Good ol ATPL Performance & Loading
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Good ol ATPL Performance & Loading
Lads, about to sit the above exam, can anyone give me some insight as to the types of Q's they ask?
I'm on a time restriction so any advice would me much appreciated.
Thanks in advance
rocket,
I'm on a time restriction so any advice would me much appreciated.
Thanks in advance
rocket,
RTFQ - I had a 5 marker that had a massive spiel about a flight some Sydney to bali, planning for PNR, 1-INOP with this weather and that load blah blah blah and then noticed that all the question was asking was for a max takeoff weight!!!
I spent several minutes noting down details and setting out my form that could have been spent on another question. Luckily, I passed it first go!
I spent several minutes noting down details and setting out my form that could have been spent on another question. Luckily, I passed it first go!
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Like any exam with lots of questions worth small values - first off figure minutes/mark then run up a schedule of time to leave each question and go onto the next. If you end up saving some time and, at the end you can, go back and finish off any questions you hadn't completed.
There is no point getting one question (worth, say, 5%) totally correct if that comes at a cost of not attempting any others.
Reminds me of my first go at SCPL exams in the 60s .. read up the books in the ANO, never heard of past papers' being available ... rolled up to the exam .. and noted that none of the questions had anything to do with the recommended text books.
Guess I might have scored a mark or two for spelling my name correctly but that was about the extent of it. Next time around, I had a look at past papers as well to get a handle on what they REALLY wanted.
The use of complicated, waffly questions is common and, I suggest, quite valid. It is analogous to all the silly little distractions we get during flight planning in the real world. The need is to cut through the garbage and highlight the important stuff.
Suggest you have a think about doing just that with a highlighter. Read the question very critically and highlight the things which are important. Often that crystallises just what the guts of the question is.
There is no point getting one question (worth, say, 5%) totally correct if that comes at a cost of not attempting any others.
Reminds me of my first go at SCPL exams in the 60s .. read up the books in the ANO, never heard of past papers' being available ... rolled up to the exam .. and noted that none of the questions had anything to do with the recommended text books.
Guess I might have scored a mark or two for spelling my name correctly but that was about the extent of it. Next time around, I had a look at past papers as well to get a handle on what they REALLY wanted.
The use of complicated, waffly questions is common and, I suggest, quite valid. It is analogous to all the silly little distractions we get during flight planning in the real world. The need is to cut through the garbage and highlight the important stuff.
Suggest you have a think about doing just that with a highlighter. Read the question very critically and highlight the things which are important. Often that crystallises just what the guts of the question is.
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Suggest you have a think about doing just that with a highlighter. Read the question very critically and highlight the things which are important.
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Thanks for the info lads it's much appreciated. I run out of time on august so I need to really nail this one first go in order to leave as much time as possible to knock over the worst of all, flight planning.
Practice exams are going well, up In the 90%+ bracket. I had a he'll of a time with navigation but I think that was because I was studying after 10hr days at work and found myself falling asleep at the table trying to get through it. I've now taken some long service leave and have no trouble studying for 8 hrs per day.
Thanks again
rocket
Practice exams are going well, up In the 90%+ bracket. I had a he'll of a time with navigation but I think that was because I was studying after 10hr days at work and found myself falling asleep at the table trying to get through it. I've now taken some long service leave and have no trouble studying for 8 hrs per day.
Thanks again
rocket
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Yes, many people have told me the same thing. If the index unit lines to the next row down are not straight they can manifest themselves and be well and truly off the mark at the end.
I use a pacer pencil which I think should come with a warning. Just this arvo I was feverishly working a trim sheet and dropped the pacer, went to catch it and managed to stab about 15mm of the bastard straight into my left thigh. Thank Christ we have tweezers in the house, got the piece out with a few P's and Q's for pain relief!
I use a pacer pencil which I think should come with a warning. Just this arvo I was feverishly working a trim sheet and dropped the pacer, went to catch it and managed to stab about 15mm of the bastard straight into my left thigh. Thank Christ we have tweezers in the house, got the piece out with a few P's and Q's for pain relief!
G'day Rocket,
Sat this recently.
