AOPA - 4 Directors resign
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AOPA - 4 Directors resign
All:
As a member of AOPA for now 40 yrs I am concerned to hear reports today of the resignation of four board members, namely: Ron Lawford (President), Mick Kennedy (Secretary), Gary Gaunt and Adrian Williams at a telephone board meeting held last night.
As 24 hours have now passed since the meeting (?) I believe that whoever is now chairman has a responsibility to inform the membership of the facts without further delay by whatever means, including the use of this forum. To date there has been no information posted on the AOPA web site and the AOPA Forum has been closed since last Friday.
Whatever precipitated this action, it must have been serious.
To my knowledge there has been no comment from those that resigned.
To those that have 'knocked' AOPA on this forum in the past, please consider the bigger picture and speak accordingly. General Aviation in Australia needs a respected, representative association, especially at a time when the GA industry is said by many to be at its worst period in living memory. AOPA is all there is right now. You don't have to agree with them, just respect their rights to a point of view and consider how things would be for GA without any representation whatsoever?
cheers
As a member of AOPA for now 40 yrs I am concerned to hear reports today of the resignation of four board members, namely: Ron Lawford (President), Mick Kennedy (Secretary), Gary Gaunt and Adrian Williams at a telephone board meeting held last night.
As 24 hours have now passed since the meeting (?) I believe that whoever is now chairman has a responsibility to inform the membership of the facts without further delay by whatever means, including the use of this forum. To date there has been no information posted on the AOPA web site and the AOPA Forum has been closed since last Friday.
Whatever precipitated this action, it must have been serious.
To my knowledge there has been no comment from those that resigned.
To those that have 'knocked' AOPA on this forum in the past, please consider the bigger picture and speak accordingly. General Aviation in Australia needs a respected, representative association, especially at a time when the GA industry is said by many to be at its worst period in living memory. AOPA is all there is right now. You don't have to agree with them, just respect their rights to a point of view and consider how things would be for GA without any representation whatsoever?
cheers
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Gday Doug
So whats this mean regarding the election , I have been thinking about who to vote for ( with little information )
Why do ego's and politics stuff up most voluntary organizations.
Cheers Q
So whats this mean regarding the election , I have been thinking about who to vote for ( with little information )
Why do ego's and politics stuff up most voluntary organizations.
Cheers Q
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Rabbits now control the lettuce patch
Apparently the Hamilton faction now 100% controls AOPA.
Rumour has it that the resignations were directly related to the lack of solvency and the inability of AOPA to secure Directors' Liability. Seems like AOPA is on the financial brink but for some reason the new regime has decided to keep the members in the dark.
This has not been helped by the closing down of AOPA's Forum site. One can only wonder if there is sinister intent in closing down commnunications when disaster occurs (must learn their lessons from North Korea).
So why aren't members being informed about such a serious matter of possible financial collapse ?
And have the auditors qualified the accounts?
Why did four senior directors resign en masse ?
In the absence of any communique from the Hamilton bunker, could one of the ex directors please tell us (up to now) faithful members what is going ?
Rumour has it that the resignations were directly related to the lack of solvency and the inability of AOPA to secure Directors' Liability. Seems like AOPA is on the financial brink but for some reason the new regime has decided to keep the members in the dark.
This has not been helped by the closing down of AOPA's Forum site. One can only wonder if there is sinister intent in closing down commnunications when disaster occurs (must learn their lessons from North Korea).
So why aren't members being informed about such a serious matter of possible financial collapse ?
And have the auditors qualified the accounts?
Why did four senior directors resign en masse ?
In the absence of any communique from the Hamilton bunker, could one of the ex directors please tell us (up to now) faithful members what is going ?
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Apparently the Hamilton faction now 100% controls AOPA.
Ron Bertram is definatly not a Hamilton faction, in fact, I think the only one that belongs in any kind of faction would be Lyon.
Just relax, it will be all right in a bit.
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I really don't care who's in what faction (not the phrase I would normally use), until it becomes a problem.
