It would appear some pepole can't take a joke or a bit of banter anymore!!

Roll on 2012? Why? Is that when we dis-establish the Movers trade?

:ok:

Have to say that having looked at the movers thread a few hours ago they display a far more sensible and measured response than quite a few posts on this thread. Maybe not too many egos to bruise?

" Roll on 2012? Why? Is that when we dis-establish the Movers trade? "


Care to enlighten the guy Wilts ?:D

Cerainly E5,

It's they year I leave the RAF after 38.5 years of loyal service, which is slowly but surely becoming more difficult to endure:(

You old git!!:ok:

Sorry...couldn't resist it!!:p

MOG:cool:
(Younger and not so grey!!)

Look at the Heirachy
 

I'm so glad to be on the outside working with proffesionals and an outfit that works together to achieve a common goal, instead of a team of individuals who are too busy bickering and pursuing their own selfish interests without a damn for anyone else but themselves. Good luck to the lot of you. And, I have no doubt that the blame for this incident will fall fully on 1 individual to cover up the years of neglect by the leaders who never listened to the voices of experience on that squadron. :ugh:

Lions and Donkeys
 

Can't agree more with rsb. Not so much lions led by donkeys as monkeys led by chimps. No meaningful selection, no meaningful training (outside fast jet CFS), no meaningful leadership, ever... It's coming to a sqn near you guys. Movers are generally clueless, aircrew kid themselves they are any better, cover your ass people, nobody else will do it for you!

B

At the risk of keeping this thread alive long after it should be buried without honours...
Whether we like it or not there is a definite perception that aircrew related incidents are treated by those on high with more sympathy than groundcrew related ones, a belief that leads to a sense of injustice. With the slow take-up of HFOR this is hopefully being redressed, fingers crossed.
I well recall an incident at our secret Wiltshire base when one of our cabs got itself damaged in a flying incident. A board of enquiry was convened and, at some point, began examining the engineering paperwork raised to recover the airframe. An anomoly was found which caused such excitement amongst the BOI team that their pursual of this avenue of investigation threatened to overshadow (not my words, the words of our bosses) the fact that their initial remit had been to investigate the flying incident that had led to the paperwork being raised in the first place :ugh:

Forgive me while I yawn. Thought this thread was about the TriStar not the Movers.

Topic drift, it happens. Human nature and all that. Doesn't make any of the points raised less valid even if they are not immediately related to the OP. Better to cover it one thread than start multiple threads each time a change of direction occurs IMHO.

As slow as most movers errrrrr....move.....it is they that should have barnacles on them and not the aircraft.

This post is Brill!! Just as CH predicted the attention has turned away from the guys who bent the frame on to the guys with broad shoulders...

Roll on 2012....

Fair chance..............along with aircrew bashing. :)

Mover baiting...............hardly a competitive sport as it's way tooooo easy:rolleyes:

Hey Blakey, just moved up to PA band 15 so add another grand to the figure that sent you apopleptic not so long ago:p

ABIW - Make the most of it while you can because in Civvy street your wages are linked to ability...
Roll on 2012

Blakey,

Did I not mention in a previous post that the PA spine and new pension scheme means I get to retire at 55 and never have to worry about a earning a crust again...........in fact all I have to worry about is what size boat to buy for our life cruising round the med:p

Blakey/Wilts,
I searched out the Movers v Loadies thread a few nights ago cos I was bored and wanted a laugh. Would you believe it....some git has actually closed it. Bloody cheek.

Might have to start up a new thread and get some proper banter going again. What to call it though I wonder ? :hmm:

I quite like Loadies v Movers sorts out the priorities nicely...............

Nah lets go with The Military, including RAFP v Movers as thats how, and rightly so, it always ends up:p

Wilts,
As I recall the last Scuffer that posted here was hounded off, am I correct ?

And still nothing on what happened just inane dribble on the merits or not of other trades. Being the FE on the last tail strike with Air Luxor I would be interested to hear what happened to this one. It would also be nice to read posts that do answer the title.

Ah!, as someone who may know, what angle, nose up, must you have to have a tail strike?

About 19 degrees

Spec....would that be a "generic" 19 degrees nose up as per the Aircrew Manual, or do you know more?

fergie

what was the outcome of the Air Luxor tail strike??
Engine damage?
any airframe damage??? what was the inspection carried out post the incident?

Hi 14 Greens,
There was quite a bit of damage both to the airframe and the engine, I will try and enclose a photo. There were many checks made to both the airframe and engine by our line engineers and the CAA before they would authorise a one flight 2 enging ferry to Jordan for the repairs to be made, they found lots more damage when they stripped the frame down. Will need to look at how to import the photo onto these pages and will post them later.

They sleep on the aircraft all the time I thought....so long as the autopilot is awake! Oh, my....the dreaded two engine ferry flight with an empty aircraft.