Had 2 qu requiring complete filling out of the big weight and balance form and several others regarding %mac and stabiliser setting, sometimes only needing to fill out the bottem bit.
Watch for the standard weight vs male/female weight to see which is the least.
Also determine take off weight, from graphs vs climb weight limit.
Several take off distance requirements,etc from the cao and a few aerodynamics.
Found it easier than Nav.
You will be right
Sat this recently.
Had 2 qu requiring complete filling out of the big weight and balance form and several others regarding %mac and stabiliser setting, sometimes only needing to fill out the bottem bit.
Watch for the standard weight vs male/female weight to see which is the least.
Also determine take off weight, from graphs vs climb weight limit.
Several take off distance requirements,etc from the cao and a few aerodynamics.
Found it easier than Nav.
You will be right
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And make sure you bring a tissue to wipe the highlighter off the screen
bugga ... are the ATPLs on PC guesswork these days ? .. guess that shows my age ...
If the index unit lines to the next row down are not straight
keep in mind that the whole trimsheet is drawn against a vertical scale of IU. Generally, when designing and drawing up a sheet, we run what look to be guidelines right down the page - these will usually be the major IU divisions. If the sheet doesn't have that (and that would be unusual) then it probably has some lower guidance IU scale - point is a longer rule can be used to get the vertical correct and then the protractor (ID card, whatever) can be slid along the rule to draw in the droplines.
I haven't seen the current exam sheet but, if anyone can post a scan, I can answer any questions you may have on the construction and hints for easier use.
bugga ... are the ATPLs on PC guesswork these days ? .. guess that shows my age ...
If the index unit lines to the next row down are not straight
keep in mind that the whole trimsheet is drawn against a vertical scale of IU. Generally, when designing and drawing up a sheet, we run what look to be guidelines right down the page - these will usually be the major IU divisions. If the sheet doesn't have that (and that would be unusual) then it probably has some lower guidance IU scale - point is a longer rule can be used to get the vertical correct and then the protractor (ID card, whatever) can be slid along the rule to draw in the droplines.
I haven't seen the current exam sheet but, if anyone can post a scan, I can answer any questions you may have on the construction and hints for easier use.
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I haven't had too much drama with this one and I think it is much easier than Nav. I will however be going over the whole book again, in an abbreviated form, to brush up on the early part of the book.
When you say watch out for standard weights vs male/female weights, do they ask you to perform a trim sheet using both weights (standard and male/female standards) and ask you questions on which is the best performance wise?? Ie the lighter of the two??
My other Q is how long, full time 8hrs a day, would you say is needed for flight planning?? It's the last one I need to do which will finish them all!! Cannot wait for that day!
Rocket
When you say watch out for standard weights vs male/female weights, do they ask you to perform a trim sheet using both weights (standard and male/female standards) and ask you questions on which is the best performance wise?? Ie the lighter of the two??
My other Q is how long, full time 8hrs a day, would you say is needed for flight planning?? It's the last one I need to do which will finish them all!! Cannot wait for that day!
Rocket
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watch out for standard weights
.. and, regardless of standard or actual weights, be careful to adjust the trim divisions as necessary - the divisions give the delta IU for the delta weight nominated against the line which, for standard weights, may be couched in terms of numbers of passengers.
For example, if standard weight is, say, 80kg, then a trim division of, say, 400kg might be specified as 5 passengers rather than 400 kg .. but it's still 400kg regardless of what body weight is used. If the weight of the 5 passengers is, say, 500kg, then you need to trim that load at 1.25 divisions rather than 1 division.
Can be significant if you are using zone loading with a few bodies in the zone.
.. and, regardless of standard or actual weights, be careful to adjust the trim divisions as necessary - the divisions give the delta IU for the delta weight nominated against the line which, for standard weights, may be couched in terms of numbers of passengers.
For example, if standard weight is, say, 80kg, then a trim division of, say, 400kg might be specified as 5 passengers rather than 400 kg .. but it's still 400kg regardless of what body weight is used. If the weight of the 5 passengers is, say, 500kg, then you need to trim that load at 1.25 divisions rather than 1 division.
