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HELP....life changing advice needed!

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HELP....life changing advice needed!

Old 12th Jul 2006, 19:12
  #1 (permalink)  
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: UK
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HELP....life changing advice needed!

I have come to a point in my career were I need to make some very important decisions and would greatly appreciate any input from you experienced guys and girls over there in the USA.

I have qualified with a JAA frozen ATPL, and am within touching distance of a 737 or 757 job in the UK. Problem being is that my American fiancee is pregnant and living in Florida with no ability to move away.

In addition to this possibly very lucrative offer in the UK, I am looking at a Dash 8 job close to N.America that would give me approx 800hrs per year and give me an OK wage with a Dash 8 Type Rating, and would allow me plenty of time off to visit my fiancee in the USA whilst providing us with some $$$$.

Lastly we could get married and move straight to Florida to work as a Flight Instructor for (correct me if I'm wrong) approx $1500-2000 per month and climb the long ladder slowly over time.

Now, after looking at salaries of F/O's in the USA, I am truely astonished how low the pay is ($1600-$1900), and I believe that EVERYONE no matter how much experience goes in at the YEAR 1 hourly wage. Is this correct, even if I have time on Dash 8's?

Can somebody offer any helpful advice on my 3 options or clarify any of the points I have made regarding jobs/salaries in the USA, namely SW Florida.

Any info or help would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks a Million

R&B
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Old 12th Jul 2006, 20:28
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R & B,

I'll bet there are a lot of UK pilots who dream of having your dilema!

Sounds to me like option B, the Dash 8 job near the US offers you the best compromise between building your career and fulfilling your family obligations. If there was some way to get your fiancee out to the UK to take the boeing job, that would deffinitely be the best. If that is not an option, the Dash 8 job sounds pretty good to me, you get to build valuable turbine time in a crew cockpit enviroment flying for (I presume) a scheduled part 121 operation.

If you later decide to switch to a US operation you will find that your Turbine experience will give you a lot more options and probably allow you to upgrade to Captain a lot sooner.
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Old 12th Jul 2006, 22:24
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Join Date: Feb 2004
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Originally Posted by run_and_break
I
Problem being is that my American fiancee is pregnant and living in Florida with no ability to move away

R&B

Would you have the ability to move her to the UK if you married her ? Are you the father ? Was she a one-night stand? Then marry her...take your better job in the UK in a turbojet airplane...and make a life there. You've let the little head think for the big head. Time to get up on your hind legs like a man and do the right thing. YOU participated in the creation of another life...act like it.

Don't like that answer ? Shoulda thought about THAT before you dropped your pants.

Life's messy, Kid. Clean it up.
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Old 13th Jul 2006, 02:19
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She cannot move to the UK due to other commitments.

.....and I AM trying to clear things up, hence my asking for help and advice.

Thankyou

R&B
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Old 13th Jul 2006, 11:16
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Advice is support the Mother of your child and provide for your family

How can you be a long distance dad at such a critical time ?

Either tell mum that she is moving to Europe (not a good idea for her if she is about to birth , but a better career one for you possibly)

Or take the local job and have fun changing nappies

Tough choice but being a dad is great and will give you a new perspective on life
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Old 13th Jul 2006, 13:39
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Originally Posted by run_and_break
She cannot move to the UK due to other commitments.
R&B,

Not to bust your chops ( but you did ask for advice ), but you two now have no BIGGER commitment...and all other considerations have been replaced by it. I know it's one of those life events where "...you don't know it 'til you live it...", but unfazed nail it.

I don't see how you three could live on regional FO pay so maybe getting her and your impending bundle of joy to Europe for better pay might be worth a serious look.

Hang in there, dad.
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Old 13th Jul 2006, 17:43
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There's alot of flying in S. FL. presuming you have a "Green Card" and an FAA certificate.
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Old 25th Jul 2006, 12:15
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Stay away from South Florida! You might get stuck. I agree with Bafanguy--find a way to make it work in Europe...
Good Luck
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Old 26th Jul 2006, 12:56
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Originally Posted by unfazed
Advice is support the Mother of your child and provide for your family
How can you be a long distance dad at such a critical time ?

