When the RAF contracted after the 2nd World War surplus squadron's silver was held at RAF Mildenhall. One day a couple of three-tonners arrives, movement orders shown to the guardroom and off a fair quantity of it went. The three-tonners, borrowed from a war surplus auction site were found next day abandoned by the side of a road.

The silver wasn't.

Thanks for the clarification mopardave - now that you've put the date in it's a lot clearer.

I understand that there is or was a proposal for the Green Howards to become B company of the 4th Battalion, Yorkshire Regiment to ensure survival of the name, but this emphasises the fact that the old county regiment system which was formalised in 1881 is dead and gone. It's a sign of how small the army has become that regiments which in peacetime consisted of two regular and two volunteer battalions (and far more in wartime) are now reduced to company strength in some cases :(

ian16th,
His AFC was Gazetted 1st Jan 1957 so too early for the 20-21 Jun 1961 first non-stop UK - Australia flight.

Around 2009/2010 there was an RAF wide silver, painting and valuable items audit. All stations and units had to photograph and detail what items they had, approximate value, if they were insured, and where possible who had donated said item.

I had to do one for the Sqn I was on at the time. The oddest find was a small silver cup with "WAAF Block Swimming Champions" engraved on it. How we came about it I'm sure would make an interesting story :}

I did hear that in the basement, at a certain large training estate in Lincolnshire, they found a Faberge Egg that was gifted to the RAF when it was created in 1918!

That Staff College piece had been a gift from a (Southern) Irish Regiment who were disbanded at independance - 1920?

There was a suitable plaque on it IIRC, saying something like "From a Dying Regiment to a Newborn Service" or similar.

But stolen silver always gets melted down - indeed, one can only insure (99% of the time) for its "bullion value". So sad.

And of course the Bracknell theft pre-dated "security" as we now understand it. Like the blokes who used to nick TVs from Messes, armed with a white van, a brown dustcoat and a clipboard, using the password:

"Which of these TVs are on the blink?" ..... cos they all were ......

I wince every time I visit messes these days - the table silver and coffee pots etc typically have been 'polished' with Brillo pads to remove the tarnish; no coincidence that these tend to be contracted-out messes. I just shudder to think the damage that is being inflicted on trophies by well meaning, but utterly insert and unsupervised staff.

TTH, quite, Saturday afternoon sports, repairman came in to exchange old rental TV for new model. The potatoes remained supping their beer for some time until penny dropped.

When 608 disbanded their Standard was laid up in York Minster but the squadron silver and glassware was presented to Middlesbrough Borough Council for safe keeping in the event of 608 being reformed at any future date and it remains on display inside Middlesbrough Town Hall .
I have seen the 608 collection and will check my photographs for an inkstand inscribed as presented by Danny42C ! Should you wish to be reacquainted with said donation please PM me and I will see what can be arranged ?

Aside from Sqn silverware what about Sqn photoalbums...


I remember seeing some old ones that were supposedly rescued from a skip by a certain person. But that story was in mentioned 2001-2003.


V1

Possible Find.
 

David Thompson,

I'm very grateful for the information! But it may be a false hope. I presented the inkstand to the Officer's Mess of RAF Thornaby (the old Thornaby Hall), not even to my own unit (3608 FCU), still less to 608 Squadron, of which I was not a member (although they let me fly their aircraft from time to time).

But it may be that it got bundled up with 608's silver and the Town Hall has got the lot. I shall ask my daughter to go and have a look, and will report progress on open Post on this Thread in due course.

With renewed thanks,

Danny42C.

Doesn't unwanted/needed silver go to store in Doddington? I think it's called that. :confused:

There have of course been a multitude of changes of the style local government in that part of the UK. Middlesbrough has been a County Borough, a part of Teesside County Council and the erstwhile County of Cleveland and is currently the Unitary Borough of Middlesbrough.

So tracing the silver might be more difficult than imagined.

I'll be interested in the findings of any search.

I think that much depends upon the Sqn CO and his (her) attitude to history. I once rescued a certain Sqn's wartime F540 from the "to throw away" pile - it was returned to the Sqn when a more interested CO took over! (Also for throwing was a print signed by the RAF's first VC in WW1 - that was also rescued).

The Archives at Northolt will take line books and photo albums but, as Wensleydale says, it depends on the person responsible having any connection with history.

I still regret destroying secret maps and plans from WW2 when I were a young lad and general awareness of security was low, pre Bomber Command museum at Hendon. Security, after a number of serious breaches was being ramped up post Radcliffe and we were actively encouraged to reduce our holdings of secrets as there was insufficient proper security furniture to secure what we needed let alone what we didn't.

Apart from the WW2 stuff I also destroyed some TS material dated from the Iraq/Kuwait crisis of 1961. It may not have been important but who knows. Of Cuba only 4 years previous there was not a trace; my predecessors, one of whom was a squirrel, had cleaned the office.

It's still on display in the town hall . Perhaps not all of it but certainly a very large part of it and very impressive it is too .

David
Thanks for that pleasing news.

Is the Inkwell there?

When we were informed of it being in the possession of what is probably the UK's most altered area of municipal name and boundry changes I feared the worst.

Inkstand, where art thou ?
 

Ian16th,

Municipalities may come, and municipalities may go, but the Victorians built their Town Halls to last for ever ! (eg, Manchester, Leeds and Middlesbrough).

