Plane missing en route YCAB?
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As we flew the Arbey Star to runway 34 in Melbourne on Thursday I commented on the amazing green countryside. I seems that even after countless times following the magenta line to Laverton I can still find something on the ground that I can't recall seeing before. As we swung into the home straight and met the bumps from the 30 knot northerly I commented that if I ever get bored from watching the ground go by from the window of an aeroplane I will know that it is time to retire. It was not until we got back to Brisbane a few hours later that I learned that one of my work colleagues was on the flight that is the subject of this thread.
I didn't know Jan well even though I saw her regularly. She was often the cheerful person who met us at the boarding gate with our flight plan in hand as we arrived with our morning coffee. We would exchange pleasantries and as we were of similar vintage I found it easy to chat with her. But time was allways limited by OTP considerations. And then hers would be the happy smile and cheery wave that sent us on our way as we pushed back from the aerobridge.
Many have shared their experiences on this forum. We all have memories of incidents which, even after many years, can spring to mind with a terrifying clarity that can still make us shiver. Mostly we will have memories of a few such incidents because as humans we are not very good at learning from our mistakes. We wonder how we survived when others did not. Perhaps we followed a bad decision by making a good decision and extricating ourselves from a crisis of our own making. Perhaps it was just blind luck. My mother, a woman of prayer, would say that God was looking after us. Generally our families will never know how close they came to experiencing the gut wrenching grief that the families of these three couples are feeling. Our thoughts are with them.
I did not know Des at all. Yet those who did know him have indicated that this was not a pilot who was a risk taker or who lacked experience flying in the VFR environment to which he was accustomed. Perhaps he simply succumbed to a human frailty which afflicts all of us from time to time. He made a mistake.
I will think of Jan when someone else waves me a cheery goodbye as we push off the bay. And even though I did not know her well, I will miss her.
May they rest in peace.
I didn't know Jan well even though I saw her regularly. She was often the cheerful person who met us at the boarding gate with our flight plan in hand as we arrived with our morning coffee. We would exchange pleasantries and as we were of similar vintage I found it easy to chat with her. But time was allways limited by OTP considerations. And then hers would be the happy smile and cheery wave that sent us on our way as we pushed back from the aerobridge.
Many have shared their experiences on this forum. We all have memories of incidents which, even after many years, can spring to mind with a terrifying clarity that can still make us shiver. Mostly we will have memories of a few such incidents because as humans we are not very good at learning from our mistakes. We wonder how we survived when others did not. Perhaps we followed a bad decision by making a good decision and extricating ourselves from a crisis of our own making. Perhaps it was just blind luck. My mother, a woman of prayer, would say that God was looking after us. Generally our families will never know how close they came to experiencing the gut wrenching grief that the families of these three couples are feeling. Our thoughts are with them.
I did not know Des at all. Yet those who did know him have indicated that this was not a pilot who was a risk taker or who lacked experience flying in the VFR environment to which he was accustomed. Perhaps he simply succumbed to a human frailty which afflicts all of us from time to time. He made a mistake.
I will think of Jan when someone else waves me a cheery goodbye as we push off the bay. And even though I did not know her well, I will miss her.
May they rest in peace.
Last edited by Vis 10k Plus; 6th Oct 2012 at 07:15. Reason: Clarity
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Thanks Ren
It only takes one bad decision in either of our worlds (ATC & pilot) to make things go wrong quickly & sometimes luck Isnt with us. And it doesn't matter whether one has little or a lot of experience, it happens to all of us at some time.
With mine it was just luck we were at roughly the same angle as the slope (so we didn't hit nose first) & the pilot didn't have time to try an evasive turn or we would've hit wingtip first & cartwheeled.
I've always said if my mistakes highlight it & stop it happening to just one other person, it's worth it.
I think someone else posted this comment but it is true:
"here by the grace of god go I"
It only takes one bad decision in either of our worlds (ATC & pilot) to make things go wrong quickly & sometimes luck Isnt with us. And it doesn't matter whether one has little or a lot of experience, it happens to all of us at some time.
With mine it was just luck we were at roughly the same angle as the slope (so we didn't hit nose first) & the pilot didn't have time to try an evasive turn or we would've hit wingtip first & cartwheeled.
