Was the Nomad really that bad?
Moderator
I'm sure that our colleagues from the Philippines will recall the pre-mod aileron problems .. they had several events going back some years now .. any aircraft which can recover following that sort of inflight structural damage has something going for it .. but, then, I have a soft spot for the Gonad, even if I never got around to driving one.
By the way, is Tiz Q from Boeing still doing the tech rep thing for you good folk out in the real world ? or has all the support faltered pending whatever Gippy Aero intends to do with the TC ?
By the way, is Tiz Q from Boeing still doing the tech rep thing for you good folk out in the real world ? or has all the support faltered pending whatever Gippy Aero intends to do with the TC ?
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TIZ
Tiz was still with Boeing last year when I left. Tech support for the aircraft went the Certificate of Airworthiness was handed over. Air Safari still swear by the aircraft and I have mostly fond memories apart from playing guess the chip detector when a light came on. Always ended up being reduction gearbox anyway.
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The Go Mad;
Or as a mate use to call it THE GONAD:
I can remember seeing ZX SNZ parked outside the Captial Aviation hangar/Office at wellington airport, with the Southerly blowing "just a tad"( yeah right)!
The CP called out F-----ing look at that! SNZ was levitating about 2-3ft off the ground, while happily parked!
On the twin NDB approach into Woodburn one night, a Chip Detector light illuminated, company SOP was to shut it down, I thought about shutting down a "perfectly good engine", and decided to follow the SOP and do so.
I proceeded to feather the right Engine, but something did not look or feel right! and I was confused, and could not understand why!
After sitting on my hands for a tad longer and trying to not get too high on the Approach! I realized that the chip light was saying L-ENG, but it was situated on the Right Hand side of center in the console.
In turbulence when at Light weight, it would fish tail, so you get the person in the Right seat to wonder down the back and it would stop!
Landing at All up weight it would perform better than a Twin Otter.
Take offs at all up weight were just the opposite.
In the rain you got an extremely wet right leg.
And in icing it did not like icing at all, it became a different animal in feel.
And in the winter, at night, the heating system was good when it stayed working.
Not an aeroplane I would like to get reacquainted with.
Chr's
H/Snort.
I can remember seeing ZX SNZ parked outside the Captial Aviation hangar/Office at wellington airport, with the Southerly blowing "just a tad"( yeah right)!
The CP called out F-----ing look at that! SNZ was levitating about 2-3ft off the ground, while happily parked!
On the twin NDB approach into Woodburn one night, a Chip Detector light illuminated, company SOP was to shut it down, I thought about shutting down a "perfectly good engine", and decided to follow the SOP and do so.
I proceeded to feather the right Engine, but something did not look or feel right! and I was confused, and could not understand why!
After sitting on my hands for a tad longer and trying to not get too high on the Approach! I realized that the chip light was saying L-ENG, but it was situated on the Right Hand side of center in the console.
In turbulence when at Light weight, it would fish tail, so you get the person in the Right seat to wonder down the back and it would stop!
Landing at All up weight it would perform better than a Twin Otter.
Take offs at all up weight were just the opposite.
In the rain you got an extremely wet right leg.
And in icing it did not like icing at all, it became a different animal in feel.
And in the winter, at night, the heating system was good when it stayed working.
Not an aeroplane I would like to get reacquainted with.
Chr's
H/Snort.
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Accountants loved it.
Compare the cost of capital, maintenance and operating to a Caravan and you begin to see its appeal. After all the measure of a successful aircraft is not just aesthetics.
I grudgingly admit to a soft spot for the damn things. Then again I don't have to fly them any more. My knees rubbed the dashboard.
SNZ...
Compare the cost of capital, maintenance and operating to a Caravan and you begin to see its appeal. After all the measure of a successful aircraft is not just aesthetics.
I grudgingly admit to a soft spot for the damn things. Then again I don't have to fly them any more. My knees rubbed the dashboard.
SNZ...
Silly Old Git
SDZ outside the old hangars in Darwhine in happier days
Clyde North Aeronautical Preservation Group - CNAPG.
Clyde North Aeronautical Preservation Group - CNAPG.
