Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > PPRuNe Worldwide > North America
Reload this Page >

Non immigrants work permit and pilot job.

North America Still the busiest region for commercial aviation.

Non immigrants work permit and pilot job.

Old 6th Aug 2021, 10:06
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: France
Age: 37
Posts: 106
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Non immigrants work permit and pilot job.

Hello all.

Here is the situation. I m from Europe 36years old, with 5000TT and current flying as CPT on 737ng until end of this summer season.
I have previous experience on C510 Mustang, Embraer 170/190, Dash 8 Q400.

The employer of my wife if thinking to create a USA branch (they are already doing business in USA) and would like to send my wife overseas as manager, it will give her a E2 Visa as investors, what is a non immigrants Visa. From what we understood on internet it will give me the possibility to have a non immigrants work permit for 2 years, that can be renewed unlimited depending the E2 of my wife and her job.

Here is the question : can I find a job as pilot after conversion of my EASA licence in FAA with my 2 year renewable non immigrants work permit ? Or does airline will not take any risk because every 2 years I could be "kick out" depending of the business of my wife.
I don't really mind to be a first officer or the type of aircraft, but with my experience is that possible to think to do a Direct entry Captain in some regional airline ? Or more ? In VIP ?

Any advice and answer are really appreciated as if I can t work, even if this opportunity is amazing for my wife, it is going to be difficult to make it works (her employer want her to go at least for 5 year, to launch and do all the set up, I m 'ot going to not fly for 5 years)

Thanks for your answer.
Flocks is offline  
Old 6th Aug 2021, 12:17
  #2 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Mexico City
Posts: 629
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Flocks View Post
Hello all.

Here is the situation. I m from Europe 36years old, with 5000TT and current flying as CPT on 737ng until end of this summer season.
I have previous experience on C510 Mustang, Embraer 170/190, Dash 8 Q400.

The employer of my wife if thinking to create a USA branch (they are already doing business in USA) and would like to send my wife overseas as manager, it will give her a E2 Visa as investors, what is a non immigrants Visa. From what we understood on internet it will give me the possibility to have a non immigrants work permit for 2 years, that can be renewed unlimited depending the E2 of my wife and her job.

Here is the question : can I find a job as pilot after conversion of my EASA licence in FAA with my 2 year renewable non immigrants work permit ? Or does airline will not take any risk because every 2 years I could be "kick out" depending of the business of my wife.
I don't really mind to be a first officer or the type of aircraft, but with my experience is that possible to think to do a Direct entry Captain in some regional airline ? Or more ? In VIP ?

Any advice and answer are really appreciated as if I can t work, even if this opportunity is amazing for my wife, it is going to be difficult to make it works (her employer want her to go at least for 5 year, to launch and do all the set up, I m 'ot going to not fly for 5 years)

Thanks for your answer.
​​​​​​It is possible to get employed on an EAD (employment authorization document) at an airline in the USA. An employer in the USA can only ask to see the documents that prove you are legal to work, they can't ask how long it is valid for.

​​​​​​You can not be a Capt in the USA for a part 121 carrier unless you have 1000 hours operating as a crew member in a 121 operation (FO usually but part 135 PIC is eligible too).

​​​​​​I would stay away from regional airlines and go with a business jet operator. It will be a good introduction to flying in the USA without the months long commitment of airline training footprint.
​​​​
Climb150 is offline  
Old 6th Aug 2021, 14:51
  #3 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Ormond Beach
Age: 47
Posts: 12
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Climb150 View Post
​​​​​​It is possible to get employed on an EAD (employment authorization document) at an airline in the USA. An employer in the USA can only ask to see the documents that prove you are legal to work, they can't ask how long it is valid for.
​​​​
They can absolutely ask, especially since the EAD clearly displays an expiration date. Now, whether or not they actually DO ask is another matter...

Another issue may be whether or not the candidate is able to exit and re-enter the US without difficulty, depending on their current citizenship.
flyboyike is offline  
Old 6th Aug 2021, 21:05
  #4 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Mexico City
Posts: 629
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by flyboyike View Post
They can absolutely ask, especially since the EAD clearly displays an expiration date. Now, whether or not they actually DO ask is another matter...

Another issue may be whether or not the candidate is able to exit and re-enter the US without difficulty, depending on their current citizenship.
The guy said he is European so that's not an issue.
  • Are you legally authorized to work in the United States for our Company?
This is the only question the employer can legally ask you prior to being hired. They can not ask which visa you are on or the visa duration.
Climb150 is offline  
Old 6th Aug 2021, 21:34
  #5 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: France
Age: 37
Posts: 106
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Thanks for the answer, I really appreciate, ofc it I need to look deeper in all of this but it seems good news so far. I have a friend in a regional feeder in USA, he told me more or less the same, to try to find a job with a quick upgrade or direct entry CPT in part 135 and after some time, try to join a major.

