Chaps - accept that this is a front end forum etc, and I believe that the J is sooper for those front end chaps. HOWEVER......

for us boys & girls in the back, it is not the bed of roses. I accept a number of issues were teething problems, but we procured it so badly, with disregard for back end issues, that there are lingering niggles. Until you've had yer teeth shaken out walking up a J in flight, you've been a lucky bear.
Oh - lack of roast pots is not made up for with microwave popcorn!

Good Mickey,
I believe the furthest the boys had to tab was 17 km, they were not happy bunnies....
And that wasn't the first time (or the first crew) either!

RedFlag,

is it also true that whilst on the same SA detachment a basic J model crew flew all the missions that 2 and a bit K crews were meant to fly as well as completing its own PW and small stores trial? If this is true then what else has to be done to convince the 'powers that be' that the J is the future and the K is the past?

2km the shortest, 4km the furthest tab, cos that's where the DZSO picked him up. The figure of 17km came from the PfPl guy who couldn't use his GPS to mark his landing position! They were dropped 10.2nm from DZ so it would be difficult to land further away from DZ than where they were dropped. The majority of the troops managed to cover 8nm back to the DZ but still landed short unfortunately. Not that I am condoning the errors that were made (as I was involved personally) but I would like to know what figures the J is using to calculate any form of drive for stand-off or hop-and-pop? There is no operational advantage in dropping troops in the overhead and letting them sort out the dynamics under canopy.

However, this is not the first pigs when entering data into drop software and I'm sure it won't the last. Speak to the F117 guys who put 6 x 2000lb onto 5 targets a couple of years ago on RF when 2 pilots/tactics guys put the co-ordinates for 1 target into 2 aircraft?!

Ducks and waits for the banter to fly......

Oh, the bit about sorties for 2 and bit K crews, plus the PW trial, would that mean the K was U/S.......yes it was.

I agree that the J is the future (which is a pisser for me as there aren't enough seats for me) and the K is in the past but the J will take time and until that time passes the K is nearly all we have got. We need to work together to progress both fleets, using advantages of both aircraft, to get a better product at the far end.

WW

WW,

your comments are spot on!! (Unlike your drop accuracy) I agree wholeheartedly that a combined fleet is the way ahead.

I'm of the opinion that the more eyes on the fltdeck at low level then the better.

Certain K bods (South Side Massive) need the max crew to perform to the fullest. If a switch to the J takes place then surely it will burden the three crew even more when on the darker tasks?

I take it WW that when completing your CARP you forgot that you were in the Southern Hemisphere. No pole star to azimuth off?

Damn, I knew there was something missing when I worked out that astro shot for the CARP!

WW

Grimweasel,

schoolboy error - you haven't been on a J flight deck have you?? Why post when you havn't got a f**king clue what you're talking about!!

GM

Lots of times actually! Less of the profanity please, no need to get your knickers in a twist is there?

All glass and HUD and lots of annoying bleeps and voices from a computer.

Have you been on a K?

Or have you just got your glider wings?

Seems like abit of misunderstanding! You could read your post GW that there are 3 people on the flight deck, not 3 people on the crew.

WW

GW,

sorry for the outburst! No I haven't just got my glider wings I'm hoping to get them for Xmas!! Yes I have been on the K - approx 9yrs - but wouldn't go back. Anyway, no hard feelings and a very merry Xmas to you!!

GM

GM

A fine Xmas to you too old chap. No hard feelings. We really must not let this develop into the old J/K slagging match as its just not cricket!

See you on the pans!
GW