Robbo's For Police, Or Perhaps Not???
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Wanna Be Up There...
Age: 53
Posts: 279
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Robbo's For Police, Or Perhaps Not???
Article Here.
Gold Coast cops won't fly in small chopper
Are the concerns about a Petrol Engined helicopter valid or are they just holding out for more "spacious" work horses?
Gold Coast cops won't fly in small chopper
Are the concerns about a Petrol Engined helicopter valid or are they just holding out for more "spacious" work horses?
Sprucegoose
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Hughes Point, where life is great! Was also resident on page 13, but now I'm lost in Cyberspace....
Age: 59
Posts: 3,485
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
I'm not a helihead, but a Robbo would seem most unsuited to that type of work! Might be OK for surveilling people along highways, but not much good for winching, etc...
Surely there is a multi-engine requirement for night work?
Surely there is a multi-engine requirement for night work?
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Gold Coast, Queensland
Posts: 943
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The R44 is a safe machine if flown by an experienced pilot but basically it is too small for this job. Quite a few are used for traffic spotting without any problems & they don't drop like a rock if the engine fails which is rare. A Squirrel is bigger & more suitable & autos much the same as the R44. The police have used Surfs Squirrel for years on a charter basis, so some of them are familiar with it. Winching is allowed at night & regularly done.
A small twin would be nice but probably way over the budget & wouldn't achieve much more. They still need to work out just what sort of flying thay want to do.
A small twin would be nice but probably way over the budget & wouldn't achieve much more. They still need to work out just what sort of flying thay want to do.
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Yellow Brick Road
Posts: 1,127
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It's known in the industry as the Widowmaker
I assume they are not talking about using the factory built police role equipped r44?
It is a worthy low cost patrol and search machine, especially if you stick to 2 POB.
Sustained hovering over built-up areas is best done in a powerful twin, however LA PD use singles, because most of LA is low rise where one doesn't lose the suspect during an orbit and there are plenty of car parks and wide roads to land in a dire emergency.
A larger gimbal with more powerful lens would be desirable on the R44 police. Latest machines have HD cameras but still lack super long lenses.
Floats cant be fitted, to it or the R44 news variant, but good glide ability would enable safe flights along the coast at the appropriate altitude. ( I shot an around Ireland boat race in a R44 news)
In the years to come, improvements in camera performance of lightweight gimbals will overcome the current shortcomings.
It is feasible to operate a regular R44 with super long lens HD gimbal and floats.
Mickjoebill
It is a worthy low cost patrol and search machine, especially if you stick to 2 POB.
Sustained hovering over built-up areas is best done in a powerful twin, however LA PD use singles, because most of LA is low rise where one doesn't lose the suspect during an orbit and there are plenty of car parks and wide roads to land in a dire emergency.
A larger gimbal with more powerful lens would be desirable on the R44 police. Latest machines have HD cameras but still lack super long lenses.
Floats cant be fitted, to it or the R44 news variant, but good glide ability would enable safe flights along the coast at the appropriate altitude. ( I shot an around Ireland boat race in a R44 news)
In the years to come, improvements in camera performance of lightweight gimbals will overcome the current shortcomings.
It is feasible to operate a regular R44 with super long lens HD gimbal and floats.
Mickjoebill
Last edited by mickjoebill; 18th Aug 2011 at 20:53.
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Oz
Posts: 71
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
One of the problems during the recent floods was having limited helicopters suitable to lift people from roof tops, cars etc. You would think this capability would be on the requirements list!
An R44 isn't going to be able to lift anyone to safety. Memories are short of the man that was swept away while waiting for someone to rescue him, while his family were lucky enough to grab on to a tree until something suitable came along.
Why is the GC council paying for it? Oh, that's right, the Qld government is broke and despite the recent flood inquiry don't have the cash to buy the right equipment.
An R44 isn't going to be able to lift anyone to safety. Memories are short of the man that was swept away while waiting for someone to rescue him, while his family were lucky enough to grab on to a tree until something suitable came along.
Why is the GC council paying for it? Oh, that's right, the Qld government is broke and despite the recent flood inquiry don't have the cash to buy the right equipment.
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Aus, or USA, or UK or EU, or possibly somehwere in Asia.
Posts: 320
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Mickjoebill:
I think that he R44 Police comes with an FS Ultra 8000, which is not so bad, The new MX10 gimbal, Ultra 8500 or the Talon would be heaps good enough and sufficiently light to make this platform very effective up to about 5-6,000 ft where police helos never really go. they are low level assets (essentially blow 2,000 ft most of the time. Big sensor gimbal and long lens is a complete waste of time, plus they are BIG bucks.
Paperboy:
Again, its horses for courses, as a visible deterrent with a fast on site response time, EO/IR sensor and Police communications would enable this to work well in and around the GC precincts. From 1500 ft along the glitter gulch, the beach or motorway reserves may provide reasonable emergency areas. However, if winching, medevec and rescue work is included in the mission requirements, this this is clearly not a suitable choice.
