AAA Charters
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"three single engine aeroplanes and a smart arse owner!! "
fleet of seven, eigth is on the way (a twin)
I have had the pleasure of meeting the CP and found him to be a very pleasent guy. Great sence of humor, and seems like a genuine good bloke. i take the letter as constructive criticism and he seems like he is only trying to help, which is well within his personality type.
but everyones intitled to their opinions. but take it from me who has dealt with AAA, all involved are genuine good people and i would meet up for a beer at the local any day.
fleet of seven, eigth is on the way (a twin)
I have had the pleasure of meeting the CP and found him to be a very pleasent guy. Great sence of humor, and seems like a genuine good bloke. i take the letter as constructive criticism and he seems like he is only trying to help, which is well within his personality type.
but everyones intitled to their opinions. but take it from me who has dealt with AAA, all involved are genuine good people and i would meet up for a beer at the local any day.
fleet of seven, eigth is on the way (a twin)
And does this mean you got the job kiwi?
j3
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No i didnt get the job mate, i was 1 of the many who missed out but have had abit to do with Chief pilot AS & NK
And after reading the feedback in the letter i have edited my CV accordingly.
best of luck to the lucky 2 pilots who did make it though, im sure they will have a great time flying for AAA
And after reading the feedback in the letter i have edited my CV accordingly.
best of luck to the lucky 2 pilots who did make it though, im sure they will have a great time flying for AAA
Look guys, no matter how you took his email.
1. It's rare that you will get an email back from any company at any level unless you're on the short list. I give him 10 points for that and some feedback is even rarer.
2. AAA stay below the radar most of the time and do their thing. It wouldn't be the worst company in the territory to be involved with. At least it is mainly charter. If you get a start now you will get some good wet season experience as it get's pretty wet in those parts.
3. I believe he had the best of intentions in his email and what he said is pretty true. I have seen some resumes from Pilots that (most) are an utter joke.
4. Regardless of the fact he does not have twins, you will get good experience, learn the territory VFR, get wet season time and be in a good position when clicking over the 1000 hour mark to get into a decent multi engine operator. When I was going through the system Skytrans were the ticket, It would seem Hardy Aviation now have this mantle in northern Australia for aspiring Pilots looking for multi engine time..
If it were me starting out and I saw an add like this, I would send him a 1 page resume, with a 1 page letter addressing the selection criteria. I would send it in a bound file by express post (rather than email) and tell him you'll be on the next flight, or in the car the moment you get the call from him.
What I have noticed with a lot of younger blokes these days is they have huge egos and have never worked a day in their life (some never even had after school jobs like we all did in the day). A little bit of life experience does go a long way IMO.
GG
1. It's rare that you will get an email back from any company at any level unless you're on the short list. I give him 10 points for that and some feedback is even rarer.
2. AAA stay below the radar most of the time and do their thing. It wouldn't be the worst company in the territory to be involved with. At least it is mainly charter. If you get a start now you will get some good wet season experience as it get's pretty wet in those parts.
3. I believe he had the best of intentions in his email and what he said is pretty true. I have seen some resumes from Pilots that (most) are an utter joke.
4. Regardless of the fact he does not have twins, you will get good experience, learn the territory VFR, get wet season time and be in a good position when clicking over the 1000 hour mark to get into a decent multi engine operator. When I was going through the system Skytrans were the ticket, It would seem Hardy Aviation now have this mantle in northern Australia for aspiring Pilots looking for multi engine time..
If it were me starting out and I saw an add like this, I would send him a 1 page resume, with a 1 page letter addressing the selection criteria. I would send it in a bound file by express post (rather than email) and tell him you'll be on the next flight, or in the car the moment you get the call from him.
What I have noticed with a lot of younger blokes these days is they have huge egos and have never worked a day in their life (some never even had after school jobs like we all did in the day). A little bit of life experience does go a long way IMO.
GG
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I don't think there was anything in there that you would not find in all the job hunting threads on prune and and those who got the letter should take it on the chin take note and stop snivelling about it on prune the world is a cold hard place.