My wife and I spoke today with a layer, it would give me a multiple (for entry and exit of USA) visa for a duration of 5 years initially and can be renewed unlimited depending of my wife situation + a work permit valid and to renew every 2 years.

Not the most important but I already have some USA and Canada experience as my European airline was doing wet lease in Canada the winter, so I operated the 737 as CPT in North America for little bit of time.
Flocks is offline  
Old 6th Aug 2021, 23:03
  #6 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: FL, USA
Posts: 3,011
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Nobody will offer you a Direct Entry Capt position as you have ZERO flight time in the USA. There are also half a million pilots in the USA with 5000 hrs and a 73 type rating.
Under part 121 youíll need a 1000 hrs as SIC as stated above. Doesnít matter what airplane type, itís the regulations that you fly under.
Part 135 itís usually insurance requirements that determine upgrade. Total time, total jet time, PIC time and time on type.
Insurance companies will generally ignore time flown outside of the US as it can be hard to verify.

https://nbaa.org/flight-department-a...ersonnel/pria/

US 121/135 operators canít force a foreign operator to hand over pilot records.
B2N2 is online now  
Old 7th Aug 2021, 22:14
  #7 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: FL, USA
Posts: 3,011
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
The employer of my wife if thinking to create a USA branch (they are already doing business in USA) and would like to send my wife overseas as manager, it will give her a E2 Visa as investors, what is a non immigrants Visa
Not to be totally negative, look into a L1/L2 visa instead as that is one of the few that allow application for a green card.
The E2 does not as far as I know.
B2N2 is online now  
Old 8th Aug 2021, 04:30
  #8 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: US via Oz, Honkers & Blighty.
Posts: 346
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Climb150 View Post
The guy said he is European so that's not an issue.
  • Are you legally authorized to work in the United States for our Company?
This is the only question the employer can legally ask you prior to being hired. They can not ask which visa you are on or the visa duration.
They may or may not be able to ask what particular visa you are on but every US airline Iíve worked for, over the last 20 years has asked for a copy of either my EAD (when I had one) or my Green Card to go with my employee file and that, they can legally ask for. Itís a requirement to get a crew ID and SIDA clearance.
Kenny is offline  
Old 8th Aug 2021, 09:05
  #9 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: France
Age: 37
Posts: 106
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Thanks for all your answer.

I totally understand that they can ask for the Visa, The only question for me is, if it is written 2 years on it, does airline will not hire me ?

About the hours certification, everytime I changed airline, I asked to have my log book stamped, it that not enough ?
The only hours with no stamps, would be when I was flying as flight instructor.

​​​​​​

Flocks is offline  
Old 10th Aug 2021, 00:18
  #10 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: FL, USA
Posts: 3,011
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Flocks View Post

About the hours certification, everytime I changed airline, I asked to have my log book stamped, it that not enough ?
The only hours with no stamps, would be when I was flying as flight instructor.

​​​​​​
Click on the link and read up on PRIA, itís a little more then verifying your hours.
Let me reverse the question, would Air France hire me and give me a direct entry Capt position because my logbook has been stamped?
Any European airline?
Why do you expect it then?
B2N2 is online now  
Old 10th Aug 2021, 03:09
  #11 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: US via Oz, Honkers & Blighty.
Posts: 346
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
B2, deep breath bud, deep breath.

I don’t think English is Flocks’ mother tongue and the fact that he’s simply trying to work out what’s possible given he’s only got experience of the Euro system, hasn’t come across.

Getting a company stamp in your logbook is standard issue and the norm throughout most of the rest of the world. We have other means here in the US, so it’s reasonable for him to ask why it’s not enough, if it’s all he’s ever had to do.

Oh and as far as PRIA is concerned, a US carrier only has to apply for records from a foreign carrier, they don’t actually have to receive anything in order to satisfy the PRIA requirements.
Kenny is offline  
Old 10th Aug 2021, 13:13
  #12 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: FL, USA
Posts: 3,011
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
* breathing *
True about PRIA, however to limit liability a 121 carrier will have to demonstrate it has done its part in verifying employment and drug testing records as well as any punitive actions taken against the pilot.
The 121 PIC requirements are what they are and in 135 insurance company largely determines upgrades.
Acquaintance of mine came from PIC on a Heavy and TRI/TRE at a Middle Eastern carrier to FO on a A320 in the USA.
So apologize if I came across harsh but thatís the reality.

Last edited by B2N2; 10th Aug 2021 at 13:33.
B2N2 is online now  
Old 10th Aug 2021, 16:12
  #13 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: France
Age: 37
Posts: 106
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Ofc if you want to have direct entry Captain in Air-France it is impost (how did you guess I m French &#129315, no chance for nobody in fact, because as big US airline, it is a seniority airline so all new entry will go as FO A320.

