Celebrate the professional pilot - time for bit of positivity
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Celebrate the professional pilot - time for bit of positivity
As I have said on another thread it is time we celebrated those that drew a line in the sand and didn't crack under duress from operators.
Please feel free to add your tale and hopefully give those new to the profession something to aspire to.
Please feel free to add your tale and hopefully give those new to the profession something to aspire to.
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The results thus far
Hmmmm. Over an hour on the forum and over 100 views but not one response applauding a pilot that stood up to duress from an operator.
Is it really that bad out there? Or is this sort of behavior solely the domain of the RPT pilot?
OK, lets try a different tack. How about applauding the GA operator that doesn't coerce their people to cut corners or bend the rules past breaking.
Waiting, waiting..........
Is it really that bad out there? Or is this sort of behavior solely the domain of the RPT pilot?
OK, lets try a different tack. How about applauding the GA operator that doesn't coerce their people to cut corners or bend the rules past breaking.
Waiting, waiting..........
Last edited by flying-spike; 25th Aug 2012 at 02:32.
I think you'll be waiting a while.....
How about applauding the GA operator that doesn't coerce their people to cut corners or bend the rules past breaking.
Actually, I think this thread is an awesome idea.
I do know of many pilots and several organisations who genuinely do their best (and the right thing for the team as a whole), and would love to post details here and honour their standard.
However, out of respect, I would not do so because I don't want to put them up as targets for some of the characters that frequent his site - keyboard warriors hiding in anonymity.
Great idea, though - would work well in a perfect world!
I do know of many pilots and several organisations who genuinely do their best (and the right thing for the team as a whole), and would love to post details here and honour their standard.
However, out of respect, I would not do so because I don't want to put them up as targets for some of the characters that frequent his site - keyboard warriors hiding in anonymity.
Great idea, though - would work well in a perfect world!
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Exactly
One brave soul who at least admitted he was under duress and a couple of others that, probably due to their own guilty consciences, say it is stupid and "negative". They are probably too embarrassed by having to face the mirror.
I almost thought I would elicit a "Whatever".
I was going to suggest to the mods that a point had been made and that the thread should be closed. Flying Bear has convinced me to hold back for at least a while in the hope that we would get past the sniping and negativity and get some more worthwhile contributions. Mods, the call is ultimately yours of course but I would like to see this stay up for a while and possibly put it up or link to it on the RPT side. Your thoughts.
This might be a bit of a "litmus test" and I hope it doesn't indicate more "acid".
I almost thought I would elicit a "Whatever".
I was going to suggest to the mods that a point had been made and that the thread should be closed. Flying Bear has convinced me to hold back for at least a while in the hope that we would get past the sniping and negativity and get some more worthwhile contributions. Mods, the call is ultimately yours of course but I would like to see this stay up for a while and possibly put it up or link to it on the RPT side. Your thoughts.
This might be a bit of a "litmus test" and I hope it doesn't indicate more "acid".
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Totally subjective topic that probably won't go anywhere.
More like another opportunity for the whingers to pervade this forum with biased negativity.
The fault is not always the operator, nor is it always the pilot.
If your employer operator told you to "breach last light or pay for your own motel" any self respecting pilot would have left the aircraft right where it was and caught the next bus home! 
time for bit of positivity
The fault is not always the operator, nor is it always the pilot.
I'm told to run the risk of breaching last light or pay for my own motel.
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Not totally wasted.
It could be opened up to ask why, so often, it is the pilot stuck in the middle of nowhere acting as the last line of defence. For example:
The last light mutt. Before things got to the 'chancy' stage, look at the choices available not just to the pilot. As the 'last line' of defence the mutt has two options and no choices: bust last light or spend a night somewhere else. Several questions there.
Who selected, scheduled and approved a non night rated pilot and/or aircraft on a job where there was a possibility of the service going over 'time' or, camping out. This is an operational control problem, not the mutts.
Same same for 'over weight', ops accept a job at a quoted price. Is the proposed service analysed for weight, payload, seasonal conditions, CFIT, pilot experience, aircraft suitability, OEI performance, etc. etc. No, then the mutt at the wheel is way out on limb. It's way too late at 05 dark o'clock to start sorting out the 6 passengers instead of 5 and the extra 80 Kg of gear, the alternate and no fuel at Kickinatinalong.
If operational control is not exercised when a job is contracted and the mutt is going to carry the can, this gets worse; especially when the mutt knows if it all turns to worms and stuffs up, the only thing waiting will be a DCM and perhaps a 'sit down' with the forces of darkness.