I have not had much to do with AAA but do know the opperation and are the perfect place for a new cpl holder to be looking for that first job, who cares if they only have a poxy 172 or 206 and no twins once you get the first 1000hr then worry about twins.
Why have they had to advertise for jr pilots in the first place judging by the number of applicants they should have no problem finding pilots surley they have guys knocking on the door every day looking for work. Sadley no, no one can be bothered anymore and want everything handed to them. Wake up everyone its the survival of the fittest and if you not prepaired to put yourself at the top of the food chain then you will get eaten by the guy that is.
I have not had much to do with AAA but do know the opperation and are the perfect place for a new cpl holder to be looking for that first job, who cares if they only have a poxy 172 or 206 and no twins once you get the first 1000hr then worry about twins.
Why have they had to advertise for jr pilots in the first place judging by the number of applicants they should have no problem finding pilots surley they have guys knocking on the door every day looking for work. Sadley no, no one can be bothered anymore and want everything handed to them. Wake up everyone its the survival of the fittest and if you not prepaired to put yourself at the top of the food chain then you will get eaten by the guy that is.
Not quite sure what the issue is here after reading his email......
He is actually giving some basic pointers out to those who want to listen. Better than being told how rubbish you are and the whole 'why would I employ you routine'.
However on saying all that I can't see why he just doesn't make the H endo a condition of employment. Hire the best people then tell them to get the car license. Like airlines do with ratings these days.
He is actually giving some basic pointers out to those who want to listen. Better than being told how rubbish you are and the whole 'why would I employ you routine'.
However on saying all that I can't see why he just doesn't make the H endo a condition of employment. Hire the best people then tell them to get the car license. Like airlines do with ratings these days.
Join Date: Oct 2009
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How about this one..
A mate of mine applied for a job recently advertised on AFAP for tigermothworld, was told he was shortlisted an was sent out a questionnaire he had to fill out. Here it is cut an pasted:
Pilot assessment Form
1. Name: _____________________________
2. Address: ____________________________
____________________________
____________________________
3. Ph: _____________________
Mobile: _____________________
Email __________________________________
4. Height __________ Weight __________
5. Date of Birth ______________
6. Do you smoke? ________ Drink? ________
7. Marital Status - Married / Partner / Single / Divorced / Other
____________________________________________________________ ____
8. Tell us a little about yourself (where you were born, brought up, your family, etc) and what have you done in aviation over the past 12 months.
____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ __________________________________________________
9. What do your mum and dad do and where do they live? ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ __________________________________________________
10. Why did you start flying?
____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ __________________________________________________
11. Did you pay for your flying yourself? ________________________________
How was it funded ________________________________________________
12. Do you think you received good training for dollars spent? Please explain
____________________________________________________________ ____
13. How many instructors did you have during your commercial training? ________
14. How many good instructors did you have? ___________ And, did you get
good, sound briefings on all facets?____________________________________
15. Do you understand Basic Aeronautical Knowledge? ________
16. Are you totally focused on your aviation career? ___________
17. What are your flying skills out of 10? ___________ Hrs to 1st solo? ________
18. Do you have your ATPL subjects. Or, how many? ______________________
19. Do you think you already have the required skill and training to fly for our commercial operation? ____________________________________________
Are you prepared to pay a bond should you require additional training by us to
get you up to speed? _______________________________________________
Over the past decade, we have found that the standards of flying training have dropped dramatically and we have had to provide additional training for many of the pilots we employ before we can clear them to line. This is not the pilots fault – this a failure of CASA’s ability to effectively oversee the training organisation.