If it got into the Town Hall in the first place, it'll be still there. If not, not.

Danny.

Belated Replies.
 

ian16th (your #26),

(From Wiki):
"In June 1961" [Sqn. Ldr.] "Beavis set the record for the fastest non-stop flight from the UK to Australia which he established by flying a Vulcan from RAF Scampton to RAAF Richmond in just over 20 hours".

He was on 617 Sqn then; was awarded the AFC for it; retired as Air Chief Marshal Sir Michael Beavis KCB CBE AFC.

I was privileged to know him as "Mike Beavis", a Flying Officer in 1951 at Thornaby, where he was the Training Officer on 608 (Auxiliary) Sqn.

sharpend (your #34),

I can only commiserate ! Possibly 608 may be reconstituted in some future conflict, but RAF Thornaby is gone forever :( - buried under housing and Light Industry. They'll have to go somewhere else !

Danny.

True about the station, but never say never about the Sqn - 609 has now been around (again) for c. 15 years, 607 is in the process of re-forming, so that seems like bracketing ;)

ian16th Danny42C
I found some but not all of my photographs of the aforementioned Thornaby silver and can tell you both that 3608 lives on ! From the photographs I noted ;
Three condiment sets but no visible donor or recipient
A pair of cut glass decanters - as above
A soild silver Hawker Demon - I'm pretty sure this was to 608 from Hawker ?
A solid silver DH Mosquito - presented postwar by DH to 608
A barometer presented to 608 by S/L FA Robinson DFC
and finally 3608 ;
Two candle holders with ornate swan necks and both presented to 3608 , one by F/L RW Lonsdale DFC MM and the other by F/L DH Swan DFC and both dated May 1955
Silver salver presented to 3608 by F/L GF Smith in March 1955
Two silver candleabras presented by F/O WK Grigg DFM
but sorry Danny42C and ian16th , no inkwell that I remember !

I await your further instructions ?

David Thompson,

Thanks for the detailed list of your finds. I'm interested in the '55 presentations by Fred Smith (a teacher, and one of my two Auxiliary Adjutants), Bob Lonsdale and Doug Swan (Auxiliary Fighter Controllers - but not "wingless wonders!"), all after November '54 (when I left). Grigg doesn't ring a bell, which doesn't signify, as it was sixty years ago and memory fades. I wonder whether the sight of my parting gift to the Officer's Mess prompted this sudden outbreak of generosity !

Sqn Ldr Robinson DFC was the Boss of 608 when I arrived in '51. He insisted on "checking me out" on his Vampires (although I'd been flying them on 20 Sqn last posting). Not having a dual Vamp (although the sqn had a T7 Meteor), he ordered me aloft in a single-seater, to "do rollers till we tell you to stop". He then, apparently, took up position in the Tower with binoculars. After three or four circuits he called me in, grudgingly admitted that I could still fly, but reproved me for getting power on late in the rolls. I didn't think so, the Goblin with that massive centrifugal impeller always spooled-up slowly.

His successor (Sqn Ldr G.A.Martin DFC AFC) and I got on well enough, and I had the choice of the Sqn TM, the Harvard and a Vampire when no one else wanted them. It was a pity that I one Sunday inadvertently blotted the Sqn's escutcheon by landing at MSG under the impression that I was at Thornaby (he was rather cross about that !)

Of course, the Mess was my home (as a regular), so my gift was to them, but the Auxiliaries would rightly think their first loyalty was to their unit(s). Bob Lonsdale, I think, was with 608's later M.O., Ian Stewart, in the doc's sports (Lea-Francis ?) saloon when he wrapped it round a lampost on the way back to Hartlepool (?). Bob suffered facial injuries (all this was long before seat-belts), and I jestingly commiserated with him, as we were fellow-sufferers.

It would seem that anything donated to 608, or any of its "derivatives" (where was 2608 - the Rock Apes must have been a tight-fisted lot !) was scooped up by the Middlesbrough Town Hall, but the rest (including my nice little inkstand for the Mess Hall "signing-in/out" books table), has gone, Lord only knows where. Yet I'll have daughter go and have a look-see, for you never know. Will report either way.

Now it only remains to thank you for this very interesting historical find, and to tell you that you can "stand down", conscious of a job well done ! (I'll take it from here).

Danny42C.

EDIT: And thanks for your email 2202 19th. I don't hold out much hope of ever seeing the inkstand again ! D.

Sqn Silver Display
 

It would, if they could find it! vast amounts of silver exist and were stored at Quedgely ISTR. I wonder where all the disbanded squadron's silver is now)

When did we wake up and stop presenting silver?

OC 35, about 1971, was disappointed in the paucity of sqn silver. We went as far as getting a quote from Garrand but there was no enthusiasm on the sqn to cough up the dosh. The sqn disbanded a few years later probably never to reform.

In the early 90s as a young(ish) staff officer at HQ 11 Gp I was detailed to do a 100% check of mess silver. The Silver member and I went through the whole list - all present and correct - bar one flying trophy from the inter-war years. This large, solid silver trophy named after a famous RAF VSO could not be found. More to the point, since we had no photo, we did not know what it should look like.

Some weeks later I found it! It was being used as a door stop in the hall of the mess - only when I bent down to read the inscription did it become clear that this large, dirty winged lump was indeed the solid silver prestigious trophy.