I've always said if my mistakes highlight it & stop it happening to just one other person, it's worth it.
I think someone else posted this comment but it is true:
"here by the grace of god go I"
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My heart goes out to the families and friends (and the person that took that call if indeed that's what happened
A picorial tribute to Des
This is a small collection of photographs which will hopefully convey what a popular and integral part Des was of the SE Qld vintage scene. I apologise for the variable quality.
“Barnstormers over Brisbane’, the Tiger Moth’s 75th/ Chipmunk’s 60th birthday flypast, August 2006:
Ah, (maroon) de Havillands! Caboolture Air Show, May 2004:
The Bridal Party (with escorts) on their way to the Bolsover Wedding at Archerfield, November 2006:
At the Antique Aircraft Association Fly-in, Narrandera April 2006:
Remind you of a mother duck & her ducklings? Caboolture, 2010.
We will miss him!
“Barnstormers over Brisbane’, the Tiger Moth’s 75th/ Chipmunk’s 60th birthday flypast, August 2006:
Ah, (maroon) de Havillands! Caboolture Air Show, May 2004:
The Bridal Party (with escorts) on their way to the Bolsover Wedding at Archerfield, November 2006:
At the Antique Aircraft Association Fly-in, Narrandera April 2006:
Remind you of a mother duck & her ducklings? Caboolture, 2010.
We will miss him!
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Great pictures: Curious now – "RIAMA" could someone please explain the significance.
Another, more modern expression – "there's them as done it; and, them as is gunna".
Addendum -
The story that is widely circulated is that the phrase was first spoken by the English evangelical preacher and martyr, John Bradford (circa 1510–1555). He is said to have uttered the variant of the expression - "There but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford", when seeing criminals being led to the scaffold.
The story that is widely circulated is that the phrase was first spoken by the English evangelical preacher and martyr, John Bradford (circa 1510–1555). He is said to have uttered the variant of the expression - "There but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford", when seeing criminals being led to the scaffold.
Last edited by Kharon; 6th Oct 2012 at 20:29.
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Always a favourite to photo, even to those of us who didn't know the pilot/owner personaly.
Watts Bridge Fly-In a couple of years ago.
Watts Bridge Fly-In a couple of years ago.
Last edited by frigatebird; 6th Oct 2012 at 20:42.
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That was a great post Vis 10k Plus; it's always good to hear about people that have passed in an accident like this so they're not just a statistic. You brought some detail to the story that makes it all the more apparent what special responsibilities we're entrusted with as pilots
I just heard an interview with Des from a few years ago when he had the Dragon down here at Bankstown on Macca's Australia all Over radio program on the ABC. He talked about how the aircraft type had a history of accidents because it was such a workhorse often flown close to weight limits and on the edge of its performance capabilities. He was explaining how he'd had more powerful engines and better props fitted and how it now took less pax to stay well within limits. Finished with him talking about the importance of ensuring it was safe for his longevity too.
It was sad to hear him speaking so passionately but I was glad to have heard it too. I'll email Macca at the ABC to see if they can put that interview up as a podcast link so everyone here can hear it.
Thanks for the great photos frigatebird and Dora.
Ren
I just heard an interview with Des from a few years ago when he had the Dragon down here at Bankstown on Macca's Australia all Over radio program on the ABC. He talked about how the aircraft type had a history of accidents because it was such a workhorse often flown close to weight limits and on the edge of its performance capabilities. He was explaining how he'd had more powerful engines and better props fitted and how it now took less pax to stay well within limits. Finished with him talking about the importance of ensuring it was safe for his longevity too.
It was sad to hear him speaking so passionately but I was glad to have heard it too. I'll email Macca at the ABC to see if they can put that interview up as a podcast link so everyone here can hear it.
Thanks for the great photos frigatebird and Dora.
Ren
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You'll find an answer here, Kharon. 2012 De Havilland Dragon crash - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The stories of inadvertent VFR to VMC are interesting, I think most private pilots have had some sort of encounter. Most of these incidents developed quickly. I think an important aspect of this accident was that the pilot consciously chose to take his chances in IMC. Reports are that the aircraft circled for about 30 mins, then climbed into the cloud base. Whilst there is fuel remaining, continued holding gives a few advantages, eg the wx may improve sufficiently, assistance may arrive, additional advice could be forthcoming. By deciding to climb into cloud, the pilot is gambling that he might make it, but the stakes are huge. A forced landing into wind in this aircraft would have the GS back to probably 40 knots, giving a good chance of survival. We should always remember the huge responsibility we take on when we strap someone into our aircraft, and it's good to keep in the back of our minds, when it turns nasty, the insurance company takes over the ownership.