20. Do you aspire to be a good stick &rudder / aerobatic / formation pilot and are
you prepared to get yourself endorsed for these when required? ____________________________________________________________ ____
21. Have you ever lived away from home before? ____________
22. Do you have a car? ____________________
23. What are your mechanical skills out of 10? ____________________
24. What are your PR/communication skills out of 10? ____________
25. Are you physically strong? ________________
26. Are you prepared to work at an independent location (eg Apollo Bay)? _______
27. Would you be happy working with Tiger Moth World for at least two years or until you obtain a min. 1000 hours? ________________________________
28. Are you: Self motivated? ______________
Active? ______________
An early riser? ______________
29. Flying is the most exciting thing we do but there are also many other facets to working at Tiger Moth World such as cleaning, maintenance of facilities, customer service, etc. As a result we need people who are happy to work effectively by themselves on these more mundane tasks. Please briefly explain your work ethics below: ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ______________________________
30. What is your main interest outside of flying? ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________
31. What other skills do you have (eg carpentry, mechanic, etc)?
____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ __________________
32. Have you had any previous occupations (if so, what)?
____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ __________________
33. Do you have any previous sales/marketing experience? __________________
34. Where do you see yourself:
in 1 year? _______________________________________________________
in 2 years? ______________________________________________________
in 5 years? ______________________________________________________
35. Are you able to work any days of the week, incl weekends? _______________
36. Do you understand what is happening in the airline industry of Australia and the
world? __________________________________________________________
37. Which airline do you aspire to fly for? (Circle) Virgin Jet Star
Qantas Cathay
REX Other______
Reasons Why? ____________________________________________________
____________________________________________________________ ____
____________________________________________________________ ____
Any other comments
A mate of mine applied for a job recently advertised on AFAP for tigermothworld, was told he was shortlisted an was sent out a questionnaire he had to fill out. Here it is cut an pasted:
Torqair Pty. Ltd. t/as Tiger Moth World Date completed ____________
Please complete in you own handwriting, if you need extra space write on the back.
1. Name: _____________________________
Please
Affix
Current
Photo
Here
2. Address: ____________________________
____________________________
____________________________
3. Ph: _____________________
Mobile: _____________________
Email __________________________________
4. Height __________ Weight __________
5. Date of Birth ______________
6. Do you smoke? ________ Drink? ________
7. Marital Status - Married / Partner / Single / Divorced / Other
____________________________________________________________ ____
8. Tell us a little about yourself (where you were born, brought up, your family, etc) and what have you done in aviation over the past 12 months.
____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ __________________________________________________
9. What do your mum and dad do and where do they live? ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ __________________________________________________
10. Why did you start flying?
____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ __________________________________________________
11. Did you pay for your flying yourself? ________________________________
How was it funded ________________________________________________
12. Do you think you received good training for dollars spent? Please explain
____________________________________________________________ ____
13. How many instructors did you have during your commercial training? ________
14. How many good instructors did you have? ___________ And, did you get
good, sound briefings on all facets?____________________________________
15. Do you understand Basic Aeronautical Knowledge? ________
16. Are you totally focused on your aviation career? ___________
17. What are your flying skills out of 10? ___________ Hrs to 1st solo? ________
18. Do you have your ATPL subjects. Or, how many? ______________________
19. Do you think you already have the required skill and training to fly for our commercial operation? ____________________________________________
Are you prepared to pay a bond should you require additional training by us to
get you up to speed? _______________________________________________
Over the past decade, we have found that the standards of flying training have dropped dramatically and we have had to provide additional training for many of the pilots we employ before we can clear them to line. This is not the pilots fault – this a failure of CASA’s ability to effectively oversee the training organisation.
20. Do you aspire to be a good stick &rudder / aerobatic / formation pilot and are
you prepared to get yourself endorsed for these when required? ____________________________________________________________ ____
21. Have you ever lived away from home before? ____________
22. Do you have a car? ____________________
23. What are your mechanical skills out of 10? ____________________
24. What are your PR/communication skills out of 10? ____________
25. Are you physically strong? ________________
26. Are you prepared to work at an independent location (eg Apollo Bay)? _______
27. Would you be happy working with Tiger Moth World for at least two years or until you obtain a min. 1000 hours? ________________________________
28. Are you: Self motivated? ______________
Active? ______________
An early riser? ______________
29. Flying is the most exciting thing we do but there are also many other facets to working at Tiger Moth World such as cleaning, maintenance of facilities, customer service, etc. As a result we need people who are happy to work effectively by themselves on these more mundane tasks. Please briefly explain your work ethics below: ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ______________________________
30. What is your main interest outside of flying? ____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ ____________________
