Like Brakedwell I also did the 12 week course at Kirton Lindsey in 1956. After 2 weeks leave found myself on Empresss of Britain en route to Canada. In those days "officers" always went first class. So, dinner was in mess kit (Best blue, white shirt and bow tie). One important thing IOT had neglected was to teach us how to tie a bow tie. The cabin steward had to complete my officer training.

And that's your excuse, is it.....:ooh:

The single-ended bow tie was bad enough, but yoof-of-today is at least largely spared the horrors of wing collars and stiff-fronted shirts!

and White waistcoats.

I wonder how livers-in manage now with so many living out? Corridors used to be full of the partly dressed finding someone that could tie a bow tie.

There you are BEagle, 5 years undergoing some form of Officer Training at CWL and UAS and no Office Simulator!

I did the 16 week course in the early 70's in Bedfordshire and being destined to be aircrew I paid scant regard to the lessons on Admin, File Systems and the like. The "Office Simulator" was, however, a good place to put some of that "admin stuff" into context.

I soon had to learn about File Systems, however, when I broke my arm at BFTS and the CI told me to re-organise the Ops Wing File system. Well, after 2 months it was re-organised, but who knows how well?

Back to the question, 16 weeks is plenty of time to train prospective aircrew in all they need to be an RAF Officer. Even the most expeditious training program would allow further development during BFTS, AFTS and TWU. More important, to get pilots to the front line quickly needs a restructure of the training system. There only needs to be 2 ac types flown prior to OCU. The secret is to have the correct aircraft, and the Tutor is NOT one of them!

If the process is to be successful the RAF needs to select those with the best aptitude to be pilots. Their potential to become CAS is of little importance at that stage. Select the best, not just the first that pass Selection to the minimum standard!

Stiff white dress shirts
 

This has gone on long enough without a uniform story

RAF Regt guard Buck House because the date is special

Officer warned Duke of E might invite him to dine if quiet night in, be ready. He does

Duke comments RAF don't wear stiff shirts any more?

Regt Off replies "oh yes but only for special occasions"

Rest of meal is quiet, It's only a story

just trying to recall how many times I have read it on PPRuNe. :ouch:

S-D

Bow Ties ... I was shocked to dicover at OCTU (Feltwell 65) and subsequently how few RAF Officers could tie a bow tie, even with a mirror and assistance of a few mates.

I should have charged for my Tie-Tying Service, as at BRNC (63/64) it was normal evening wear for Cadets ... and ready-mades were certainly not allowed!

My cummerbund has shrunk.

Moi aussi!

ACW

Yecch ... cummerbunds? Oh, Dear God, what has the RAF sunk to? Where does one place one's fob watch on a gold chain in one of those?

Mercifully, my original 1965 one still fits perfectly, as it's one of those backless ones with an elastic band ... endlessly adjustable! The rest of the gear ... hmmm :(

MPN,

Yes I had the full waistcoat except for the white one which was backless. However, it isn't only the cummerbund which has shrunk - the whole wardrobe seems to have been afflicted with the same shrinking process.

ACW

The white one is in a wardrobe somewhere, along with [I think] the tie and AWFUL shirt/collar] My only real survivor is my full-length, made to measure, chrome leather dress boots made in Singapore. £7 IIRC, and still going strong after ... nearly 50 years :D

As noted on this Forum long ago, I had a wee spat with Mr Snobby at Moss Bros. in Covent Garden when I needed some new Mess Overalls. "Oh, Sir, you can only have 14" hems when wearing Dress boots" ... "I do" ... "Ahhh, oh, Yes Sir" :ok:

Shame about the bloody waistband, and I doubt a tailor could correct those missing 3-4 inches.

When cummerbunds came in and waistcoats went out. Wise heads kept their' s. Sure enough they cane back in.

Even in the days of waistcoats we wore cummerbunds with tropical mess kit. I have a photo of Mrs TTN with some slim bloke I dont recognise at the summer ball at Kai Tak in '68 and I am (I mean he is) wearing one.

I cant remember what colour it was (B & W photo) - was it light blue or did I imagine that?

A simpler Way (my Post p.131, #2612 on "Gaining a R.A.F. Pilot's Brevet...."):
When giving instruction on bow-tie-tying, it is necessary to operate from the rear (particularly, I would think, if your stude were from this "G" Flight ?).

Danny.

Them were the days !

Or Jaguars

It would be a real shame to chop the current IOT in any way.

You old buggers who retired before it got serious - you can stop reading now.

I went through IOT in the mid 90's and thought I got a pretty good grounding in all things useful at the time.
In 2012 I was lucky enough to be allowed to 'experiment' on IOT cadets as part of the research for my Masters thesis. This meant 2 x trips to Cranwell and getting to spend a couple of days observing and chatting to cadets before and during a major exercise.

Hands down, they were better than we were. Their performances under exercise conditions (far harder and more realistic than most anything I endured on IOT or later) were fantastic. They were successfully dealing with issues taken from real, recent ops and doing better than some people who had served on those ops. Their breadth of knowledge and effectiveness was startling. I passed these observations to my own Branch Phase 2 training staff, urging them to go and see what I saw with a view to tweaking training to match this higher calibre of new JO.

I thought those cadets were far better prepared for a more operational, diverse and Joint career. Shame on the Two-Winged Master Race if they meddle to meet their own training timelines.

This minor obsession of the Rupert Factory brigade, in being able to tie a bow tie correctly, is extraordinary. I have been tying my own shoelaces since a very early age. Having spent some 20 years in the only worthwhile rank - Master Aircrew (Frogs and Puddles!!) the obsession came to pass in the form of an obnoxious J.O. at a mixed party. Well oiled, he joined my, then, wife and self and pulled my bow undone. His latent hysterical humour was quickly stifled when I re-tied it and asked, straightfacedly, why he had done that. No answer - so presumably that bit isn't covered in the syllabus.:ugh:

Cheif, suggests my amendment makes more space.

Of course by widening the net, lowering the bar, scraping the barrel etc there may be more chance of maintaining a full pipe line, pond sizes or pot :)

To me, it was just a glorified Boy's Scout camp and all a bit of a waste of time. Whether it's 16, 16, 24 or 33 weeks, it's still too long. The constant reduction in flying training hours is however, far more serious.