In GA the pressure on 'juniors' is not an excuse for the 'seniors' to shrug and count the days until a big shiny jet turns up. This is termed a 'normalised deficiency'. Easy to stop, stick together, all say no and if that don't work. Scream for the grown ups. Easy to sack one mutt, really hard to loose the whole circus.
Just my Sunday - $AUD 00.20
The last light mutt. Before things got to the 'chancy' stage, look at the choices available not just to the pilot. As the 'last line' of defence the mutt has two options and no choices: bust last light or spend a night somewhere else. Several questions there.
Who selected, scheduled and approved a non night rated pilot and/or aircraft on a job where there was a possibility of the service going over 'time' or, camping out. This is an operational control problem, not the mutts.
Same same for 'over weight', ops accept a job at a quoted price. Is the proposed service analysed for weight, payload, seasonal conditions, CFIT, pilot experience, aircraft suitability, OEI performance, etc. etc. No, then the mutt at the wheel is way out on limb. It's way too late at 05 dark o'clock to start sorting out the 6 passengers instead of 5 and the extra 80 Kg of gear, the alternate and no fuel at Kickinatinalong.
If operational control is not exercised when a job is contracted and the mutt is going to carry the can, this gets worse; especially when the mutt knows if it all turns to worms and stuffs up, the only thing waiting will be a DCM and perhaps a 'sit down' with the forces of darkness.
In GA the pressure on 'juniors' is not an excuse for the 'seniors' to shrug and count the days until a big shiny jet turns up. This is termed a 'normalised deficiency'. Easy to stop, stick together, all say no and if that don't work. Scream for the grown ups. Easy to sack one mutt, really hard to loose the whole circus.
Just my Sunday - $AUD 00.20
Last edited by Kharon; 26th Aug 2012 at 02:29.
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Worth more
It is worth well more than the $0.20 Kharon. No need to be shy guys and girls. No names, no pack drill.
Last edited by flying-spike; 26th Aug 2012 at 02:39.
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Exactly, how often does this happen????
I used to work on a 'HARD Departure Time', and, made it VERY clear to the client(s) that, IF we were NOT airborne and 'on the way' by the 'Hard dep. time', then it was 'no go'.
They seemed to get the point OK, and it never actually happened to me.
Smiles all round.....
They seemed to get the point OK, and it never actually happened to me.
Smiles all round.....
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A chilling reminder
I had the exact issue arise when I was chief pilot long ago.
Briefed the pilot, a nice young bloke, "be off the ground so that you get back a half hour before last light". Being a nice bloke, too nice to convince the pax they had to leave on time, he left late, flew NGT VFR in an aircraft that wasn't, in a designated remote area, to another town, no SAR, no details with his pax on board. He rang me to tell me that he he had decided to stay put. As it was well after last light I rang his girlfriend to tell her he was still "A" and staying overnight, she said, no he had just got to "B". When he returned the next day I told him that I knew what happened. I told him if he had done as he had told me that was forgivable but I couldn't forgive the lie and the infringements. The aerodrome operator at (b) had advised the regulator about the suspicious arrival and they also called me but left matter with me telling me if they weren't happy with the result then they would prosecute.I had to let him go.
I gave him a reference and told him that if anybody asked I would say that he left to do his ATPL subjects.
He left and made his way into a very large airline, semi-retired and started his own Ag business and tragically, keeping his last customer happy, he again flew outside his capability and was killed. He was one of the nicest blokes I had ever met and not long before he was killed we caught up and he thanked me for "pulling his head out of his bum". Sometimes there is no guide on where to draw the line but you have to draw it just the same.
Briefed the pilot, a nice young bloke, "be off the ground so that you get back a half hour before last light". Being a nice bloke, too nice to convince the pax they had to leave on time, he left late, flew NGT VFR in an aircraft that wasn't, in a designated remote area, to another town, no SAR, no details with his pax on board. He rang me to tell me that he he had decided to stay put. As it was well after last light I rang his girlfriend to tell her he was still "A" and staying overnight, she said, no he had just got to "B". When he returned the next day I told him that I knew what happened. I told him if he had done as he had told me that was forgivable but I couldn't forgive the lie and the infringements. The aerodrome operator at (b) had advised the regulator about the suspicious arrival and they also called me but left matter with me telling me if they weren't happy with the result then they would prosecute.I had to let him go.
I gave him a reference and told him that if anybody asked I would say that he left to do his ATPL subjects.
He left and made his way into a very large airline, semi-retired and started his own Ag business and tragically, keeping his last customer happy, he again flew outside his capability and was killed. He was one of the nicest blokes I had ever met and not long before he was killed we caught up and he thanked me for "pulling his head out of his bum". Sometimes there is no guide on where to draw the line but you have to draw it just the same.
Last edited by flying-spike; 26th Aug 2012 at 21:23.