Here's one that did not do so well....

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?e...20X01664&key=1

Well Sasless you obviously know the Tristar well......Number 2 engine was the failed engine.......unpressurised flight only.......Stanstead to Jordan......do the sums and see just how easy it was.....not!!!!! Oh and I think it was no APU as well. Still not managed to find how to post a picture, anyone out there help, tried to do it as it says on the FAQ's but it wont do it.

Seem to remember a new co dinking a tail on one of his first circuits trips at Brize on 216. The crew didn't realise they had done it, ATC saw it but didn't tell the crew until later, resulting in the aircraft landing on a runway covered with broken glass from the AAR lights!:D

So, back to the original topic from post numero 1.

From where I was sitting, which was pretty much as far down the back as you can get, it just felt like a heavy(ish) landing, nothing else . We only found out about the incident due to the baggage being delayed as they couldn't get the rear doors open. Top marks to anyone who puts it down safely at candybar; must have a lot on your plate during finals.

fergie
sorry not responded earlier,did you have any joy with the pix of yr tailstrike incident
Still trying to find out what checks they are going to do on our jet, the RR is pretty well buggered but thats to be expected, waiting for info on the structural checks

Dirtygc, you and the other apologists, are beginning to sound like Mr Flintoff downunder. Boys did great today, found their bats, put their own pads on, walked on the field all by themselves etc. The British disease of accepting poor perfomance strikes the military..........again. A difficult approach? Only to those lacking basic piloting ability I think. Lets stop making excuses for blatent errors, the next one could and probably will be fatal.

Look after number 1, no one else will.

Fly safe

B

Concur Bernie; I think putting that one down to the pressure of the approach is a little far fetched.

This thread is old and frankly boring, however,......rant on go!......Bernie and Flyboy007 have you actually flown a TriStar? Bernie if you are who I think you are then you have, but I beleive you haven't flown into KDH! Has FB007?? Until you have done both then shut up and get on with your life. Doh you haven't got one! Here's acknowledging all aircrew from any station, any sqn and any aircraft type that has to fly into KDH; depending on the wx it can be a pig of a destination. rant over. End this thread!!!!!!:ugh:

Wow, There is one for the books!

I'm not saying that the approach isn't a difficult one, and I'm not saying that it is without challenge, however it is not the only time/destination that the pressure is on. You could make that argument about many destinations.
As you said, hats off to anyone who has to fly into these places; certainly I don't envy anyone who does!

Dear ‘I Failed First’, I would have loved to have had the pleasure of God’s own Tri-motor but had to derive my enjoyment from something smaller and faster! I have however, had to rely on the Timster on more than one occasion for help in getting from one place to another and therefore find your complacency (or over confidence) more than a little worrying. The very fact that you claim to find a thread about a near disastrous accident on your aircraft type “BORING” speaks volumes for your (and your sqn mate's?) attitude towards aviation and flight safety in general. Let’s have some input from others who have a lower propensity to stick their heads in the sand – is crashing now an acceptable standard of airmanship? Mr ACS appears to think so. Is this attitude endemic on the AT fleet?

Look after number 1, nobody else will

Fly safe

B

Someone jumps out of one of your 'smaller and faster' things Bernie. Is this endemic of the FJ fraternity? Course not. Grow up.

Let the BOI do their job & stop slinging mud.

When ever someone 'jumps out' of a Fast Jet an enquiry into the circumstances and causes is convened with a view to preventing the same accident reoccurring. In the mean time some meaningful debate will take place within the FJ brethren often within these forums. It seams that any meaningful debate in this case consists of statements of the ilk 'get a life', 'close this thread' (sweep it under the carpet?) and 'Grow up'. An interesting comparison. Further, I would have thought that the fact that the Martin Baker option is denied to both crew and passengers aboard At assets is all the more reason to avoid accidents such as this in the first place. Or perhaps you are happy relying on divine intervention Mr ExVicar?

Look after number 1, nobody else will.

Fly Safe

B

'near disastrous accident on your aircraft type'

Where on earth did you get that from!!!! The tail was scraped after landing (the second one :) ) and after some minor rectification and much faffing the aircraft was flown without incident by a brave and good looking crew to somewhere where the locals were more friendly!

I would describe it as "near disastrous" too. As I understand it 10 degrees of pitch up is the limit on landing, the tail does not touch until about 15 and the second landing (yes the one AFTER the big bounce) was approaching 19 degrees. Even if you're not looking at angles I would have thought 30 - 40 kts below threshold speed would have been quite warning enough that it was about to get tasty. I always taught my studes to go around if they (or circumstances beyond their control) cocked up the approach.

Mach- I think the previous poster has far more credibility when discussing this incident, so if he doesn't think it was "near disastrous" then it probably wasn't.

Specaircrew- fillings ok?