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FAA License Conversion Advice: Regionals or I Pay by myself??

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FAA License Conversion Advice: Regionals or I Pay by myself??

Old 12th Sep 2019, 04:08
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Originally Posted by flyby71
All USA legacies require a minimum of a bachelor degree besides unrestricted ATP and at least 5000 TT. I know this for a fact because i fly for one of them.
except AA.
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Old 12th Sep 2019, 13:25
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Originally Posted by flyby71
All USA legacies require a minimum of a bachelor degree besides unrestricted ATP and at least 5000 TT. I know this for a fact because i fly for one of them.
Let me add, that only Delta and FedEx require a bachelors degree. For the rest of the big six it’s only preferred. But in reality you won’t get a call if you don’t have a degree.
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Old 12th Sep 2019, 13:50
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very true, bachelor degree not required but preferred, just like the minimum hours flown.
i haven't flown with any fo without a 4 year degree nor minimum hours required on their websites.
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Old 12th Sep 2019, 14:18
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Originally Posted by havick


except AA.
UA's hired civilians pilots with less than 2500 TT. DL has hired civilian pilots with barely more than 2,000 hrs TT.

So there's no '5,0000 TT' requirement. But frequently the person hired is someone 'connected' if they have less than 3000 hrs TT.

The typical new hire is more like 5,000+ hrs TT and 1,000 hrs (1,300+?) PIC (TPIC?).
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Old 12th Sep 2019, 14:37
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United CPP
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Old 12th Sep 2019, 15:37
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Originally Posted by flyby71
All USA legacies require a minimum of a bachelor degree besides unrestricted ATP and at least 5000 TT. I know this for a fact because i fly for one of them.
I got hired at a legacy with less than 5000TT. There were also several flow throughs in my class without bachelor degrees. Having said that; no bachelor degree makes it next to impossible to get hired unless you have a flow program.
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Old 26th Jan 2020, 12:34
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To Sunrig, flyby71, and zondaracer, thank you all for this information. My husband amonghtus does have a 4-year degree. But, of course, it is a foreign degree. We are actually right now looking into the process for accrediting his foreign degree. So far, all I can find for certainty is that US carriers accept degree accreditation from companies which are members of the NACES credential evaluation organization. However, the directory list is quite long and research into each of the companies results in a mix of confusing and contradictory customer reviews. Considering you all mentioned degrees in this thread, perhaps, do you know specifically of which accreditation companies the majors would accept (or prefer)?

Also Misd-agin, concerning your comment, yes, my husband has started keeping two logbooks (his original paper copy and an electronic one). So now, during his interviews, he can show the US carriers his flying hours according to FAA regulation and according to his company's standards. To avoid any miscommunication or misrepresentation of his flying hours.
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Old 29th Jan 2020, 04:15
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I notice that some legacy carriers seem to be dropping the PIC requirements in their stipulated minimums. Some now specify SIC and 1,000 TT. Is this a a sign of pilot shortage impacting available qualified candidates? Not sure what the actual recruitment minimums are in practice but would be interested to hear.

I’m starting my training soon on the EASA route, with a jet job (A320) lined up when I qualify in Europe. I also have a greencard and was thinking about coming back to the US after I get the 1,500 hours TT, but wondered what routes would be open to me. Anybody know what level of hours LCC’s like Jetblue, Southwest, Frontier are after?

Cheers
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Old 29th Jan 2020, 09:16
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Originally Posted by Flys4Funs
I notice that some legacy carriers seem to be dropping the PIC requirements in their stipulated minimums. Some now specify SIC and 1,000 TT. Is this a a sign of pilot shortage impacting available qualified candidates? Not sure what the actual recruitment minimums are in practice but would be interested to hear.
...wondered what routes would be open to me. Anybody know what level of hours LCC’s like Jetblue, Southwest, Frontier are after?
F4F,

Those are good and logical questions. Problem is, little reliable data is available to answer them and some answers would require clairvoyance. If carriers are posting actual quals of those they hire, I haven't seen them. Perhaps someone with access to ALPA data might be able to locate this info. And then, by the time you finish school and become competitive, it all may have changed.