Now we have a problem.
OK, lets find a solution to the problem.
"Administrator" springs immediately to mind.
In the mean time AOPA's energies and focus are anywhere except where they should be..........On matters Aviation.
Get on with it !!!!!!!!!!
Disco Stu
Now we have a problem.
OK, lets find a solution to the problem.
"Administrator" springs immediately to mind.
In the mean time AOPA's energies and focus are anywhere except where they should be..........On matters Aviation.
Get on with it !!!!!!!!!!
Disco Stu
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It appears by the comments on news group aus.aviation it is the best thing that has happened to the A-Team as is appears they have nearly run AOPA broke. I hear the A-Team run up $20 - $30k on expenses, not good.
Lets hope things improve now with the AGM coming up.
zoom
Lets hope things improve now with the AGM coming up.
zoom
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The worm has turned
The news gets worse.
The Hamilton board has appointed two additional directors to replace the four who quit on Monday.
These are apparently Bob Murphie and Chris McKeown, both failed to get enough votes in the 2003 elections and it is understood both are loyal Hamilton supporters.
Looks like more of the same old grind.
And you might ask why no money ?
Well no treasurer + no budget + no cash forecasting + no idea = no money.
The committee need to come clean and tell the hapless members what is going on.
The Hamilton board has appointed two additional directors to replace the four who quit on Monday.
These are apparently Bob Murphie and Chris McKeown, both failed to get enough votes in the 2003 elections and it is understood both are loyal Hamilton supporters.
Looks like more of the same old grind.
And you might ask why no money ?
Well no treasurer + no budget + no cash forecasting + no idea = no money.
The committee need to come clean and tell the hapless members what is going on.
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I have also heard that AOPA members can get a copy of the list of expenses for 2003-2004 for each board member. I believe you can get this by contacting the AOPA office or by emailing them. See contact details at www.aopa.com.au. All you need to do is quote your member number.
It is worthwhile doing your own homework and not listen to the gravy train or gossip trial.
zoom
It is worthwhile doing your own homework and not listen to the gravy train or gossip trial.
zoom
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moving forward : Certainly the list you mention is available to members, but I venture to suggest that it does not provide all the information you may want.
The web page is down today, no doubt for some much needed update work. It will be interesting to see the update. Yes, I would agree that members need to do as much "homework" as possible and to ensure they obtain all sides to the story, whatever that may be.
There is an email in the system today advising of a change of venue of the AGM to Sydney (Bankstown) and that documentation may be found at: www.aopa.com.au/agm/material.htm
cheers
The web page is down today, no doubt for some much needed update work. It will be interesting to see the update. Yes, I would agree that members need to do as much "homework" as possible and to ensure they obtain all sides to the story, whatever that may be.
There is an email in the system today advising of a change of venue of the AGM to Sydney (Bankstown) and that documentation may be found at: www.aopa.com.au/agm/material.htm
cheers
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deja vu
Seems like we have been here before, only AOPA has gone further into the financial mire.
And now with the Hamilton devotees back in power we will get a re-run of the antics that reduced the membership from 11,000 to 4,000.
If it was a dog I would shoot it.
And this sick dog barks at parked cars and at other dogs in the pack. It bites members and ****s on the loungeroom floor.
Time for the old dog to be put down !
And now with the Hamilton devotees back in power we will get a re-run of the antics that reduced the membership from 11,000 to 4,000.
If it was a dog I would shoot it.
And this sick dog barks at parked cars and at other dogs in the pack. It bites members and ****s on the loungeroom floor.
Time for the old dog to be put down !
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RIP AOPA
Doug
With all due respect for your current enthusiasm for AOPA, I have over the past years witnessed the decline of what should be a cohesive and representative organisation into a farcical and frequently incoherent rabble.
At a recent gathering of aircraft type enthusiasts I attended, none of the 20-odd pilots were any longer members of AOPA.
The alternatives are equally bleak - especially as one of the alternative organisations is run by a past president who has been perceived by many to be at least as egotistical and unpredictable as recent AOPA pres's such as RHS.