I did the ferry flight of SDZ from EN to DN via AS. It took two days and 13 hours of flight time. I agree with most comments, but it was not really that bad, I've seen worse. The 24 flew better and didn't have that strange 'auto flap retraction' during an overshoot. An empty 24 was out of limits on the forward C of G. I cannot tell how I found that out. More grey hairs.
Thanks Tinpis for the cockpit photo, they're not my legs, I would never wear brown pants and brown shoes with blue socks! Funny to see that early VLF Omega set to the right of the knee. We did a two day course at Civil on that and when given the certificate thought we were the 'ants pants' being 'Omega endorsed'. How embarassing now. Only 9 waypoints, number 9 was home base and in heavy rain it fell over anyway.
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There are military and civillian reports and also government reports on the early Nomad. It was found to be a flawed design, an accident waiting to happen in many areas. The RAAF was found to be negligent in allowing them to fly.
Having the tail fall off is not good, even worse when it happens more than once.
I remember when it first flew, there was a lot of money and politics involved at the time.
Having the tail fall off is not good, even worse when it happens more than once.
I remember when it first flew, there was a lot of money and politics involved at the time.
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"VH ATO back in 2007" - sounds like a while ago then!
Seriously, the worst aircraft I have ever flown. Most I know would be happy to remove it from their licence.
The reason why it would land in such a short distance was that it was never really designed to fly, landing was relief to all!
Celebrating its history is akin to the abhorrant thought that one day Hitler will be celebrated as a mover and shaker in social justice.
Seriously, the worst aircraft I have ever flown. Most I know would be happy to remove it from their licence.
The reason why it would land in such a short distance was that it was never really designed to fly, landing was relief to all!
Celebrating its history is akin to the abhorrant thought that one day Hitler will be celebrated as a mover and shaker in social justice.
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MickK said
I remember the Nomad at ARDU that lost its tailplane.
"Crash" Donovon the PIC
The accident report highlighted the many hours of ground runs at high power as a probable cause of the fatigue.
Can not find a reference to another failure.
Worked on these for a couple of years at Oakey, N22 with premod Prop reduction gearboxes. Three pinnion planetary gears, was able to produce a lot of metal in a very short time.
Having the tail fall off is not good, even worse when it happens more than once.
"Crash" Donovon the PIC
The accident report highlighted the many hours of ground runs at high power as a probable cause of the fatigue.
Can not find a reference to another failure.
Worked on these for a couple of years at Oakey, N22 with premod Prop reduction gearboxes. Three pinnion planetary gears, was able to produce a lot of metal in a very short time.
one day Hitler will be celebrated as a mover and shaker in social justice
The aircraft Glen was flying at ARDU was originally VH-IIG and yes it was used for extensive ground running. The shaking of the tail feathers during this ground running was not identified or considered part of the airframe fatigue life that was the start of the ultimate failure.
Moderator
Re GD's fatal, and some of the adverse history in general, I think that some of the posters really need to do some homework before making silly statements such as seen in this thread.
Unfortunately, Donovan was in the wrong spot at the wrong time. A TP mate had been along on the previous circuit and then watched the prang .. not his fondest recollection.
Tailplane cracking was a well known problem (all Types have their problems) and subject to an inspection regime. The last factory inspection on that particular serial prior to its return to the military was made by a long term colleague of mine (Russ K) whose integrity was not in question ... I might note, he carried the worry that he may have missed the start of some cracking to his grave. It would have helped had the military subsequently not elected to defer an inspection sometime prior to the crash .. that inspection very likely would have picked up the accelerated deterioration and avoided Donovan's death.
Unfortunately, Donovan was in the wrong spot at the wrong time. A TP mate had been along on the previous circuit and then watched the prang .. not his fondest recollection.
Tailplane cracking was a well known problem (all Types have their problems) and subject to an inspection regime. The last factory inspection on that particular serial prior to its return to the military was made by a long term colleague of mine (Russ K) whose integrity was not in question ... I might note, he carried the worry that he may have missed the start of some cracking to his grave. It would have helped had the military subsequently not elected to defer an inspection sometime prior to the crash .. that inspection very likely would have picked up the accelerated deterioration and avoided Donovan's death.
JT, that is an engineering issue..was there any attempt to rectify the fatigue problem? Different tail rigging..conventional instead of stabilator? lower down the empennage? I know there was a t-tail built, did it ever fly?