As for your potential future return to the US with 1,500 hours to fly at the airline level, your best planning parameter would be to think in terms of a regional.

The data we do have is mandatory retirements for many of the US carriers (see Airline Pilot Central for airline profiles). Attrition out the top of the food chain will drive hiring demand (not factoring in a recession or other major negative event which could slow or even stop hiring...growth is too much of a wild card to call). The data I can lay my hands on quickly says that for AA and DL, as examples, the retirement bell curve peaks somewhere around 2024/2025(+/-) with impressive numbers after that but still the downside of the curve.

As for "legacy carriers" dropping requirements, not too sure about that; min requirements aren't reflective of who actually gets hired. FARs here require an ATPL for F/Os in Part 121 ops so r-ATPL min flight times would be required. While ex-mil can get a r-ATPL at 750 hours, I'd opine that legacy carriers aren't hiring them or any applicants at min FAR flight times. The competition is just too fierce for min time to be competitive. There may be some alterations such as dropping the turbine PIC time requirement for example but that doesn't make the competition less intense in terms of total experience.

I'll venture a guess that the LCCs are similar with essentially equal competitive factors at work. Some of these LCCs are morphing into career-destination spots. No airlines at the legacy/LCC/ULCC levels are hard up for qualified applicants.

I wish I could answer your questions with some confidence in the accuracy of the answers but I can't. Other opinions will follow.

Hang in there and stay tuned.

Last edited by bafanguy; 29th Jan 2020 at 09:28.
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Old 29th Jan 2020, 14:57
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Thanks for the detailed response Bafanguy. You are right, it is a bit of a shot in the dark to try and predict how recruitment will be in a few years time either side of the Atlantic. It will certainly be interesting to watch it unfold....... hopefully positively.....

The decision I’m ultimately looking at with 1,500 hours TT with a EASA LCC is to stay Euro side and either progress on to left seat or; join a flag carrier here (which seems a well trodden path from my future employer - even for those with minimal TT and a frozen ATPL); or take a punt in the US market probably regional maybe LCC.

I’d rather be based in the US and the US legacy carriers to me seem to be pretty much top of the tree, but getting there seems to be a something of a crap shoot.......Will see I guess....
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Old 29th Jan 2020, 15:44
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Originally Posted by Flys4Funs
The decision I’m ultimately looking at with 1,500 hours TT with a EASA LCC is to stay Euro side...or take a punt in the US market probably regional maybe LCC.

...the US legacy carriers to me seem to be pretty much top of the tree, but getting there seems to be a something of a crap shoot.......Will see I guess....
F4F,

You're in an enviable position with the ability to live and work either side of the Atlantic. Options are precious.

And, yes, it's a crap shoot getting to the top of that tree. Some really good people get left behind for silly reasons.
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Old 29th Jan 2020, 15:48
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@ Flys4Funs
I think to get hired at a Legacy today, you should have around 5-6000 hours TT with a preferred 1000 hours TPIC and of course a 4-year degree with a clean trainings background. Additional experience like being a check airman, sim instructor or being a chief pilot helps a lot to get on top of the application stack. They also like to see some volunteer/ community work. For the LCC you should be able to get a call around 3000 hours total time. This reflects the hiring right now, nobody knows what it looks like in a couple of years. If your goal is really to fly in the US I don’t understand why you start the EASA training? Why not get all your FAA licenses right away? That would not also save you all the conversion costs from EASA to FAA but also give you valuable pt 121 experience in the US. If you apply with 1500 hours from Europe no HR person is going to know what kind of background/training quality you come from. They will also choose-prefer someone from a Regional where they know what kind of standard they can expect. In a nutshell- I think you would be progressing faster if you get all your training and required experience in the US.