Perhaps the renamed AUF will atttract more members......
Any ideas for representative and alternative voice for GA, Doug?
BTW if you visit the e-mailed link, you see this:
AOPA AGM Material
Financial Report FY 2003 (Coming Soon)
Information for members & Notice of AGM including Agenda
PDF DOC
Proxy Form (Coming Soon)
No sign of the Financial Report FY 2003, or means of voting!!!
With all due respect for your current enthusiasm for AOPA, I have over the past years witnessed the decline of what should be a cohesive and representative organisation into a farcical and frequently incoherent rabble.
At a recent gathering of aircraft type enthusiasts I attended, none of the 20-odd pilots were any longer members of AOPA.
The alternatives are equally bleak - especially as one of the alternative organisations is run by a past president who has been perceived by many to be at least as egotistical and unpredictable as recent AOPA pres's such as RHS.
Perhaps the renamed AUF will atttract more members......
Any ideas for representative and alternative voice for GA, Doug?
BTW if you visit the e-mailed link, you see this:
AOPA AGM Material
Financial Report FY 2003 (Coming Soon)
Information for members & Notice of AGM including Agenda
PDF DOC
Proxy Form (Coming Soon)
No sign of the Financial Report FY 2003, or means of voting!!!
aopa - little hope
there does not seem to be anybody remaining on the present board or those standing for election that has the experience or ability to save aopa
the deck chairs have just been moved on the sinking ship
seems those that scuttled the ship are still there?
the deck chairs have just been moved on the sinking ship
seems those that scuttled the ship are still there?
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movingforward
I am having a great difficulty in sussing the real motives for your post re the alleged expenses to which you refer.
Exactly what does;
mean.
Are you suggesting they spent it at the casino, or on wine women and song, or was it for legitimate expenses, authorised and incurred in the running of AOPA.
Weasel slurs in the manner of;
are just that.
I could send you copies of my expense sheets for the last year that would probably pay your mortgage for the next couple of years and get you change and unless you knew the what, when, where and why, you would be forgiven for saying they were outrageous.
If that makes me a profligate and irresponsible spender of my company's money, as you seem to suggest that AOPA directors have been, I would have been fired by my board and shareholders many years ago.
They wish they could replicate me and the other two, I just wish they'd let me stay home for a bit.
It's all context.
And neither you nor I nor anybody is qualified to make any judgements on any matters of expenditure of this kind without actually being part of the decision making process at the time, unless of course, it really was spent at the casino, or on wine, women and song.
I spend far too much of my life, sitting in business class in airline aircraft, travelling to what some would call exotic destinations staying at pubs that get featured on the Lifestyle Channel, just for going to work. Sounds exciting but watching paint dry is heaps more fun.
You might spend time in the nightly traffic jam watching an airliner leaving or arriving, I'm looking out the window of the said airliner at the traffic jam wishing I was in it, on the way to hearth and home.
It's just a matter of perspective.
I am having a great difficulty in sussing the real motives for your post re the alleged expenses to which you refer.
Exactly what does;
I hear the A-Team run up $20 - $30k on expenses, not good.
Are you suggesting they spent it at the casino, or on wine women and song, or was it for legitimate expenses, authorised and incurred in the running of AOPA.
Weasel slurs in the manner of;
It is worthwhile doing your own homework and not listen to the gravy train or gossip trial.
I could send you copies of my expense sheets for the last year that would probably pay your mortgage for the next couple of years and get you change and unless you knew the what, when, where and why, you would be forgiven for saying they were outrageous.
If that makes me a profligate and irresponsible spender of my company's money, as you seem to suggest that AOPA directors have been, I would have been fired by my board and shareholders many years ago.
They wish they could replicate me and the other two, I just wish they'd let me stay home for a bit.
It's all context.
And neither you nor I nor anybody is qualified to make any judgements on any matters of expenditure of this kind without actually being part of the decision making process at the time, unless of course, it really was spent at the casino, or on wine, women and song.
