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Virgin Blue hiring

Old 14th Jun 2016, 07:54
  #1381 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Sydney
Posts: 9
If you had gone through the tripe I had mate I suspect your tune may be a little different. There are ways to treat people, and ways not to.

I've got nothing but respect for the people operating the aircraft but I don't apologize for holding a certain degree of contempt for a HR department that has behaved as though we were an unwelcome inconvenience, especially considering the costs all of us incurred to be properly prepared for the process.

The embarrassment of being instructed to call your referees for the last stage of the process so they would be ready for Virgins call, only to then hear nothing ever again, nor an explanation as to why was unnecessary and unprofessional.
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Old 14th Jun 2016, 10:35
  #1382 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: BBN
Posts: 163
If they are going to the street for crew, it will be for the VANZ operation, you won't get a domestic gig off the street fir a long time to come.
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Old 14th Jun 2016, 14:20
  #1383 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Asia
Posts: 91


The resignations have had an impact and will continue to do so. ATR was over crewed especially in light of recent developments ie. Alliance taking over the Emerald run, and the proposed withdrawal of 4-6 airframes, leaving a fleet of only 8 or so.
Ex ATR crew working up here, sensed exactly what was going on and walked. An uncertain future and lack of career progression is common to all.

Of course you can wait your time for an Ejet or 737 role, although to give you an example, a current ATR Captain is looking at 1-3 years from today (not to mention the 4-5 years they have already been on the ATR), a current FO more than this, and a new join, even more... so I guess the only real opportunities at the moment are on the 777 as a SO, or the 737 in NZ. This brings me to my next point.

As it appears there is very low interest in the SO and NZ roles from current crew, which means that any recruitment external will be for these positions and possibly ATR. So if you were to join say end of 2016, you will have every current 777 SO, ATR and VARA pilot, and shortly Tigerair pilot senior to you on the seniority list. How long do you think it will be before moving on from expert map folder? Yes indeed food for thought and time for the pension
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Old 14th Jun 2016, 21:34
  #1384 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Adelaide
Posts: 1
Yes, VA is a "career" airline these days, assuming it keeps going which given the free spending ways of certain individuals isn't necessarily a given.

There were quite a few years where people joined and found themselves in command of a 737 in under 6-12 months. Unheard of in Australia previously and you would have to say unusual in the rest of the world (for non contract roles).

All the stuff with the Chinese could very well kick off a flurry of new wide body routes, and given that there are only 11 existing wide bodies in the group at the moment there could be a few more airframes in the future, with that brings opportunity.

If you are flogging around in a GA type, a dash or even to a lesser extent a 717 you would, I would suggest, have to have a serious think about whether the inconvenience of the early stages of the job in Virgin outweighs the later stages.

If you were offered QF and VA at the same time, I would probably go with QF but you are faced with the same issues - SO for a considerable time, then uncertainty as to where the progression lies given JQ etc. but if nothing else you get half decent staff travel and "appear" to be valued at least a little bit by the senior management.

VA - gives you a number of different pathways. Let's face it FO on the 737 in NZ isn't exactly flying rubber dog shit out of Hong Kong. NZ is a beautiful country, the flying across the pacific islands is good challenging flying and if you have kids bring them up in nz is not a bad option, flattened vowels notwithstanding

Flogging around to LA or AUH in the back seat of a trippler, granted not as mentally stimulating as it could be but it is what you make of it, no reason why you couldn't fill your time doing some tertiary education by remote learning, if nothing else do some shopping in LA!

The SO's seem to transition into the right hand seat of the domestic jets reasonably fast, certainly faster than QF as best I can tell, so that may be a consideration.

Would I give up a decent dash8 or 717/146 gig for this - I would certainly give it some serious thought!

Cobham for all their good points, are hostage to their contracts, that is just the nature of the beast. You could do an absolutely awesome job with them and the political winds blow differently at QF or wherever and they lose the contract (look at santos as an example). Through absolutely no fault of your own you could find yourself looking for something else - the other flick of the coin says they keep their contracts and you could stay there happy as larry until you retire - you just don't know.

Eastern/sunnies/skippers etc - probably worth serious consideration. As the Rex guys have found out the lower paid but more relaxed regional lifestyle can change when some bean counter decides to squeeze a few more drops from the regional lemon, and you are doing a heap of overnights with little or no allowances, effectively away nearly as much as the mainline pilots for half the pay.

You just don't know, but don't dismiss future opportunities because the initial bits are not ideal.
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Old 15th Jun 2016, 00:40
  #1385 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: on the plains
Posts: 17
Originally Posted by Goat Whisperer View Post
Not many VANZ crew want to move to Aus, and many of those who do are too junior or frozen, hence they're at VANZ.
If VANZ crew don't want to leave why is external recruitment only there for the 73?

Any rough guesses a 73 Aus gig will take once in the group?
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Old 15th Jun 2016, 01:41
  #1386 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Australia at the moment
Posts: 159
Snakecharmer excellent post. I have to agree with you 100%. Life and aviation are really a box of chocolates Forrest.
It is truly a raffle at times, but great fun and you will have good memories if you genuinely put in the effort.
Enjoy the ride and smell the roses, you never ever know........
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Old 15th Jun 2016, 02:15
  #1387 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Australia
Posts: 449
Keep drinking that kool aid boys while others enjoy their successful and rewarding careers at other operators.

