours because of their superior skills.

Following is an example of the emails we get every day

-----------------------------------------------------------

My name is XXXXXX ,I´m Airbus 320 pilot with recent experience 230 hours in XYZ Express and I have recently done 34 hours in Air XYZ Centre Simulator and 4 hours in C.A.E Madrid.

I have experience in C206 in Africa..I love this fligths..

Enclosed is my CV .
I´m available to work immediately.

---------------------------------------------------

This guys CV shows a total of 445 hours and yes he got a nice reply telling him he doesnt meet our minimum requirements. That is one of 14 emails tonight not meeting our requirements. Another guy 69 years old who i would sincerely love to have his experience with us, but legally we cant take him, hence our advert clearly states maximum 60 years old.

We may not be the biggest or best place to work but most of our guys and girls enjoy the lifestyle. We all enjoy flying in some of the most beautiful and remote parts of the world and we get paid fairly well.
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Old 10th Apr 2015, 15:07
  #28 (permalink)  
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hillbillybob -:)

You hit the nail on the head..

Just today i have received over 20 CV's with none of them meeting the requirements.

I dont mean a few hours short, I mean 500-1300 hours short of total time or zero time on type.

I have much better things to be doing than sifting through and replying to people that either don't take the time to fully read our add or just dont care.


Andy
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Old 10th Apr 2015, 15:10
  #29 (permalink)  
 
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Andrew- I retract my comments on you being a prat. I just think your first post came across as very self righteous. All I ask of you is when you deal with these young and inexperienced people remember we have all be in that situation at some time, don't forget where you came from yourself and where and how you started.
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Old 10th Apr 2015, 20:46
  #30 (permalink)  
 
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I think it is worth commending Andy, as an employer coming out and giving feedback to the wider pilot community. It's not something you see very often.

Naturally there are going to be people thinking that the industry owes them something and when they get a rejection or god forbid hear nothing back, whilst not even meeting the requirements, they have a tantrum.

Had this latest job ad been for a P750 driver with the same hour requirement I would have been applying.
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Old 10th Apr 2015, 22:45
  #31 (permalink)  
 
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When I was a CP a century or so ago we never advertised so had no set criteria.
We had a couple of full time pilots in addition to myself and a couple of (very) casuals we would use if needed.
We got a dozen or more CVs a week even though we would never have needed any new pilots that someone at the organisation didn't know personally.
I am sorry to say I never often read the CVs and just binned them.
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Old 10th Apr 2015, 23:16
  #32 (permalink)  
 
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Angry

Strewth...

What's a DHC-6/300 ?
Are you serious?
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Old 11th Apr 2015, 05:11
  #33 (permalink)  
 
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Hey Andy,

I see your minimum requirements for the Captains position posted on the ad.

May I ask what requirements you guys look for when hiring first officers?
And do you usually advertise for first officers or expect people to show up?


cheers.
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Old 11th Apr 2015, 06:02
  #34 (permalink)  
 
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When I was a CP a century or so ago we never advertised so had no set criteria.
We had a couple of full time pilots in addition to myself and a couple of (very) casuals we would use if needed.
We got a dozen or more CVs a week even though we would never have needed any new pilots that someone at the organisation didn't know personally.
I am sorry to say I never often read the CVs and just binned them.
Yea, you sound real sorry. Give yourself a pat on the back while you're at it.
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Old 11th Apr 2015, 06:23
  #35 (permalink)  
 
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Ok, so the perfect application arrives, a Skype interview and a background check proves the person is all they say they are: Who pays for the face to face interview and relocation?

Am I wrong in expecting it to be the employer?

Dear applicant, I have a couple of flogged out old warriors and a 182, I'm offering you the opportunity to operate these for bugger all money, in a poxy old Sh!ithole and you will be forever grateful.
I KNOW this is not Andy, but I can't help but think it is the best line on this thread. I know these types, they exist in this industry and often offer under award pay for the favour of providing a start. In desperation the people "working" for them apply for anything, just wanting out and a decent job. Decent jobs in GA seem to be dwindling.
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Old 11th Apr 2015, 07:32
  #36 (permalink)  
 
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I've got jobs for which I didn't quite meet the minimum requirements simply because there was no one suitable who did. Once the employer realised he needed to relax the requirements a bit I came into the frame.

Obviously it's no use applying for a Saab 340 Captains job with 1000 hours total but if you are reasonably close to the minimums you could get lucky.
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Old 11th Apr 2015, 07:53
  #37 (permalink)  
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Skydiveandy has brought up some very good points actually, because it reminds me of some of the resumes that used to land on the Boss's desk (approximately three per week!) at Simbu Aviation all those years ago.

I remember one morning Richard (God rest his soul) handing me the latest one to arrive and asking me what I thought of it. From memory it ran to somewhere near 6 pages and featured a photograph of a 747 on takeoff on the front page.

It went on to list where the applicant was born, raised, educated; Primary and Secondary, where he worked after leaving school, the Flying School where he did his training, interests outside Flying, hobbies etc etc.

By the time I reached the last page I must have been rolling my eyes as Richard mentioned that I should file it in the 'circular file' once I'd finished reading it, adding that he had already briefly perused it himself and no longer required it.

However, he had made a note of the Applicants address as he always replied to them, mostly with a standard form letter stating that their experience fell below the required minimums if they indeed did. Otherwise they got a 'you will be kept on file for a month' letter.

The point is that the whole resume was a huge overkill! Richard once told me that a single page resume with a single page covering letter was all he required! And also that if they didn't already have the minimums, which for him was 1000hrTT, MEIFR and preferably a bit of remote area experience, then they should not bother sending anything!

There was another one which arrived a bit later where the applicant easily had the minimums and possibly would have scored a job with Simbu but the resume and covering letter were full of mis-spellings and poor grammar.

That's another story.
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Old 11th Apr 2015, 08:08
  #38 (permalink)  
 
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I am well aware that Andy does not operate flogged out old aircraft. I didn't say he did. However in order to meet the minimums of decent operators, that is the type of crap people have to survive on.

Anyone that thinks I still suckle on my parents teat has not read any of my previous posts. Besides how hard is it to hit a delete button? I will return to my rock now lest I draw the wrath of further strangers on the Internet.
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Old 11th Apr 2015, 08:23
  #39 (permalink)  
 
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You certainly didn't draw my wrath 50 50, I loved your post and realised straight away your point. I got it, others didn't. No need to return to the rock!
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Old 11th Apr 2015, 08:42
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Thing is 50 50, you and your buddy's should have done the research before you spent the coin on a pilot's licence. There's only one group of people that can change pilot remuneration. There's an award, an employer must pay the award. If they're allowed to get away with not paying the award who's responsible? I'm guessing it's whomever's flying 'clapped out C182's' on their way up the greasy pole.
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