Tunisia ISIL attack on tourists
 

Islamic State 'claims' responsibility for Tunisia attack as nation is left asking: what next? - Telegraph


Again another attack, now getting very close to the bars and joints of Europe. Was on holiday in Tunisia once, a secular country even then. We stayed in a massive holiday complex ran in part by Thomsons as I recall, a split up of British, Dutch and German zones.
My guess is this is now exactly the sort of place they would love to attack and seize, and then murder the European holidaymakers by the hundred if not by the thousand.
That amphib .exercise we did back in Turkey (in 2009 was it) was partly a sort attempt to respond to this such event (but was a poor exercise, poorly planned and executed as I recall now).


Should the combined UK military, right now put up a contingency plan to deal with such an possible event for this Summer? I'll spell it out again. An Islamic terrorist group of in excess of perhaps 50 fighters heavily armed with automatic weapons seizes an entire holiday resort on the Mediterranean coastline of containing perhaps upwards of 3000 European holiday makers and begins immediately killing them.
Could we respond? Can we respond?
Something I think sometimes when I read the papers and then I remember Exercise Egeman 2009 and what a farce it was.
If this thread is too stupid or scary for them, happy for the mods to delete it now.

Anyone who travels on holiday to a country where IS might operate is an idiot. Full stop. We cannot, as you say, save them in this scenario.

Personally, I think the same applies to aid workers in terms of inability of saving them. The two I know who visit regularly go with no expectation of being saved, and would be mortified if anyone tried to do so. On that condition, I admire their conviction and see no need for a travel ban.

I think the Government advice on travel to such places needs beefing up.

Sadly, that really doesn't leave too many options (including the UK!)

Anyone that goes on holiday to anywhere in North Africa deserves what they get. No help!

We can't guarantee safety anywhere - Fusilier Rigby was murdered by nutters in Woolwhich, people were shot in a coffee shop in Sydney (and Copenhagen), 168 people were killed in downtown Oklahoma City.....................

None of these are "dangerous" tourist destinations....................

Tunisia S-70
 

And to complement HH , also downtown Paris...

Sikorsky is currently negotiations with TUnisia re purchasing six or seven S-70i.

Cheers

Now of course there are lots of Russians in the Med resorts :)

Well, there is a difference between IS and IS sympathisers, which has quite an effect on the risk level. But if you are implying that the UK is now unsafe, I would agree.

Well guys speaking as a now commercial pilot may I point out you've just written off a fair chunk of the destinations served by a far proportion of the UK's airlines, both Long Haul and the LoCos.......

I'm about to head off to SYD but planning to spend some time in London on my return.....am I being irresponsible? FWIW myself and other's in my position regularly see the likes of Kenya and Nigeria on their roster...I have no sympathy at all with those who think treking in iffy parts of the Middle East is a good idea but there are many others who make more sensible choices..

Or should we all just shut up shop and barricade the borders? Fat lot of good that will do us...

A tough one, we have relatives whom have booked a AI Holiday to Tunisia before this thing all kicked off. Now this is happened, its makes you think.


The holiday firm (a large TUI member) has said "Hey no problems with our holidays to Tunisia" and are following the FCO advice. If the FCO say "don't travel", then costs are refunded.

So the choice is... Swap out and pay a hefty fee (probably 100% again), or leave it see what happens and take the risk...

As said above...is sometimes being right in the face safer than being elsewhere..

Contract for 8 awarded earlier this week - Tunisia orders Black Hawk helos - IHS Jane's 360

FCO advice not to travel? - good luck with that. The FCO are not advising against travel to Tunis, despite the attack. Oddly enough, they never seem to advise against areas where major travel companies go...what a coincidence.

Please note, I am advising against tourist travel, not commercial travel. IS are clearly targetting Western tourists; and commercial travellers tend to, and are able to, make more secure arrangements.

Fox3

Well done for assisting IS in their attempts to alter the behaviour of westerners through fear.

The entire point of the attack is to make westerners fear to go to Tunisia on holiday.

I hope that their are others around with more of the British spirit willing to give you a damn good ignoring.

I will continue to go on holiday to North Africa, and yes I expect the British military to make an attempt to rescue me if necessary. It's part and parcel of being a world power. The day we retreat from such things is the day we cease to be worthy of respect, and don't give me guff about not having the kit or military for the job. Our current capabilities to rapidly move an SF force with suitable capabilities are superior to any time in history.

Frankly, stop being a wuss and pour yourself a large glass of man the f@ck up.
There is vastly more chance of being killed by bad driving in North Africa than by IS.
The way to beat terrorism is to ignore it.
1,000,000 people are killed on the roads every year. Do you still get in a car?

How's that working out for you?

Fox,

I am a supporter of all you say normally but I do think your post was more than a little limp wristed and does not fit with your former profession in the RAF.

I would never be so bold as to offer advice to someone like you but were you having a bad day?

ACW

It's stange how the end of the Cold War seems to have reset our risk tolerances. Not long ago we cheerfully got on with our lives despite the real threat of nuclear destruction. Yet now when faced by IS, a relatively small number of inadequate but murderous fanatics and loonies armed only with what they've nicked from our allies, everyone wets their pants.

No problem. The lads just go in and get you. Wherever you are. Job done.

Well worth risking their lives for. A Global power defines itself by the freedom with which its citizens can choose their Summer Holidays.

I am in favour of increased direct action* to rid the world of IS as soon as possible. I think that anything that detracts from that, such as rescuing tourists, is foolish. Furthermore, I think removing tourist dollars from Islamic countries forces them to take effective action both to protect tourists and suppress IS. To quote from a Tunisian today "Insh'Allah, security will get better". Well, Insh'Allah isn't a plan, much less effective action. We have a hundred years of experience that the average Islamic country will do f-all effective if the money keeps flowing.

Let's stop mucking around.

There, does that fit with the image? Just because I think tourists shouldn't be travelling doesn't mean I've given in to terrorism.

*Up the bombing. IS's philosophy relies on the expansion of the Caliphate. The quicker its area of occupation reduces, the faster it will fall. I want the ROE free-ing up a lot. Personally, I'd send in the B-52 'Carpet Suppliers'

http://johnweeks.com/tour/wtc/b52ammo2.jpg

Bigbux



"A global power defines itself by the freedom with which its citizens can choose their summer holidays"

Yes, pretty much exactly.

I think I will adopt that as my definition

It covers both the economic power to afford the holiday plus the reach of the country to look after its own..

....and yes, I think the boys would enjoy doing just that. Sitting around bored waiting for a shout is dull. Do you imagine that the scary boys sign up hoping to not get used?

Fox3

So the fact that neither we nor the Germans managed to win a war through carpet bombing doesn't put you off?
Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it....

Nobody has ever tried ignoring terrorists. I think it is worth a try. The very nature of it is all in the mind. The cost in both lives and treasure disappears in the noise compared to many many other everyday tragedies which we routinely ignore. Treat them like any other criminals. Don't dignify them with combatant status.

Well, fox I share those same sentiments in terms of hating IS and terrorism but disagree 100% on your plan for dealing with them. To paraphrase your own post, "carpet bombing...how's that working out for you??" We dropped countless tons on Iraq and that facilitated rather than eradicated IS. How about Libya; do you count that as an example of successful use of air Power?

IS have targeted Tunisia precisely because they have lost the battle of ideas there and the population have overwhelmingly chosen our values over theirs. If we were to start lobbing airstrikes there, IS would delighted!