Give up a 717 or Dash for up to 10 years minimum in a ATR or 777 before the 'chance' of an Aussie jet right seat? Obviously written by company men with their rose tinted glasses on...
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Old 15th Jun 2016, 03:09
  #1388 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 516
Give up a 717 or Dash for up to 10 years minimum in a ATR or 777 before the 'chance' of an Aussie jet right seat?
If you enjoy the job and manage to carve out a comfortable life for yourself/your family, does it really matter? Work to live, not live to work.

Last edited by wishiwasupthere; 15th Jun 2016 at 04:29.
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Old 15th Jun 2016, 03:26
  #1389 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Adelaide
Posts: 1
There are many many people who have made a happy and successful career of instructing, GA, regional flying etc.

Particularly with instructing it is a huge shame that it isn't seen as a well paid career, as professional experienced instructors are worth their weight in gold

BUT! When you get to the point where you are working harder than you would in the airlines, get paid a fraction of what you would get paid in the airlines, in an environment where you have a fraction of the support (load control, flight planning etc) and you don't have much in the way of job security, why wouldn't you have a look at an airline job?

Same theory applies to jobs at Cobham or similar (and yes I have worked for them in a past life). I enjoyed my time there and if it was not a contract dependent job I would probably still be there, but at the end of the day an opportunity arose where I had to make a decision on what was likely to be best for me and more importantly the people who relied on me. As I said before, Cobham can be the best, most efficient operator, the greatest employer and all round nicest guys in the cosmos, BUT if the people who contract them to supply aeroplanes and crews decide to go in a different direction you are potentially stuffed.

All I am saying is take the long view and don't dismiss an opportunity because the first part of the job is not ideal, and make a value judgement on all of the circumstances including your current job and then make a decision. FTS if that makes me a sucker for cool aid and a company man with rose coloured glasses, I guess I will just have to sit in the left hand seat of my wide body jet and suck it up.
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Old 15th Jun 2016, 04:51
  #1390 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Australia
Posts: 449
I guess I will just have to sit in the left hand seat of my wide body jet and suck it up.
There it is - that attitude and position I suspected was lurking under the surface. Assuming you are VA, congrats on the relatively painless and quick progression that you were able to achieve. Unless the company closes its doors, we are unlikely to see such a meteoric rise within an airline again as experienced by your peers. Keep that in mind when you're giving out your worldly advice to guys about joining an airline that is now a completely different kettle of fish. Decades of waiting for your chance in a seniority list a couple of thousand deep isn't exactly the opportunity you think it is...
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Old 15th Jun 2016, 11:12
  #1391 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2003
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Age: 36
Posts: 1,322
☐ Not REKT
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Old 15th Jun 2016, 11:31
  #1392 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Sydney
Posts: 9
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Old 16th Jun 2016, 00:17
  #1393 (permalink)  
Posts: n/a
No one knows what is going on around here at the moment. I'd say that anyone who joins now won't be seeing the right seat in oz for quite a while, especially because a lot of ATR and all ejet pilots need to be absorbed into the 737 fleet. You could be waiting up to 10 years, realistically. Then again, that could all change. One thing is for sure though, anyone who joins now better not be too concerned about having a command because you definitely won't be seeing that for a loooooong time! If you are happy to fly in NZ, the right seat or just use VA as a stepping stone then it is a great move
Old 16th Jun 2016, 08:00
  #1394 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Australia
Posts: 449
Now it looks likely any new VA pilots will be behind all of the Tiger pilots too on a combined seniority list. The unions are considering a group date of join of around April 2016 from what I understand. And if you join Tiger you'll also be behind ALL of the existing Virgin group pilots before you can get a command. A joint seniority list sounds good, but this is getting out of control! What number would new starters be? 3000ish?
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Old 16th Jun 2016, 08:42
  #1395 (permalink)  
Posts: n/a
edit: removed for what will no doubt become a heated discussion!

Last edited by atlas12; 16th Jun 2016 at 13:23.
Old 17th Jun 2016, 02:47
  #1396 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Doomagee
Age: 7
Posts: 657
Maybe atlas, but it is just a forum full of thoughts so in reality it doesn't matter.

As for what might or might not happen, well that's completely speculation. Who knows really. Better luck picking lotto numbers.
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Old 29th Jun 2016, 00:38
  #1397 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Sydney
Posts: 93
So where have the ATR pilots been leaving for? Has it been FO's and CAPT's?
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Old 29th Jun 2016, 05:28
  #1398 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Sydney
Posts: 75
Emirates, Jetstar and Qlink
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Old 29th Jun 2016, 07:47
  #1399 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Sydney
Posts: 9
Has a single VARA ATR driver even gotten an interview at jetstar?
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Old 29th Jun 2016, 10:26
  #1400 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: BBN
Posts: 163
Yes, a few have face to face now.
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