Last edited by Sunrig; 29th Jan 2020 at 16:16.
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Old 29th Jan 2020, 17:54
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Thanks for the insights Sunrig very helpful. Those hours seem pretty reasonable, especially the LCC entry point. As Bafana mentioned I would certainly see the likes of JB/SW as career destination airlines.

Your question is a fair one and we each have our own circumstances, and both routes certainly have their pros and cons.

For me personally I managed to get onto an airline scheme with a reputable LCC in Europe that will guarantee me a job in the RHS of a 320 in 18 months time (assuming I pass the course with no issues). So in four years time I hope to have around 2000 hrs TT plus my original 250 training hours.

If I was younger I probably would have gone the US route, and tried to join one of the legacy feeder regional airlines. But given this is my second career, time is of the essence, and the way I looked at it in four years time if I trained in the US I’d have completed my training in about 10 months then instructed for the next 3 years to build the required 1,500 hours. Then I would have to hope that regional airlines are still in a good position to start building some 121/TT.

Going the European route in four years time I could convert to FAA (which seems more straightforward than converting the other way - albeit still painful and expensive) and if it was still a good option at that point try and get a job in a regional or LCC stateside.

If things have changed or I don’t get any luck in the US then I would not be far off a command in the Euro LCC.

Not sure there was a right answer - but that’s my thought process and where I’ve ended up.
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Old 1st Feb 2020, 12:30
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Originally Posted by Flys4Funs
Thanks for the insights Sunrig very helpful. Those hours seem pretty reasonable, especially the LCC entry point. As Bafana mentioned I would certainly see the likes of JB/SW as career destination airlines.

Your question is a fair one and we each have our own circumstances, and both routes certainly have their pros and cons.

For me personally I managed to get onto an airline scheme with a reputable LCC in Europe that will guarantee me a job in the RHS of a 320 in 18 months time (assuming I pass the course with no issues). So in four years time I hope to have around 2000 hrs TT plus my original 250 training hours.

If I was younger I probably would have gone the US route, and tried to join one of the legacy feeder regional airlines. But given this is my second career, time is of the essence, and the way I looked at it in four years time if I trained in the US I’d have completed my training in about 10 months then instructed for the next 3 years to build the required 1,500 hours. Then I would have to hope that regional airlines are still in a good position to start building some 121/TT.

Going the European route in four years time I could convert to FAA (which seems more straightforward than converting the other way - albeit still painful and expensive) and if it was still a good option at that point try and get a job in a regional or LCC stateside.

If things have changed or I don’t get any luck in the US then I would not be far off a command in the Euro LCC.

Not sure there was a right answer - but that’s my thought process and where I’ve ended up.
In the U.S. the most common path is 10-12 months of training, 1.5 years CFI and move to a regional with 1,500 hrs TT.

The majors have stated in the last they really like 1,000 hrs of 121 Captain experience. There’s always exceptions but people should try to get their resumes to agree with the majority of the new hires vs choosing a path few get hired from.

The path to getting 1,000 hrs Part 121 TPIC starts with upgrading to Captain about 2-3 years after starting at a regional. TT would be in the 3-4,000 range. Add in 1,000 hrs 121 TPIC in the next 1.5-2 years and it’s a 7-9(?) year path. 4-5,000 TT and 1,000 hrs Part 121 TPIC.

Check out airline pilot central.com. It’s specifically focused on U.S. airlines.

US legacies have required an avg of 4-6,000 in TT in recent years.
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Old 23rd Mar 2023, 12:56
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Same question 3 years later

Hey guys and gals! Faced with the same dilemma that the original post author faced back in '19. FO with 3000+ turbine hours looking to hopefully get into the majors. 40 years old and family of 4 restricts me a bit when it comes to salary, otherwise I wouldnt mind doing a few years with regionals/LCC until my time comes. Any direction/advice is most appreciated.
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