31. What other skills do you have (eg carpentry, mechanic, etc)?
____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ __________________
32. Have you had any previous occupations (if so, what)?
____________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________ __________________
33. Do you have any previous sales/marketing experience? __________________
34. Where do you see yourself:
in 1 year? _______________________________________________________
in 2 years? ______________________________________________________
in 5 years? ______________________________________________________
35. Are you able to work any days of the week, incl weekends? _______________
36. Do you understand what is happening in the airline industry of Australia and the
world? __________________________________________________________
37. Which airline do you aspire to fly for? (Circle) Virgin Jet Star
Qantas Cathay
REX Other______
Reasons Why? ____________________________________________________
____________________________________________________________ ____
____________________________________________________________ ____
Any other comments
Thanks! Please attach recent photo of yourself!
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If those tips had been posted directly on pprune you'd all be giving the 
and saying thanks for the pointers.
But no we have the typical sour mob who didn't get the gig slagging this gentleman off for taking the time to do what, I'm sure he thought at the time, was the good and decent thing!
And then you wonder why GA operators / recruiters treat applicants poorly...
I'd be surprised if this chap bothers next time. Why would you?
and saying thanks for the pointers. But no we have the typical sour mob who didn't get the gig slagging this gentleman off for taking the time to do what, I'm sure he thought at the time, was the good and decent thing!
And then you wonder why GA operators / recruiters treat applicants poorly...
I'd be surprised if this chap bothers next time. Why would you?
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From my friends dealing with this bloke I'd suggest anyone thinking about applying to think twice!!!
Most of the questions are relevant an understandable as to why he's asking but some are f$%&%g ridiculous an absolutely none of his business! especially the one about 'what do your parents do an where do they live'!
My mate went down for an initial chat all he did was talk about how pilots were f£$%^g stupid an how he's sick of stupid fkn pilots wasting his time, then when it came to a checkride was sworn at and abused for not flying up to standard. I can't comment on what his standard was actually like as I wasn't there but my mate was disgusted by the way he was treated!
From what I've been told this guy was nothing but rude and abusive, an they way he treated a keen wannabee is disgraceful an the guy should be ashamed!
Most of the questions are relevant an understandable as to why he's asking but some are f$%&%g ridiculous an absolutely none of his business! especially the one about 'what do your parents do an where do they live'!
My mate went down for an initial chat all he did was talk about how pilots were f£$%^g stupid an how he's sick of stupid fkn pilots wasting his time, then when it came to a checkride was sworn at and abused for not flying up to standard. I can't comment on what his standard was actually like as I wasn't there but my mate was disgusted by the way he was treated!
From what I've been told this guy was nothing but rude and abusive, an they way he treated a keen wannabee is disgraceful an the guy should be ashamed!
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From what I've been told this guy was nothing but rude and abusive, an they way he treated a keen wannabee is disgraceful an the guy should be ashamed!
The only illegal questions in the application form was the marital status (you should refuse to answer) and the date of birth (put in only the date, not the year). And the part about smoking and drinking should also not be answered.
Last edited by Jabiman; 3rd Nov 2010 at 14:02.
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Agreed GG, neville, IC and co. Grow up young gun, the points made in the rejection letter are all very valid.
The positives are at least you got a response and in that response he has offered a lot of helpful points that so many low timers should find very helpful. He could have easily typed up " Thankyou for your application unfortunately you have been unsuccessfull in this instance".
You have failed to state how many of the points you failed to meet? Did any of the points made in the reply apply to your application?
Can be pretty frustrating when an employer advertises a position and gets 100 applications of which 90% do not even meet the advertised minimums or cover letter is filled with basic spelling mistakes.
What better place to get advice than from prospective employers? I assure you that the next potential employer you send your cv off to will expect pretty much the same. Doubt you will receive any other rejection letters offering so much constructive criticism.
The positives are at least you got a response and in that response he has offered a lot of helpful points that so many low timers should find very helpful. He could have easily typed up " Thankyou for your application unfortunately you have been unsuccessfull in this instance".
