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Pilot Moving to US

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Pilot Moving to US

Old 24th Sep 2021, 08:54
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Pilot Moving to US

Hi, I would like your advise about what is the best way to start my pilot carreer at US. Got a greencard recently, hope to move to Miami.
Current experience FAA ATP -A320 , ICAO ATP PIC ATR 72-600 . Total Time +4200 ( Airline experience) , PIC Turboprop tt 2200. Time on Airbus a320 ( just the hours on SIM for type rating). Have a degree.
What is my best chance? Apply in a Regional, to the majors? or Cargo?
Thanks in advance for your comments.

Last edited by alfaro; 24th Sep 2021 at 18:08.
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Old 24th Sep 2021, 13:38
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Just apply to everyone and see what happens. There are plenty of regionals with 'flow' programs into the majors. Have you got a degree?
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Old 24th Sep 2021, 15:04
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Originally Posted by rudestuff View Post
Just apply to everyone and see what happens. There are plenty of regionals with 'flow' programs into the majors. Have you got a degree?
Exactly ! Since you have competitive numbers, apply to everyone. Proceed as if you were born and raised in Iowa. If you don't have a degree, that can be a problem at the legacy level but there are several career-destination airlines among the LCCs.

Good luck and let us know how your journey goes.
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Old 24th Sep 2021, 15:57
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Atlas Air is hiring: 74/77/76/73.
Recently arbitrated contract with average 30% pay increase.
Now on par with United/American narrow body pay both FO and PIC.
They have a MIA base but itís pretty senior.
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Old 24th Sep 2021, 17:22
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Hi guys, thanks for your reply. And yes I have a degree (background engineering). So, do you think there could be a chance for a major? let's say spirt or jetblue thinking about florida?

I'll let you know how it goes, and if you have additional comments will be appreciated.

Last edited by alfaro; 24th Sep 2021 at 18:09.
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Old 24th Sep 2021, 17:35
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There's no reason you shouldn't apply to the legacy carriers too. Lot's of hiring going on.

Don't get so attached to living in one particular city that you limit yourself.
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Old 24th Sep 2021, 17:37
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bafanguy Thanks for your advise, I'll keep it in mind.
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Old 24th Sep 2021, 17:45
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Keep in mind that some airlines require US Citizenship and some will prefer it although they may not specifically tell you.
So depending on supply/demand they may pass on you.
Just a fair warning.
Ironically if you decide to work for a company like Atlas (greencard allowed) you can pretty much live anywhere in the world once youíve got your citizenship.
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Old 24th Sep 2021, 18:01
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Originally Posted by B2N2 View Post
Keep in mind that some airlines require US Citizenship and some will prefer it although they may not specifically tell you.
So depending on supply/demand they may pass on you.
Just a fair warning.
Ironically if you decide to work for a company like Atlas (greencard allowed) you can pretty much live anywhere in the world once youíve got your citizenship.
Good to know, I'll give a try. Thanks again.
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Old 24th Sep 2021, 20:03
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I know that Delta hires green card holders...and no airline is fussier or snootier than Delta.
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Old 24th Sep 2021, 21:13
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Originally Posted by B2N2 View Post
Keep in mind that some airlines require US Citizenship and some will prefer it although they may not specifically tell you.
So depending on supply/demand they may pass on you.
Just a fair warning.
Ironically if you decide to work for a company like Atlas (greencard allowed) you can pretty much live anywhere in the world once youíve got your citizenship.
Iíve been a foreigner in these lands for over two decades now, so I know a thing or two about getting hired here, without being a citizen. Thatís really not the case anymore and really only in the cargo world, with certain military contracts. The reason they wonít specifically tell you, is because itís illegal under US law, unless thereís a genuine reason.