Or take the local job and have fun changing nappies
Tough choice but being a dad is great and will give you a new perspective on life
This is the only advice you need to listen to. You are going to be a Dad and your own wants/desires do not come first anymore. You need to do what is right for your child. And that would be finding a job close to home, preferably one that doesn't take you away too much. You should not even be considering taking a flying job in another part of the world. Believe me, it will not make you happy to be flying a 737 or anything else for that matter if you haven't seen your child in 3 weeks. All you will care about is getting home. As it should be.
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Old 26th Jul 2006, 18:41
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Thanks guys, I came to that conclusion a few weeks ago after a long hard think. Really do appreciate your inputs!

Maybe I'll pack your bags in Publix one day! lol

Thanks Again

Andy
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Old 26th Jul 2006, 19:36
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I agree with the suggestion that you try & make it work in Europe.

Been there, done that (twice!). Now stuck in U.S. Biggest mistake of my life...so far! The regional pay is absolutely terrible - my single mates can't afford to live on it & actually do have part time jobs in places like Publix/restaurants/bars etc to make ends meet.

You are in a very difficult situation. The question I wish I'd asked myself when in your shoes was "is my relationship with the mother of my children likely to survive the enormous upheaval of moving country/job/life/kids etc?"

It wasn't, don't see the kids now & am basically completely displaced from friends & family. If I do go home I could never afford what I had before & also lose any right of long term abode in the U.S hence can't spend much time with the kids as they grow up. My actions & subsequent decisions have effectively destroyed my life.
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Old 26th Jul 2006, 20:41
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Originally Posted by weasil
And that would be finding a job close to home, preferably one that doesn't take you away too much. You should not even be considering taking a flying job in another part of the world.
Weasy,

Why can't run_n_break just take Mrs. run_n_break...and run_n_break Jr., move to Europe and make a go of it if he can get a respectible flying job there.

I've heard rumors, completely unsubstantiated of course, that there are airline pilots in the UK who have families actually with them and still manage to have a career AND the family.

How did you manage your family vs career ?

Since we are mapping our run_n_break's career and family plan for him, I say go to Europe if that's where the best job ( hence, money, future, advancement, etc. ) is and live happily ever after. People seem to think there's a pilot shortage so run_n_break is in a "target-rich" environment.

Of course, he'll still be changing diapers, regardless of continent...and I could tell you stories that would gag a maggot.
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Old 26th Jul 2006, 23:25
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Originally Posted by bafanguy
Weasy,
Why can't run_n_break just take Mrs. run_n_break...and run_n_break Jr., move to Europe and make a go of it if he can get a respectible flying job there.

Originally Posted by run_and_break
Problem being is that my American fiancee is pregnant and living in Florida with no ability to move away.

R&B
He answered that question already. As for me, I made the hard choices. Had a very lucrative instructing job in a 121 training department and gave it up in order to make FO wages but be closer to home and my family. Money is important but not as important as being around while your kids are growing up. Just my opinion though.
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Old 27th Jul 2006, 01:01
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Originally Posted by weasil
He answered that question already. Money is important but not as important as being around while your kids are growing up.
Well, his answer wasn't an answer...it was an excuse.

You can still be around your kids and fly for a living. I did it for 31 years ( so don't tell me it can't be done )...and run_n_break can do it too....In europe with Mrs. run_n_break and run_n_break Jr.
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Old 27th Jul 2006, 02:41
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Originally Posted by run_and_break
She cannot move to the UK due to other commitments.

.....and I AM trying to clear things up, hence my asking for help and advice.

