Jandakot Class D changes

[Green_pilot_79]

In reading the Class D changes for the 3rd of June i have seen not that much change for a VFR flights out and in. So you can come inbound from any position but ATC have the power still to guide you through the VFR appraoch points ???? .

Also the only other change is that all i do now is tell ATC my intensions etc on my taxi call now( which there was no call to be made taxying before at YPJT) and then they will clear me to the holding point and i just say ready when there. Doesnt seem much of a change to me :/

Yet to have a chat to my instuctor about this yet as I am away and cant make the CASA siminar either that they are running.

But if there is anything else im missing please do tell

[Icarus2001]

which there was no call to be made taxying before at YPJT)

That would depend on which before. It is not that long ago that we used to give a taxi call at GAAP and then when you called ready ATC knew where you were going and that you had the latest ATIS. Then a bright spark decided a taxi call was not needed and so loaded up the ready call with all the useful information that used to be passed in the taxi call.

So now we go back to the future.

[ContactMeNow]

Departure reports

Is a departure report required for every flight leaving the CCT area?

Freq could get busy......

[VH-XXX]

Departure calls no longer required for VFR.

[Clearedtoreenter]

ATC have the power still to guide you through the VFR appraoch points ???? .

From what I heard at the seminar, it seems likely that inbound calls from points other than the old reporting points, (where many of the accidents were that brought all of this on) will not be accommodated and you will most likely be politely requested to go to the old approach points. Looks like anything outside the circuit is still to be 'sort yourselves out boys and girls' - and if you crash into someone its your fault for not maintaining separation because you are VFR. Works great, until you get 3 or 4 aircraft at the same approach point at the same time. Situations with high wing silightly lower than low wing being channelled to the same point remain inherently dangerous.

We'll be much safer taxiing around on the ground now though, at 5 knots, with separation and clearance to anywhere with a yellow line on it.

The review of pricing at GAAP airports... er sorry Class D, will be interesting when all of this has to be paid for.

[Dizzy Llama]

(where many of the accidents were that brought all of this on)

many? - One (2RN), I think, in about 35 years of GAAP and umpteen million movements.

being channelled to the same point remain inherently dangerous.

possibly - but I would suggest not nearly as dangerous as coming inbound between two IRPs and directly into the teeth of multiple OUTBOUND aircraft. A major part of having IRPs is to segregate inbound from outbound.

[Ted D Bear]

Departure calls no longer required for VFR.

That's right - but AIP ENR 1.1 - 8.4.2 says you have to stay on tower frequency after departure until ATC tells you to change I bet that ain't gonna happen

Ted

[David75]

A major part of having IRPs is to segregate inbound from outbound.

And yet from the documentation I've seen there is less importance on the outbound routes... I presume in practise everyone will still do what they did before. But the instruction to extend a leg of the circuit to depart seems a little less explicit than the current GAAP procedures.

[Captain Nomad]

Have a read of AIP SUP H28/10. When taxiing you will need specific clearance to enter taxiway B. They have also defined names for the apron areas which they will want to hear in the taxi calls both on initial taxi and on clearing the runway on landing when getting taxi clearance to the appropriate apron.

Fun times ahead for all...

[David75]

When taxiing you will need specific clearance to enter taxiway B.

This could be interesting - I'm convinced they are just making this up as they go along.

[triton140]

At least for YSBK and YMMB (haven't checked the others) you're still required to arrive via the same old (but renamed) VFR approach points.

The CASA tutorials are quite misleading in this aspect.

[das Uber Soldat]

The whole thing is bull****. They should create a series of animated examples for different categories of operation complete with radio calls to give people an understanding for what is going on.

As it stands, i've read all the material sent to me, done the eLearning modules and still dont really have an exact idea of what to do/say come the 3rd. Im sure ill get by but it could be have been implemented better.

[kingRB]

I am expecting the new cloud separation standard of 500 foot below cloud will work really well for VFR traffic at YPPF in the coming winter

Every VFR movement will need to be special VFR, and from what I can gather from the CASA training material, school ops will be unable to fly circuits if the vertical separation below cloud is not achievable..

[XX-ANY]

Dont forget to squawk 3k

[Ted D Bear]

And make sure you change from 3000 to 1200 (or 1200 to 3000) at the zone boundary

[AV8 consultants]

There was a meeting last night at RACWA outlining stuff that was not even discussed at CASA roadshow. Departure calls are required but if you forget they wont shoot you down. I suggest you ring RACAWA of the Jandakot tower and get filled in about the changes as they are significant and have been 'refined and tailored to suit Jandakot'. They also suggest you dont use SVFR unless absolutley neccessary as it can cause huge delays for traffic due separation standards.

[peuce]

... about the changes as they are significant and have been 'refined and tailored to suit Jandakot'.

Oh dear ...

[Captain Nomad]

Which really begs the question, why change from GAAP? That is what GAAP was for, special proceedures designed to maximise operations at a specific location. Not necessarily one size fits all...

[superdimona]

Please tell me that is a joke. What a nightmare.

[AV8 consultants]

Hey , we all dont like change but this stuff has been happening for years. So we adapt as usual. I was making taxi calls at Jandakot years ago and it should be no problem.
CASA has always wanted to align themselves with international rulings but as always they fiddle with it to suit their ideas. It has been going on for years. You can jump up and down and making noise but it wont do much. At the CASA roadshow they said they would not print the new Visual pilot guides until a significant time has passed and things have settled down.. so expect more changes. My guess is that we wil have GAAPs back in 12-24 months.
My only suggestion is that some bright spark does a cheat sheet of the new calls that we can understand as the ERSA and AIP has some ambiguities. So off you go !! All this stuff should have been clarified months ago by CASA not just in a brief last week in the roadshow. I would like to see what happens the first weekend of the changes when the weekend warriors start flying. I feel sorry for the tower guys. YOU can do it!