D-J
S/E piston is really no less reliable than Turbine, despite the knockers. the R44 police model is an accepted rotary wing airborne Law enforcement tool in the US, and can be here if used in the correct roles. It is affordable and effective, and much better than not having the M/E turbine that you cannot afford.
If coppers are so sensitive that they are happy to ride pushies around while wearing spandex shorts and tops, and poncy bike helmets, not to mention the gayest looking sunnies in the world, I can't see why they would be so embarrassed about being seen in a Robbo.
Widdowmaker, what ccok!, it is almost litigious to use inflammatory statements like that. it's good enough for LAPD to use S/E , but not the GC Mayor's office?, Heloo Boys, toughen up and say thanks, rather than acting like spoilt children. If you have concerns, real. honest concerns, express them through the correct means, not the Courier FFS! This sounds like a hyped up story, that is getting for more media oxygen than it deserves.
HD
I think that he R44 Police comes with an FS Ultra 8000, which is not so bad, The new MX10 gimbal, Ultra 8500 or the Talon would be heaps good enough and sufficiently light to make this platform very effective up to about 5-6,000 ft where police helos never really go. they are low level assets (essentially blow 2,000 ft most of the time. Big sensor gimbal and long lens is a complete waste of time, plus they are BIG bucks.
Paperboy:
Again, its horses for courses, as a visible deterrent with a fast on site response time, EO/IR sensor and Police communications would enable this to work well in and around the GC precincts. From 1500 ft along the glitter gulch, the beach or motorway reserves may provide reasonable emergency areas. However, if winching, medevec and rescue work is included in the mission requirements, this this is clearly not a suitable choice.
D-J
S/E piston is really no less reliable than Turbine, despite the knockers. the R44 police model is an accepted rotary wing airborne Law enforcement tool in the US, and can be here if used in the correct roles. It is affordable and effective, and much better than not having the M/E turbine that you cannot afford.
If coppers are so sensitive that they are happy to ride pushies around while wearing spandex shorts and tops, and poncy bike helmets, not to mention the gayest looking sunnies in the world, I can't see why they would be so embarrassed about being seen in a Robbo.
Widdowmaker, what ccok!, it is almost litigious to use inflammatory statements like that. it's good enough for LAPD to use S/E , but not the GC Mayor's office?, Heloo Boys, toughen up and say thanks, rather than acting like spoilt children. If you have concerns, real. honest concerns, express them through the correct means, not the Courier FFS! This sounds like a hyped up story, that is getting for more media oxygen than it deserves.
HD
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Aus, or USA, or UK or EU, or possibly somehwere in Asia.
Posts: 320
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
HH:
Why, does black air somehow have less lift than clear air?. LAPD use S/E helos at night, shock horror!! and they do fall down occaisonally, some times in the day, sometimes at night, I know one of their pilots to whom this happened, the whistling stopped when he was in hover at about 500' at night, landed (@#$??!?) in a front yard of a house, all good except for brown stain on blue flight suit.
S/E or M/E, one tail rotor, one gearbox, one rotor mast, or are we advocating using a Chook for this role? Now THAT would be a deterrent, especially if it was loaded with a vehicle and a SWAT team. It could be a bit on the pricey side?
HD
Surely there is a multi-engine requirement for night work?
S/E or M/E, one tail rotor, one gearbox, one rotor mast, or are we advocating using a Chook for this role? Now THAT would be a deterrent, especially if it was loaded with a vehicle and a SWAT team. It could be a bit on the pricey side?
HD
Guys I think you''re missing the point entirely. I don't think they're hung up on S/E vs MULTI.
I think they're more concerned about piston, plus the fact the robinson blade delaminations, issues of corrosion, clutch AD etc etc etc
I think they're more concerned about piston, plus the fact the robinson blade delaminations, issues of corrosion, clutch AD etc etc etc
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Wanna Be Up There...
Age: 53
Posts: 279
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Havick, I thought all of those concerns were more widely experienced in the Pastoral Industry with R22's where maintenance is, ahem, cough, cough. I am sure the Police will maintain them to a much higher standard.
In a police role which I am interpreting to be spotting and assisting ground officers during pursuits rather than rescue work I thought it would be perfect.
In a police role which I am interpreting to be spotting and assisting ground officers during pursuits rather than rescue work I thought it would be perfect.
Ask all the R44 owners around the country and see if they're still happy with their product.
Bladeslapper • View topic - R44 Clutch warranty issue - class action?
Bladeslapper • View topic - R44 Clutch warranty issue - class action?
I read somewhere that CASA was considering introducing a regulation that required all Police helicopters operating over built up areas to be M/E. I can't remember where I read it now, is this likely to occur?
