How many is too many
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How many is too many
Had 11 aircraft in the circuit area in YBLT a couple of days ago. Got me thinking how much more traffic would warrant a unicom/ tower. It was quite scary from the ground not to mention the amount of chat. This is quite alot for here but not unusual for 6 or 7 at once. Also concerning the international students, the communication factors throws in another curve ball.
Last edited by Mick.B; 11th Jul 2013 at 12:05.
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11 is certainly up at the higher end of the scale!
Moorabbin gets that many occasionally but across contra circuits. I've seen 10 on final across the two runways at Moorabbin but the only time I've see more in the circuit at once was at Narromine for Natfly.
I'd say Oshkosh or similar would get busier but that would be better as they would either all be coming or going versus doing circuits.
There should be a line drawn in theory somewhere, but hard to know where exactly.
Moorabbin gets that many occasionally but across contra circuits. I've seen 10 on final across the two runways at Moorabbin but the only time I've see more in the circuit at once was at Narromine for Natfly.
I'd say Oshkosh or similar would get busier but that would be better as they would either all be coming or going versus doing circuits.
There should be a line drawn in theory somewhere, but hard to know where exactly.
Last edited by VH-XXX; 11th Jul 2013 at 12:31.
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I don't remember the number, but there was a limit to how many aircraft could be flying night circuits at Parafield. There would be a que of aircraft waiting for their turn.
It wasn't uncommon on a Sunday to have around 10 or so aircraft in the circuit using multiple runways at my old stomping ground.
It wasn't uncommon on a Sunday to have around 10 or so aircraft in the circuit using multiple runways at my old stomping ground.
Any more than about 6 is getting risky in my view.
The chances of someone extending downwind, coming in on a long final and then having someone else turning a normal base and descending on top of them is the thing which worries me most.
The chances of someone extending downwind, coming in on a long final and then having someone else turning a normal base and descending on top of them is the thing which worries me most.
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The chances of someone extending downwind, coming in on a long final and then having someone else turning a normal base and descending on top of them is the thing which worries me most.
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Weve had a couple of close calls in the past 2 years. Unfortunatly I think it is a real possibility there is going to be a prang in the not too distant future unless something is looked at. There were numerours go arounds, also there was two incidents of guys cutting in on base due to extended downwind legs.
Last edited by Mick.B; 13th Jul 2013 at 06:15.
That would have to be the most common occurrence of poor circuit etiquette based on my experience, even without the guy coming in on the long final
As I tell my students, nobody ever complains if you turn (base) early!
And don't fly bloody 747 circuits in light aircraft. Keep it tight - you'll get 12 circuits done in an hour instead of 7.
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Is that per runway Sunny or for both? Is that their night limit too or is it less than that? (Probably answered my own question there as only one runway is in use at night)
They are more than capable of handling more than 4 per runway and I've seen it many times there.
They are more than capable of handling more than 4 per runway and I've seen it many times there.
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Depends on your view of 'in the circuit area'
11 doing circuits is certainly over the top. But if 8 of those are a group that have arrived and are all planning full stops, it shouldn't be too much of an issue.
11 doing circuits is certainly over the top. But if 8 of those are a group that have arrived and are all planning full stops, it shouldn't be too much of an issue.
I thought ymmb put a limit of 6 in the pattern of any one runway following that midair that killed a student a few years back. Perhaps it was just a recommendation from the atsb that got ignored?
Edit: after some reading I think this might have just been an interim measure until class D happened.
Edit: after some reading I think this might have just been an interim measure until class D happened.
Last edited by evilducky; 13th Jul 2013 at 14:38.
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It's not just the numbers, it's also the mix of types in the circuit. Last week at YBTH we had gliders, Jabiru's, PA28's, B76's, C150's, C172's an L39 and a SF340 in the circuit. Keeps you on your toes.
No wonder I have a sore neck.....
No wonder I have a sore neck.....
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load of bollocks wally.
what happens as the number of aircraft increase is that the circuit expands out a little and guys fly head to tail more.
you NEVER fly closer to the runway than the guy in front or you will be through his door on the next turn.
it turns out to be really bloody simple and safe as houses.
P.S I wouldnt try this at a towered airstrip because you are totally limited by the controller.
what happens as the number of aircraft increase is that the circuit expands out a little and guys fly head to tail more.
you NEVER fly closer to the runway than the guy in front or you will be through his door on the next turn.
it turns out to be really bloody simple and safe as houses.
P.S I wouldnt try this at a towered airstrip because you are totally limited by the controller.
Last edited by dubbleyew eight; 14th Jul 2013 at 15:42.