I spend far too much of my life, sitting in business class in airline aircraft, travelling to what some would call exotic destinations staying at pubs that get featured on the Lifestyle Channel, just for going to work. Sounds exciting but watching paint dry is heaps more fun.
You might spend time in the nightly traffic jam watching an airliner leaving or arriving, I'm looking out the window of the said airliner at the traffic jam wishing I was in it, on the way to hearth and home.
It's just a matter of perspective.
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No Talent
Bonez is right
There is no-one on the board who is capable of fixing the mess. It will be back to the old slogging it out with CASA stuff, financial mismanagement and a further reduction in membership. Coupled with rabid egos is the recipe for inevitable disaster.
I pity the poor sods who took out long term memberships. Not only because they are locked in but under the Hamilton proposal the Constitution will be changed so that members will not be guaranteed any future services after they have paid their subscriptions. How bizzare is that ???
Probably it would be in the best interests for members if AOPA was placed into the hands of Administrators.
I won't be re-joining when my renewal comes up in a couple of months. Will be looking for another representative organisation.
Does anyone know about a direct replacement for AOPA being formed ?
There is no-one on the board who is capable of fixing the mess. It will be back to the old slogging it out with CASA stuff, financial mismanagement and a further reduction in membership. Coupled with rabid egos is the recipe for inevitable disaster.
I pity the poor sods who took out long term memberships. Not only because they are locked in but under the Hamilton proposal the Constitution will be changed so that members will not be guaranteed any future services after they have paid their subscriptions. How bizzare is that ???
Probably it would be in the best interests for members if AOPA was placed into the hands of Administrators.
I won't be re-joining when my renewal comes up in a couple of months. Will be looking for another representative organisation.
Does anyone know about a direct replacement for AOPA being formed ?
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Fixable
Mr Stab
It is fixable but in my view, not in the hands of the Hamilton incumbents.
Their solution is to sex up the accounts hoping that the problem will go away.
It won't because the accounting treatment is a diversion from the real issues :
1. In 2003 expenses reduced by 4%, income by 11%.
2. There is no treasurer, there has been no budget or cash flow, no strategic plan.
3. When the Balance Sheet appears, add the cash and debtors and subtract from this the current liabilities. This suggests that the cash flow is very tight indeed and relies on the good offices of the creditors not to push for 30 day payments.
The problem can only be fixed by decreasing expenses and/or increasing revenue. Simple.
So instead of trying to change the mind of the auditors, the committee would be better off introducing some responsibility and stewardship.
It is fixable but in my view, not in the hands of the Hamilton incumbents.
Their solution is to sex up the accounts hoping that the problem will go away.
It won't because the accounting treatment is a diversion from the real issues :
1. In 2003 expenses reduced by 4%, income by 11%.
2. There is no treasurer, there has been no budget or cash flow, no strategic plan.
3. When the Balance Sheet appears, add the cash and debtors and subtract from this the current liabilities. This suggests that the cash flow is very tight indeed and relies on the good offices of the creditors not to push for 30 day payments.
The problem can only be fixed by decreasing expenses and/or increasing revenue. Simple.
So instead of trying to change the mind of the auditors, the committee would be better off introducing some responsibility and stewardship.
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It is like I said you need to do your own homework/research, and not take what is said at face value as fact and more than likely has come via means of the gossip train.
If you get a chance jump on http://www.google.com.au and key in certain individuals names that speak the loudest and see what other interests they have in aviation. You may see why these people want to close AOPA down, by saying all these false accusations. It appears ithere maybe some conflicts of interests when look past the smoke screen?