You have failed to state how many of the points you failed to meet? Did any of the points made in the reply apply to your application?
Can be pretty frustrating when an employer advertises a position and gets 100 applications of which 90% do not even meet the advertised minimums or cover letter is filled with basic spelling mistakes.
i think if i need advice ill get it somewhere else
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FOD Hazard, mate you hit the nail on the head. I reckon it was good of the bloke to go to the trouble of listing what they look for in applications. If you blokes that got this reply are too arrogant to take advise that is going to help you in your next application then you dont deserve a job. The world doesnt owe u guys a job, you have to earn it, and until you can pull your head out of your ass and realise that, then you will never get far.
And all this crapping on about progression to twins etc. What a load of crap. If you have 250 hours and a CPL you need to wake up and realise that you arent going to be flying an airliner in the next 6 months, despite what your big city flight school told you to get you to train there. So just accept that you are going to have to degrade yourself to fly a plane with less than 100 seats for awhile, regardless of how awesome you think you are.
Unless you are hell bent on flying an airliner, then you wont necessarily need much twin time anyway. There is no shortage of excellent paying single engine jobs out there if you know where to look. Just remember, it doesnt matter how many steps you have to climb to get into the cockpit, at the end of the day, you are still just flying an aeroplane.
And all this crapping on about progression to twins etc. What a load of crap. If you have 250 hours and a CPL you need to wake up and realise that you arent going to be flying an airliner in the next 6 months, despite what your big city flight school told you to get you to train there. So just accept that you are going to have to degrade yourself to fly a plane with less than 100 seats for awhile, regardless of how awesome you think you are.
Unless you are hell bent on flying an airliner, then you wont necessarily need much twin time anyway. There is no shortage of excellent paying single engine jobs out there if you know where to look. Just remember, it doesnt matter how many steps you have to climb to get into the cockpit, at the end of the day, you are still just flying an aeroplane.
To those who got knocked back by AAA and yes i am one of those 168 who didn't get the job, its not going to hurt to take the advice given by the CP.
I have spoken to the CP face to face a few times and via email. He is a very level headed bloke, very easy going and more than willing to help out us new blokes and blokettes even if he won't give you a job. Most companies would not even bothered to let you know that you didn't get the job, let alone take the time to write up a list of common mistakes that were made
GG and others, the email mentioned stuff like
"Check your spelling and grammar. Many people didn’t get past this point! Most applicants claimed to have great or exceptional communication skills and yet over 80% of the applications contained basic spelling or grammatical mistakes. I know we are hiring pilots not writers; however it shows attention to detail which is a trait we value highly.
Quite a few applicants claimed C206 experience but didn’t say how many hours. We took it as approx 1hr! List total hours, total PIC hours and hours on each type somewhere near the start of your CV or even in the email text."
The CP told me these things personally about 2 years ago when I first bugged him, take it in good measure guys, it'll help out in the long run. Remember, he didn't have to go out of his way to help those of us who were not sucessful.
Also, a word of advice for those younguns on PPRUNE, the industry is a small place and reputations mean a fair bit. word travels quite fast about those who bitch and moan because they have to do a bit of work to get a job. Your adults, act like it. others can attest its almost impossible to stay anonimos on here....
I have spoken to the CP face to face a few times and via email. He is a very level headed bloke, very easy going and more than willing to help out us new blokes and blokettes even if he won't give you a job. Most companies would not even bothered to let you know that you didn't get the job, let alone take the time to write up a list of common mistakes that were made
GG and others, the email mentioned stuff like
"Check your spelling and grammar. Many people didn’t get past this point! Most applicants claimed to have great or exceptional communication skills and yet over 80% of the applications contained basic spelling or grammatical mistakes. I know we are hiring pilots not writers; however it shows attention to detail which is a trait we value highly.
Quite a few applicants claimed C206 experience but didn’t say how many hours. We took it as approx 1hr! List total hours, total PIC hours and hours on each type somewhere near the start of your CV or even in the email text."