Can be significant if you are using zone loading with a few bodies in the zone.
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Hope this isn't too late
I did it and passed first go, advice is be VERY careful on the trim sheet questions. dividers are a must in this one! Time isn't such a big factor as the 2 mark questions really arent that hard. If you are getting around the 90% mark on the practice exams I'm sure you'll do fine. Just be careful when using standard weights and make sure your lines are dead straight. an error of even 4mm tends to add up down the trim chart and could result in a different answer so take your time. same goes for take off and landing charts. all the best!
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I did the exam today and got in the mid 90's. As suggested be very carefull with your trim sheets adding up your zone weights and converting the pax into units. I had 2 zones where they were 17.5 and 18.5 trim movements.
Also be carefull in your zone load movements that you get the scale right. I went back and re checked my trim sheet only to have to make an adjustment due to my nerves i think!!
I also got 1x landing weight question. I found the 727 manual graphs to be better quality than the casa provided.
The rest of the exam was a heap of Net and Gross gradient, ballasting x 1, balanced field, V1, V2 and LRC. and a couple of compartment questions.
NOW Back to those beers 1 to go!!
Also be carefull in your zone load movements that you get the scale right. I went back and re checked my trim sheet only to have to make an adjustment due to my nerves i think!!
I also got 1x landing weight question. I found the 727 manual graphs to be better quality than the casa provided.
The rest of the exam was a heap of Net and Gross gradient, ballasting x 1, balanced field, V1, V2 and LRC. and a couple of compartment questions.
NOW Back to those beers 1 to go!!
Last edited by belly tank; 11th May 2011 at 12:48.
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Awesome to hear it doesn't sound too bad. In saying that though I'll be buggered if I'll assume this and make sure bases are covered.
One Q I do have is do they give you a 727 manual or a booklet such as the one in AFTs notes? Also are all the weights the same or do they hit you with new ones just to **** you?
Thankyou for the posts lads, it's very much appreciated.
Rocket
One Q I do have is do they give you a 727 manual or a booklet such as the one in AFTs notes? Also are all the weights the same or do they hit you with new ones just to **** you?
Thankyou for the posts lads, it's very much appreciated.
Rocket
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Hi Rocket,
You will get
one double sided trim sheet (yellow in colour)
Casa loading manual
landing and takeoff graphs (the quality was poor in the graphs i got)
You need your Blue 727 manual and copy of the regs applicable.
Good set of dividers and straight edge and i used a 0.5 clutch pencil
As mentioned i used my Blue 727 book for the graphs as the quality was alot better.
I got 3 trim questions so you can ask for another trim sheet if required.
Just spend alot of time being accurate on your trim sheets it took me 45 mins to do the 2 big ones and i still had over 40 mins to spare when i finnished the exam to go over my trim sheets as they are worth 4 marks or 9% each!.
You will get
one double sided trim sheet (yellow in colour)
Casa loading manual
landing and takeoff graphs (the quality was poor in the graphs i got)
You need your Blue 727 manual and copy of the regs applicable.
Good set of dividers and straight edge and i used a 0.5 clutch pencil
As mentioned i used my Blue 727 book for the graphs as the quality was alot better.
I got 3 trim questions so you can ask for another trim sheet if required.
Just spend alot of time being accurate on your trim sheets it took me 45 mins to do the 2 big ones and i still had over 40 mins to spare when i finnished the exam to go over my trim sheets as they are worth 4 marks or 9% each!.
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Someone (JT?) asked what the trim sheet looks like. The CASA loading manual, including trim sheet, is available here - original is A3 in size.
I had no difficulty with this exam, Flight Planning was much harder for me.
Cheers,
O8
I had no difficulty with this exam, Flight Planning was much harder for me.
Cheers,
O8
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Big day is tomoz, I see in the take off calculations they ask you to subtract the 45mt line up allowance in the front of AFTs text, but in the practice exams at the back of the book no line up allowance is deducted.
Q: should I, or should I not deduct this "45mtr line up allowance"?
Rocket
Q: should I, or should I not deduct this "45mtr line up allowance"?
Rocket