Here are some interesting links I have found and some of these are AOPA members too;
http://www.asfa.org.au/AGM2003.pdf
http://www.abc.net.au/goulburnmurray...es/s998475.htm
http://www.asfa.org.au/people.htm I believe “antechinus” is listed here too and a few others. There is a rumour and only a rumour I might add, that some of the people who resigned had contact with asfa. This maybe why some asfa members have spoken out and taken sides with the people who have resigned from AOPA? Who knows why, we all find out one day?
http://www2b.abc.net.au/4corners/sfo...posts/848.shtm
http://www.casa.gov.au/avreg/fsa/dow...1may/36-39.pdf
http://www.aopa.com.au/magazine/editorial/Ed.may96.html
“It appears politics is the big play that is killing AOPA when you see the names mentioned together”
THANKS TO RETIRING COMMITTEE MEMBERS
Three hard working AOPA committee members, Roy Schuh, David Cooke and Jenny Houghton retired from their non-executive
positions following the election. They have all worked incredibly hard for AOPA members over the past years but I would
especially like to mention Roy Schuh who has done so much for general aviation during his 19 years as a committee member. I am
also looking forward to many more achievements that can be gained by hard work from new committee members, Doug Stott, Bill
Hamilton and Russell Kelly
http://www.aopa.com.au/magazine/edit...Ed.July96.html
http://www.atsb.gov.au/aviation/research/mbz.pdf
http://www.mooney.org.au/Newsletters/may2001.pdf
http://www.aopa.com.au/magazine/editorial/Ed.Jun97.html
http://www.austatmsp.gov.au/ATM_StrategicPlan_LR.pdf
It appears things get very political when you read through all these sites and the list goes on. When you read through you would think some organisations are out to close AOPA down at all costs and take its members to bolster up their numbers. It is a shame these people cannot learn to work together instead of putting mud on each other.
zoom
If you get a chance jump on http://www.google.com.au and key in certain individuals names that speak the loudest and see what other interests they have in aviation. You may see why these people want to close AOPA down, by saying all these false accusations. It appears ithere maybe some conflicts of interests when look past the smoke screen?
Here are some interesting links I have found and some of these are AOPA members too;
http://www.asfa.org.au/AGM2003.pdf
http://www.abc.net.au/goulburnmurray...es/s998475.htm
http://www.asfa.org.au/people.htm I believe “antechinus” is listed here too and a few others. There is a rumour and only a rumour I might add, that some of the people who resigned had contact with asfa. This maybe why some asfa members have spoken out and taken sides with the people who have resigned from AOPA? Who knows why, we all find out one day?
http://www2b.abc.net.au/4corners/sfo...posts/848.shtm
http://www.casa.gov.au/avreg/fsa/dow...1may/36-39.pdf
http://www.aopa.com.au/magazine/editorial/Ed.may96.html
“It appears politics is the big play that is killing AOPA when you see the names mentioned together”
THANKS TO RETIRING COMMITTEE MEMBERS
Three hard working AOPA committee members, Roy Schuh, David Cooke and Jenny Houghton retired from their non-executive
positions following the election. They have all worked incredibly hard for AOPA members over the past years but I would
especially like to mention Roy Schuh who has done so much for general aviation during his 19 years as a committee member. I am
also looking forward to many more achievements that can be gained by hard work from new committee members, Doug Stott, Bill
Hamilton and Russell Kelly
http://www.aopa.com.au/magazine/edit...Ed.July96.html
http://www.atsb.gov.au/aviation/research/mbz.pdf
http://www.mooney.org.au/Newsletters/may2001.pdf
http://www.aopa.com.au/magazine/editorial/Ed.Jun97.html
http://www.austatmsp.gov.au/ATM_StrategicPlan_LR.pdf
It appears things get very political when you read through all these sites and the list goes on. When you read through you would think some organisations are out to close AOPA down at all costs and take its members to bolster up their numbers. It is a shame these people cannot learn to work together instead of putting mud on each other.
zoom
Last edited by movingforward; 29th Apr 2004 at 01:50.
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Thread run off the tracks ?
This thread has gone weird.
Mr "movingforward" is trying to shoot down messengers and deflect the discussion away from the mismanagement of AOPA.
I looked at some of those links and don't see what the problem is.
Now moving forward ....
What amazes me is that there has been no official explanation from those who recently resigned from AOPA.