Thankyou

R&B
He also repeated that point right here.
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Old 27th Jul 2006, 13:53
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Originally Posted by weasil
He also repeated that point right here.
Yep...saw that...
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Old 27th Jul 2006, 18:15
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From another old timer.You have to find a way to make the "Big Iron" work. You'll all be better for it in the long run.
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Old 28th Jul 2006, 08:05
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Smile

Run and Break:
One thing is certain-you can never replace time with a little toddler who then learns to stand and walk, all solo, and wants you to pick him/her up before a wave hits him on a beach! Or the time he/she learns to ride a bike or tries to throw YOU a frisbee or football, help to swim and wants to ride on your back like a small backpack. Also-- this may sound trivial now, but please keep good photos/videos in a bank's safety deposit box. Burglars steal video camcorder bags with everything still in the pockets! Photos burn up, gone forever, along with apartments or houses...

I was divorced when my son was very little, but was very fortunate that the ex- had nowhere else to go and that my company kept its crewbase here. Thank God I never decided to try a different airline (back then with much less corporate debt) and commute permanently over here on a two-hour flight. If necessary, I would have considered changing careers, in order to live in the same city, although I can not imagine working in a cubicle or anywhere inside a building.

For all these many years I've spent numerous days per month with my son (and second, very understanding wife who is the very best type of stepmother: a true angel. Not all of them are so tolerant.) and now he is off to college in a few weeks. Since he was about seven, we have taken him along to several large US cites and five times to Europe in the summer for about a week. On the other hand, my brother was not so fortunate. He lives hours away and two of his three kids were brainwashed into having no interest in seeing him. After age 10 or so, he never saw those two grow up-and never will. It is all gone, like tears in the rain, and I feel real sympathy for people like that.

But about the career, that is very complicated advice, with various future possibilities if you can relocate years later. Multi-turbine PIC flying is the very foundation of what makes pilots very competitive with each other. The type of calm, likeable person which a company sees in the interview, who is very open to the CRM concepts, all make good impressions. Later, ss for which types of multi-turbine planes you have flown, this often is secondary. Don't know whether any of this helps (I was hired in Oct '85 at age 30). Maybe you can try to imagine your perspective from imaginary hindsight. Good luck with the difficult decisions, but be honest with yourself and maybe try to resist "jet fever".
Flying is flying.
The smaller planes can be more fun and with little automation, you will be a better pilot. Years later with a foreign airline, if so, you will not need to rely on the "automatics" to know what to do, and can fly with partial or no automation if needed. You will be the boss-NOT the buttons on the MCP nor the glass of the FMC screens. And you can fly while at the same time, without even looking over, know whether the FO is keeping ahead of the plane's and ATC's requrements. Many of 'my' best FOs were all civilian, and flew nothing larger than a SF-340 or B-1900 before this 100-seat 'classic' jet.

Even after the prop noise is in your past, you will start to take it a bit for granted and will still want a decent lifestyle with certain days off in a row for people you truly care about-especially for a tiny person who wants you to pick him/her up, and to help the tired Mom with dark circles under her eyes to get some rest (I flew a few months ago with a very sweet lady FO who had triplets and looks at us with dark smudges under her very pretty eyes). If you have a heart, you can not begin to imagine what that totally helpless little person will mean to you-and I could not either. A shiny widebody jet with layovers in Caracas, Nice or Munich with a bigger paycheck, in my opinion, could never begin to compare with the extra time spent with a child (it would seem hollow, empty after a while). Flying a Bandeirante longer or a King Air would have been just fine. If you don't have a heart or nasty surprises happen, then you will have different priorities or be knocked down by fate.

Last edited by Ignition Override; 28th Jul 2006 at 08:54.
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Old 28th Jul 2006, 14:38
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Join Date: Aug 2004
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Let me guess, she loved your accent and 9 months later you got yourself a euro-american kid... Since Im euro-trash myself living stateside for 3 years now, I know how that works

From one (western) european guy to another...

run forest run !!! never get married to a yankee chick !!!!!

J/K my friend my gf is yankee, just giving you shit. I hate to break this to you, but at this stage you gotta do what's best for your girl and kid... You gotta do what's best for them, not for your. Sorry...


goodluck!
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