You keep pushing Atlas and while it has its proís itís not for everyone, especially those with families and young kids. Iíve got more than a handful of friends there and not a single one would stay there if they could leave for FEDEX/UPS or a legacy.
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Old 24th Sep 2021, 22:07
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Originally Posted by Kenny View Post
Iíve been a foreigner in these lands for over two decades now, so I know a thing or two about getting hired here, without being a citizen. Thatís really not the case anymore and really only in the cargo world, with certain military contracts. The reason they wonít specifically tell you, is because itís illegal under US law, unless thereís a genuine reason.

You keep pushing Atlas and while it has its proís itís not for everyone, especially those with families and young kids. Iíve got more than a handful of friends there and not a single one would stay there if they could leave for FEDEX/UPS or a legacy.
Thanks Kenny, about Atlas is because long time away from home? why is different to Fedex/UPS?
And as some you already mentioned I apply and see what happens.
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Old 25th Sep 2021, 12:34
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Originally Posted by Kenny View Post
Iíve been a foreigner in these lands for over two decades now, so I know a thing or two about getting hired here, without being a citizen. Thatís really not the case anymore and really only in the cargo world, with certain military contracts. The reason they wonít specifically tell you, is because itís illegal under US law, unless thereís a genuine reason.

You keep pushing Atlas and while it has its proís itís not for everyone, especially those with families and young kids. Iíve got more than a handful of friends there and not a single one would stay there if they could leave for FEDEX/UPS or a legacy.
Not pushing, Iíve mentioned it twice in an effort to provide helpful information.
I donít think FedEx/UPS is a reasonable expectation considering no flight time with a US ď121Ē carrier.
Delta hires with a green card may also be a misrepresentation of the facts.
So you know the details? Was this flow through from a affiliated regional? Internal recommendations? How much 121 PIC time?
Its like saying UPS hires without a degree without stating any context as certainly very few applicants without a degree have competitive experience.
My suggestion was a (relatively easy) way in with a heavy type rating and then move on to a Major.
Do with it as you please as my recommendation is worth exactly what you paid for it.
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Old 25th Sep 2021, 13:20
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Originally Posted by B2N2 View Post
Not pushing, Iíve mentioned it twice in an effort to provide helpful information.
I donít think FedEx/UPS is a reasonable expectation considering no flight time with a US ď121Ē carrier.
Delta hires with a green card may also be a misrepresentation of the facts.
So you know the details? Was this flow through from a affiliated regional? Internal recommendations? How much 121 PIC time?
Its like saying UPS hires without a degree without stating any context as certainly very few applicants without a degree have competitive experience.
My suggestion was a (relatively easy) way in with a heavy type rating and then move on to a Major.
Do with it as you please as my recommendation is worth exactly what you paid for it.
B2N2,

I think Iíve fallen foul of the ďtone not coming across with replyĒ pitfall. Apologies, if my response came across as a bit dismissive. Wasnít the intent.

So, yesÖyou do have a point with DAL. Many years ago, their ďhesitancyĒ with alien residents permeated down to their regional partners. ASA didnít look at anyone that wasnít a citizen, post 9-11. It was well known at the time but disguised under the veil of ďthe requirements of bringing anyone onboard, that isnít a citizen, is too involvedĒ. ACA, on the other hand didnít mind and at the time Ď01-Ď04 they went above and beyond to figure out the ever changing rules.

Iíve sat down and talked with an interview captain, been through the ďfixitĒ email process, had my foreign degree validated and have a very good friend in the training department at DAL. So Iím aware of the hoop jumping thatís required to even be offered an interview. If you go back about 10 years, I would agree with you. Any non-citizen might fall at the first hurdle because they simply werenít educated in the US; Iíve got a Mech Eng degree from London University, so not a Micky Mouse degree but the Brits donít use the GPA system to grade their degrees. So I couldnít answer their ďwhatís your GPAĒ question. They have their square holes and that instantly puts you in the round peg boxÖ.No soup for you.

Having talked to a few guys recently at the regionals, that seems to have changed at DAL and they seem to have calmed down a bit with how they view round pegs. Of course, requirements change as the quality and experience level of your applicant pool changes. I think that currently and certainly moving forward, if youíre legally able to live and work in the US and donít require sponsorship, being a citizen will be less of an issue for anyone that meets all the other requirements and has a competitive resume.