Can someone please come on here and tell us why you quit ?
Seems like there is plenty of rumour and innuendo but little substance.
Mr "movingforward" is trying to shoot down messengers and deflect the discussion away from the mismanagement of AOPA.
I looked at some of those links and don't see what the problem is.
Now moving forward ....
What amazes me is that there has been no official explanation from those who recently resigned from AOPA.
Can someone please come on here and tell us why you quit ?
Seems like there is plenty of rumour and innuendo but little substance.
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The thread is running right on track.
The thread is running right on track.
Here is a misquote in the opening post,
This is the truth............
http://www.aopa.com.au/forum/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=179
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Author Message
aopa
Site Admin
Joined: 29 Apr 2003
Posts: 7
Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2004 4:01 pm Post subject: Closure of AOPA Forum
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
By order of the President of AOPA, Ron Lawford, the AOPA forum has been closed due to potentially damaging material being posted on the forum.
AOPA as publisher of the AOPA Forum may be held liable for any defamatory posts.
The Board of Directors will be discussing this issue immediately with a resolution on the matter expected soon.
Here is a misquote in the opening post,
As 24 hours have now passed since the meeting (?) I believe that whoever is now chairman has a responsibility to inform the membership of the facts without further delay by whatever means, including the use of this forum. To date there has been no information posted on the AOPA web site and the AOPA Forum has been closed since last Friday.
http://www.aopa.com.au/forum/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=179
View previous topic :: View next topic
Author Message
aopa
Site Admin
Joined: 29 Apr 2003
Posts: 7
Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2004 4:01 pm Post subject: Closure of AOPA Forum
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
By order of the President of AOPA, Ron Lawford, the AOPA forum has been closed due to potentially damaging material being posted on the forum.
AOPA as publisher of the AOPA Forum may be held liable for any defamatory posts.
The Board of Directors will be discussing this issue immediately with a resolution on the matter expected soon.
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No there is a simple explanation.
Movingforward is closely connected with the pro-Hamilton cheer squad web site.
That website cross publishes these postings, so a little cheerio call to the dissidents there, a repository for those banned by PPRuNe.
And whilst I am at it, a recent posting by a Mr Mitchell there claims that when I was AOPA Treasurer there were no budgets or cash flows.
This is a porkie. Send me an email & I will be happy to send you a copy of the budgets, cash flows, and financials with actuals cf budget. This is part of the big discredit Kelly & Stott campaign, neither of whom are standing for election or are on the board.
Maybe a website with all the relevant AOPA documentation would be interesting. There is enough material floating around to make Movingforward's pathetic attempts at 'research' look very amateurish.
Like to see the auditor's report ? The latest financials ? How about some juicy emails ? And what about the Report from KPMG to the board ? In the absence of any information from the board and the closure of AOPA Forum, it would perhaps be in the interests of members for this material to be published.
It would be far better for the board to come clean, as is their obligation, when the financial matters are so serious.
Cheers
Russell
Movingforward is closely connected with the pro-Hamilton cheer squad web site.
That website cross publishes these postings, so a little cheerio call to the dissidents there, a repository for those banned by PPRuNe.
And whilst I am at it, a recent posting by a Mr Mitchell there claims that when I was AOPA Treasurer there were no budgets or cash flows.
This is a porkie. Send me an email & I will be happy to send you a copy of the budgets, cash flows, and financials with actuals cf budget. This is part of the big discredit Kelly & Stott campaign, neither of whom are standing for election or are on the board.
Maybe a website with all the relevant AOPA documentation would be interesting. There is enough material floating around to make Movingforward's pathetic attempts at 'research' look very amateurish.
Like to see the auditor's report ? The latest financials ? How about some juicy emails ? And what about the Report from KPMG to the board ? In the absence of any information from the board and the closure of AOPA Forum, it would perhaps be in the interests of members for this material to be published.
It would be far better for the board to come clean, as is their obligation, when the financial matters are so serious.
Cheers
Russell