Kharon
RIAMA derives from the name of a friend of Ron Adair who founded Aircrafts Pty Ltd. His friend's name was Allan Mair. Mair spelled backwards is RIAM plus his initial A and you get RIAMA.
RIP Des and his friends
RIAMA derives from the name of a friend of Ron Adair who founded Aircrafts Pty Ltd. His friend's name was Allan Mair. Mair spelled backwards is RIAM plus his initial A and you get RIAMA.
RIP Des and his friends
RIAMA was probably also chosen because it ties in with all those Holyman and ANA aircraft with names such as KYEEMA and PENGANA and BUNGANA. There were about thirty such names given to the fleet over the years.
Aircrafts Pty Ltd, founded by RJS Adair in 1928, commenced a Brisbane - Toowoomba service the following year, then extended it's services through southern Queensland and northern NSW, till in 1949 the company morphed into Queensland Airlines Pty Ltd. Fleet lists show that Aircrafts Pty Ltd had two DH84s that had been named in like fashion, RIADA and RIAMA. The name reversals are obvious in both cases.
ps Just love the picture on the beach Trent, and the two gels dressed so summery.
[QUOTE]
[/QUOTE]
Oh . . . so what enables you to reconstruct the flight with insight into what conscious thoughts occupied the pilot's mind between take-off and crash site?
And what have I and many others been doing wrong all these years, failing to grasp what makes "inadvertent VFR to VMC" so hazardous?
Aircrafts Pty Ltd, founded by RJS Adair in 1928, commenced a Brisbane - Toowoomba service the following year, then extended it's services through southern Queensland and northern NSW, till in 1949 the company morphed into Queensland Airlines Pty Ltd. Fleet lists show that Aircrafts Pty Ltd had two DH84s that had been named in like fashion, RIADA and RIAMA. The name reversals are obvious in both cases.
ps Just love the picture on the beach Trent, and the two gels dressed so summery.
[QUOTE]
The stories of inadvertent VFR to VMC are interesting. I think most private pilots have had some sort of encounter.
I think an important aspect of this accident was that the pilot consciously chose to take his chances in IMC.
And what have I and many others been doing wrong all these years, failing to grasp what makes "inadvertent VFR to VMC" so hazardous?
Last edited by Fantome; 8th Oct 2012 at 06:07.
Does anyone know where the rest of these aircraft are in the world
Wings Over New Zealand - Dragon flight to the Mosquito Show
and one in the UK (G-ECAN):
Dragon
Any others?
I vaguely recall a Rapid in the back of an old hangar at MB many years ago owned I think by Maurice Rolfe whom was restoring it, gee I hope it was a rapid,am old but I don't wanna say too old just yet
. I used to work with Maurice back in the 70's but something comes to mind about a Rapid.
There's a whole other debate on inadvertent IMC flight by VFR drivers so perhaps this thread isn't the place right now for such a discussion as am sure there are many still dumbfounded by this sad event IMC or no IMC.
Wmk2
. I used to work with Maurice back in the 70's but something comes to mind about a Rapid.There's a whole other debate on inadvertent IMC flight by VFR drivers so perhaps this thread isn't the place right now for such a discussion as am sure there are many still dumbfounded by this sad event IMC or no IMC.
Wmk2
Last edited by Wally Mk2; 8th Oct 2012 at 07:48.
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Quote:
gee I hope it was a rapid,am old but I don't wanna say too old just yet.
Psssst, Wally!
"Rapide"!
You forgot the "e"!
He didn't forget the E, he put it in hangar. (hangAr)
gee I hope it was a rapid,am old but I don't wanna say too old just yet.
Psssst, Wally!
"Rapide"!
You forgot the "e"!
He didn't forget the E, he put it in hangar. (hangAr)
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I vaguely recall a Rapid in the back of an old hangar at MB many years ago owned I think by Maurice Rolfe whom was restoring it, gee I hope it was a rapid