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Consistently smooth landings C210

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Consistently smooth landings C210

Old 14th Jul 2012, 04:17
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Consistently smooth landings C210

I have not flown a Cessna since the beginning of my flying training and am now in my first GA job flying the C210. I have completed around 25hrs ICUS on it and have all the general flying aspects down but am still getting inconsistent landings. Does anyone have any tips or tricks for getting it down smoothly, eg speeds, raising chair height, when to flare etc? I know there have been other threads on the 210 but they don't really have what I'm after.
Cheers.
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Old 14th Jul 2012, 06:38
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Even something basic like looking down the end of the runway in the flare.
I'd bet $100 that will fix your problems. You could be looking just a little ahead of the aircraft at the moment, not further down the runway, and therefore are having problems judging sink or drift.
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Old 14th Jul 2012, 07:37
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Don't be afraid to keep just a bit of power on with it, depending on the length of the runway you're landing on of course. Remember that the singles you learnt to fly in were probably a lot lighter and lot floatier than the 210, so having idle power worked. Kinda like getting used to flying a Twin, its heavier, sometimes needs just a tiny amount of power left on until touch down to make it work!
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Old 14th Jul 2012, 07:56
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On thursday i flew to leicester in a 152 i hadnt flown for a month due to weather and looked just ahead of nose..... Not a good landing in my opinion.....

I realised my error and on the way back looked at end of runway and shock horror a picture perfect landing... Shame there was no one there to see it... In leicester however.....!!
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Old 14th Jul 2012, 08:31
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25 ICUS, If the supervising pilot was happy with you, you must be ok. Just enjoy the flying.
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Old 14th Jul 2012, 10:23
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The bet thing you can do for yourself is forget some of the dribble you read on here.

Land with power on, what crap!

Last edited by RENURPP; 14th Jul 2012 at 10:24.
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Old 14th Jul 2012, 10:27
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The bet thing you can do for yourself
Is proof read.
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Old 14th Jul 2012, 10:38
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Enjoy the c210. It's an aircraft that demands respect and finesse to fly it really well.

I remember after 50 hours on type thinking what a nice machine it was and how it was easy to fly.

Fast fwd 6 months and 500 hours on type and thinking how really nice it was and how sloppily I flew it 6 months previously.
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Old 14th Jul 2012, 10:46
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When I did my C210 convex I was taught to go 'click-click' backwards trim on the electrical trimmer on short final / just before closing the throttle so that I have to keep a slight positive pressure on the yoke to maintain the descent path. It avoids having to compensate for the 'nose drop' when you close the throttle. Closing the power removes the nose up pitch and the aircraft is now trimmed for the S&L portion of the flare.

All you need to do then is to look at the end of the RWY and hold it off and wait for the main wheels to touchdown first (slight backward pressure on the yoke)

It works well for the female pilots that is not always physically that strong. I have recommended it even to some open minded male pilots as well with great success.

Word of caution though: Click the trimmer only once you are asured of landing as you will have a very strong nose-up pitch in the go-around requiring lots of fwd push on the yoke. Be aware that a loss of attention (e.g. reading the checklist, radio work, etc, your natural reaction is to relax the fwd pressure an it may lead to stalling the aircraft! So, do the 'click-click on the auto-trimmer as late as possible before reducing the power for the flare.

Some heavy jets also have a load relief auto trimer that is active until 500ft AGL (radio alt) and you will be unable to fly with fwd pressure on the stick.

Flew all my landings like that, even on heavy jets, and almost always ended with a smooth landing.
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Old 14th Jul 2012, 11:00
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I was recently told about trimming it a little nose up late final, has improved my landings in the 210. Also I tend to fly it like a twin with having a little power on until just before touch down, I find it works well.

I know when my landings start getting sloppy its because Im looking ahead of the nose, not at the end of the runway.

I have just over 220 hours on type on find I still find ways to handle it better almost every day, great machine!
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Old 14th Jul 2012, 11:16
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Landing with power on...... Yeah, if you're keen to have an overrun one day.

That's not how Mr Cessna intended for his aircraft to be operated, so don't!!