Now, if you have a work permit in Europe, the EASA licence and you apply for a direct entry CPT because you have the requirements of the advert, I don't see why it would not work, it is really risky to lie on your log book as if anything happens and it is discovered that you were lying, you will end up really in a bad position ... I will not say that nobody do that, but I m sure it is rare at this end, even more if like me you have 10years or more experience. Currently I operate as 737 CPT, same as in USA I believe, my upgrade was a long process, it was nothing just given to me.

Now saying that, I understand that US is a different systems and as said before, I don't see a problem to fly as FO, it is different part of the world, different ATC, ...

​​​​​So if I understand well, with my profile :

Part 121 : I need 1000hr FAA for any upgrade, so I can apply to any job of FO and after 1000hr I could upgrade in regional airline.

Part 135 : technically I have the requirements to be Captain, but no airline will give me this position as insurance will block it
So same I need to apply as FO but I could potentially upgrade faster in part 135 and after 1000hr on FAA plane, I could also go to part 121.

I m right ?

How much I can expect as FO with my profile ? I know you are going to tell me it depends of the operator but to have a rough idea?


​​​​​
Flocks is offline  
Old 10th Aug 2021, 17:02
  #14 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: USA
Posts: 3,017
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Flocks View Post
How much I can expect as FO with my profile ? I know you are going to tell me it depends of the operator but to have a rough idea?​​​​​
Flocks,

You can find approximate pay rates for many carriers by going to this website and clicking on "airline profiles" in the upper left hand corner. The rates may not be completely up to date, but it's an idea of what to expect:

https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/





bafanguy is offline  
Old 10th Aug 2021, 23:08
  #15 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: FL, USA
Posts: 3,011
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Flocks

You are correct.
As far as FO wages in the USA, itís (almost) literally from $20k/year to $200k/year depending on The Who, The Where and The What.
Airlinepilots is a very good resource.
B2N2 is online now  
Old 11th Aug 2021, 14:06
  #16 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: N/A
Posts: 1,186
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Can anyone recommend an immigration attorney in the US who has experience dealing with airline pilots looking for a EB-2 National Interest Waiver?

Asking for a friend..
student88 is offline  
Old 11th Aug 2021, 14:24
  #17 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Ormond Beach
Age: 47
Posts: 12
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Climb150 View Post
The guy said he is European so that's not an issue.
  • Are you legally authorized to work in the United States for our Company?
This is the only question the employer can legally ask you prior to being hired. They can not ask which visa you are on or the visa duration.
Well...as with many legal things, you're right and wrong at the same time. You are correct in that that may be the only QUESTION an employer can ask, but then we get to the matter of the I-9 form where the employee must provide documents verifying employment eligibility. If one of those documents is an EAD, it has an expiration date, which means eligibility will need to be reverified prior to that date. And yes, I speak from personal experience.
flyboyike is offline  
Old 11th Aug 2021, 14:29
  #18 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Ormond Beach
Age: 47
Posts: 12
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Flocks View Post
Ofc if you want to have direct entry Captain in Air-France it is impost (how did you guess I m French &#129315, no chance for nobody in fact, because as big US airline, it is a seniority airline so all new entry will go as FO A320.

Now, if you have a work permit in Europe, the EASA licence and you apply for a direct entry CPT because you have the requirements of the advert, I don't see why it would not work, it is really risky to lie on your log book as if anything happens and it is discovered that you were lying, you will end up really in a bad position ... I will not say that nobody do that, but I m sure it is rare at this end, even more if like me you have 10years or more experience. Currently I operate as 737 CPT, same as in USA I believe, my upgrade was a long process, it was nothing just given to me.

Now saying that, I understand that US is a different systems and as said before, I don't see a problem to fly as FO, it is different part of the world, different ATC, ...

​​​​​So if I understand well, with my profile :

Part 121 : I need 1000hr FAA for any upgrade, so I can apply to any job of FO and after 1000hr I could upgrade in regional airline.

Part 135 : technically I have the requirements to be Captain, but no airline will give me this position as insurance will block it
So same I need to apply as FO but I could potentially upgrade faster in part 135 and after 1000hr on FAA plane, I could also go to part 121.

I m right ?

How much I can expect as FO with my profile ? I know you are going to tell me it depends of the operator but to have a rough idea?


​​​​​
I mean...if you build your schedule right, it may be easier for you to commute to your job in Europe rather than to find something here. I have several friends who commute from Europe to the US for work (one from Frankfurt, one from Verona, and one from London). It's not the easiest way to do things, but it's manageable. I don't see why it won't work the other way around.
flyboyike is offline  
Old 11th Aug 2021, 17:17
  #19 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: FL, USA
Posts: 3,011
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by student88 View Post
Can anyone recommend an immigration attorney in the US who has experience dealing with airline pilots looking for a EB-2 National Interest Waiver?

Asking for a friend..
Yes.
https://www.pineslaw.com/about-us
B2N2 is online now  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information

Copyright © 2022 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.