Hope weíre goodÖÖ


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Old 25th Sep 2021, 13:26
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Originally Posted by B2N2 View Post
Not pushing, Iíve mentioned it twice in an effort to provide helpful information.
I donít think FedEx/UPS is a reasonable expectation considering no flight time with a US ď121Ē carrier.
Delta hires with a green card may also be a misrepresentation of the facts.
So you know the details? Was this flow through from a affiliated regional? Internal recommendations? How much 121 PIC time?
Its like saying UPS hires without a degree without stating any context as certainly very few applicants without a degree have competitive experience.
My suggestion was a (relatively easy) way in with a heavy type rating and then move on to a Major.
Do with it as you please as my recommendation is worth exactly what you paid for it.
UPS has just hired at least 9 ex EK guys, so I donít think that 121 experience is necessary, probably just desirable.
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Old 25th Sep 2021, 13:35
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Originally Posted by alfaro View Post
Thanks Kenny, about Atlas is because long time away from home? why is different to Fedex/UPS?
And as some you already mentioned I apply and see what happens.
Like everywhere else in the world there are different “tiers” of airlines. I’m going to try to diplomatic and generic here but I’ll probably upset someone and I’m sure others will disagree. For the most part, Legacy airlines like United, Delta and American are considered to be at the top of the pyramid when it comes to where you want to get to. Then Southwest and JetBlue and Horizon followed by Frontier, Spirit….etc. You get the overall idea.

The same applies to the Cargo carriers. FedEx and UPS are at the top. Then Atlas followed by the rest. My friends at FedEx and Atlas have told me that the difference are the FedEx schedules. At Atlas you can be away from home for up to 18 days a month with days off, on the road. So, not really a fit for some one with small kids or a wife, they actually like.

Let me just say before there are howls of “But, but, but”. For some Southwest is a far better fit than a legacy and considered a much more desirable place to go. Also, in no way am I suggesting that if you go to any other airline than a legacy, you’re somehow not as good. We all have our requirements and you go where you want and where you get an interview.

Last edited by Kenny; 25th Sep 2021 at 13:57. Reason: Not enough caffeine.
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Old 25th Sep 2021, 13:40
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Originally Posted by Oldaircrew View Post
UPS has just hired at least 9 ex EK guys, so I don’t think that 121 experience is necessary, probably just desirable.
United also. I know of at least one Cathay skipper that got the job and there are a lot of former EK guys knocking about. But you want to tick as many boxes as you can, to stand the best chance. So it does help.
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Old 25th Sep 2021, 14:22
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Originally Posted by Kenny View Post
Any non-citizen might fall at the first hurdle because they simply weren’t educated in the US;
...seems to have changed at DAL and they seem to have calmed down a bit with how they view round pegs.
Things indeed have calmed down a little bit at DL and they needed to. This from the pilot recruiting page on the employee website acknowledges acceptance of foreign degrees. I'm not sure how long this has been the case but certainly as long as I can remember:
  • Graduate of a four-year degree program from a college or university accredited by a U.S. Dept. of Education recognized accrediting organization.
  • Degrees obtained from a non-U.S. institution must be evaluated for equivalency to U.S. degrees by a member organization of the National Association of Credential Evaluation Services (NACES).
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Old 25th Sep 2021, 15:00
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Should be able to skip going to a regional.

Apply to Allegiant, Spirit, Frontier etc. Iím at Allegiant and was hired as a green card holder. Lotís of green card holders here with no US experience.
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Old 25th Sep 2021, 15:34
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Originally Posted by fuelsurvey View Post
Should be able to skip going to a regional.

Apply to Allegiant, Spirit, Frontier etc. Iím at Allegiant and was hired as a green card holder. Lotís of green card holders here with no US experience.
Again, you have to see those in their context.
Were they hired Ď18/Ď19?
Simply because it happened under a particular set of circumstances doesnít mean it will happen under current market.
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