The CP told me these things personally about 2 years ago when I first bugged him, take it in good measure guys, it'll help out in the long run. Remember, he didn't have to go out of his way to help those of us who were not sucessful.
Also, a word of advice for those younguns on PPRUNE, the industry is a small place and reputations mean a fair bit. word travels quite fast about those who bitch and moan because they have to do a bit of work to get a job. Your adults, act like it. others can attest its almost impossible to stay anonimos on here....
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I agree also that the rejection email wasn't negative at all, in fact its great that a reply was sent at all.
I worked with AAA recently and found the place to be a good place to get that first gig. Sure there's 'only' a couple of singles but what else are you after or do you expect for the first job?? The guy takes low time pilots which i think is great but obviously he requires some extra attributes too. The H endo is necessary as there is bus work to and from the airport so just suck it up and get it.
You have to remember that these guys get lots of pilots breezing through looking for work. I've seen of the CV's etc when i was there and some of them were awful. The reality is, you need to set yourself apart from the other guys, whether it be in hours, personality, other skills or whatever.
The work is varied and you get cheap accom provided and Jabiru isn't a bad place to live. It gave me enough 200 time and a great intro into charter to move on to the next job which is great. Its been a great stepping stone.
I think there's a few rich kids around here that trained in their nice shiny, glass cockpit C172's, haven't done a day's work yet, that think that they are entitled to an amazing job in a huge company, flying twins after 2 months. If thats the case then stick to the cadetships as GA in the top end isn't for you!
I worked with AAA recently and found the place to be a good place to get that first gig. Sure there's 'only' a couple of singles but what else are you after or do you expect for the first job?? The guy takes low time pilots which i think is great but obviously he requires some extra attributes too. The H endo is necessary as there is bus work to and from the airport so just suck it up and get it.
You have to remember that these guys get lots of pilots breezing through looking for work. I've seen of the CV's etc when i was there and some of them were awful. The reality is, you need to set yourself apart from the other guys, whether it be in hours, personality, other skills or whatever.
The work is varied and you get cheap accom provided and Jabiru isn't a bad place to live. It gave me enough 200 time and a great intro into charter to move on to the next job which is great. Its been a great stepping stone.
I think there's a few rich kids around here that trained in their nice shiny, glass cockpit C172's, haven't done a day's work yet, that think that they are entitled to an amazing job in a huge company, flying twins after 2 months. If thats the case then stick to the cadetships as GA in the top end isn't for you!
Clearly there's also a reason you're not either....
Take the advice. Stop being so f*cking arrogant.
Christ, kids these days.....
morno
Take the advice. Stop being so f*cking arrogant.
Christ, kids these days.....
morno
YEAH MORNO, HE'S NOT A KID, HE'S ALL GWOWN UP!
young gun,
Quit being a t00l.
j3
p.s. I think you'll find AussieNick has been up working in the top end for around 2 years. And I'm guessing he knows the owner by networking and keeping in touch with him. NOT by throwing his dummy out of the pram like you have done beautifully.
So good luck trying to break into the top end and network on here, you've already shown your true colors.
young gun,
Quit being a t00l.
j3
p.s. I think you'll find AussieNick has been up working in the top end for around 2 years. And I'm guessing he knows the owner by networking and keeping in touch with him. NOT by throwing his dummy out of the pram like you have done beautifully.
So good luck trying to break into the top end and network on here, you've already shown your true colors.
@ Young GunPilot:
This has been the only time i applied for an advertised position with this company, the other times i've spoken with the CP has been when they have been fully staffed, it's called networking.
I'm not even going to bother getting into and argument with you over my spelling and grammar on an internet forum vs my spelling and grammar on a formal email....
To those of you who did get in (if your reading this) enjoy the wet season, rumour has it it's going to be a doozie
This has been the only time i applied for an advertised position with this company, the other times i've spoken with the CP has been when they have been fully staffed, it's called networking.
I'm not even going to bother getting into and argument with you over my spelling and grammar on an internet forum vs my spelling and grammar on a formal email....
To those of you who did get in (if your reading this) enjoy the wet season, rumour has it it's going to be a doozie