Nail that Vref speed (1.3 Vs) and then flare just at the right time, you should be achieving good landings, regardless of the aircraft type.

morno
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Old 14th Jul 2012, 11:33
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A couple of winds back on the trim short final (once landing assured) always worked for me, just to help with the flare, especially when the aircraft had a forward CoG. As others have said, Vref speed over the fence, eyes to the end of the runway and power off. If you are heavy, trickle the power off, being mindful of your sink rate, but always land with power at idle. The aircraft (like any other) needs to be flown by you.
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Old 14th Jul 2012, 12:02
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There seems to be a variance in opinion on this one, my opinion for what its worth is, fly the thing to the flare, FLARE....and hold it hold it HOLD the attitude...whilst reducing the power to idle=nice accurate landing.
Remember your aiming point and plan backwards accordingly, the C210 will float for a verrrrrrrrrry longtime if you keep the power on.
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Old 14th Jul 2012, 12:11
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Nail that Vref speed (1.3 Vs) and then flare just at the right time, you should be achieving good landings, regardless of the aircraft type.
Unfortunately its just not that simple for some people. The few walls of text on how to land a 210 shows it.
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Old 14th Jul 2012, 12:22
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Why isn't it that simple? It's the basics of flying.
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Old 14th Jul 2012, 12:48
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Ixixly
*
Don't be afraid to keep just a bit of power on with it, depending on the length of the runway you're landing on of course.

Kinda like getting used to flying a Twin, its heavier, sometimes needs just a tiny amount of power left on until touch down to make it work!
What complete and utter bullshit!
Nothing personal here, but if you can't learn how to land an aircraft without power, how the hell are you gonna put it in on a short strip when the distance matters?

As for flying a twin, I don't fly any twin, piston or turbine, with power on at touchdown. It might be there until you round out, but if you aren't feeling the aircraft, you just need a bit more experience. there's no magic "this is how you get perfect landings".

Slam's suggestion of eyes down the runway is one of the better ones, but ask your CP if you're really worried, not a frickin internet bulletin board! At least he/she can fly with you and offer some constructive advice based on what they see.
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Old 14th Jul 2012, 12:59
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In 6 months time you'll ask yourself why you even started this thread.

Practice makes perfect. Learn to self critique. You'll be fine mate, greasers are on the horizon, but remember, a solid touchdown in the zone is far better than a greaser half way down.
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Old 14th Jul 2012, 13:01
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I wouldn't listen to most of what's on here. Don't wind in trim and don't land the thing with power on. If you avoid getting the basics right by doing these things then one day you might be landing on a short slippery strip with a gusty 20kt crosswind that decides to go quartering tail and it'll end up ugly.
Just keep practicing. Looking down to the end of the strip is good advice.
I bet if you do that by the time you have 100hrs on it (not much really) you will be as good as wood.
Also, those home made techniques won't transfer to bigger faster cleaner aircraft and that means you'll have to learn the basics when you are transferring onto a machine that won't tolerate errors of judgement as well as the 210. That's the last thing you want to be concentrating on when starting a new job.
If I were in your shoes ( and I was ten years ago) I would decide to re assess at 100 hours. Why don't you come back on this thread at 100hours and tell us how you are going, I bet you'll be fine. Good luck and don't fly through any thunderstorms between now and then (that was my biggest mistake!)
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Old 14th Jul 2012, 13:04
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Ah I see Strim and makeithappencaptain have beaten me to it.....listen to them not the other rubbish

Last edited by framer; 14th Jul 2012 at 13:05.
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Old 14th Jul 2012, 21:11
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Nirak:

I can't help but aggreeing with the innumerable posters who have disagreed with yours!

Did you really use the trim to assist in the flare in "a heavy jet"??? This would suggest (to me) either shoddy standards or that a Checker never caught you doing this.

And:

Some heavy jets also have a load relief auto trimer that is active until 500ft AGL (radio alt) and you will be unable to fly with fwd pressure on the stick.
Which heavy jet? I flew the heaviest civil one of them all (at least until the advent of the A380) and I don't recall an load relief auto trimmer - but it was a long time ago (getting my defence in early here)...
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