SAR - Princess of Scandinavia
 

I happended to be listening on 2182 and 5680 the other night and just want to say how impressed I was with the coordination from Kinloss ARCC and the all those involved in the response to what could have been a major disaster.

I know, all in a day work for you and all that, but had I been on that ship I would taken great comfort from knowing what was going on behind the scenes to save my neck. Well Done!

Hmmm, one or two offences disclosed there?

??

VEEPS :confused:

Viz: listenting to transmissions other than radio 1 or classic fm

STANDTO

Its isnt an offence to listen to the transmissions, but it IS and offence to pass on any information gained from listening to said transmissions to any third party. This part of the Wireless and Telegraphy Act 19whatever isnt "usually" enforced.

What is your problem anyway??:rolleyes:

Thank you, Man on the fence. Standto, chill a bit eh...

Fence Man and no sig, I have your best interests at heart.....


I'm positively one of the most chilled persons I know. The following need pointing out.

1. Read my profile (only to explain why I might have an interest in these matters.

2. I'm not one of them (and I have no jurisdiction in Mainland UK anyway), but I know enough pedantic law enforcers who seize scanners and ask questions later.

3. read http://www.radio.gov.uk/publication/ra_info/ra169.htm

with regard to the legal position of scanners. i.e. IT IS ILLEGAL TO EVEN LISTEN TO STUFF YOU ARE NOT MEANT TO HEAR!. To save you skipping pages, it is reproduced below


The purpose of this information sheet is to remove any confusion regarding the reception of personal or business radio transmissions by unauthorised persons or groups. It also gives guidance on the subject by setting out the legal position with regard to the Wireless Telegraphy Act 1949 (WT Act). How the legislation is applied will depend on the individual circumstances of the offence.

Anyone who intends to listen to radio transmissions should be aware of the following:

A licence is not required for a radio receiver as long as it is not capable of transmission as well (The Wireless Telegraphy Apparatus (Receivers) (Exemption) Regulations 1989 (SI 1989 No 123). The exception to this is that it is an offence to listen to unlicensed broadcasters (pirates) without a licence. Licences are not issued for this purpose.

Although it is not illegal to sell, buy or own a scanning or other receiver in the UK, it must only be used to listen to transmissions meant for GENERAL RECEPTION. The services that you can listen to include Amateur and Citizens' Band transmissions, licensed broadcast radio and weather and navigation broadcasts.

It is an offence to listen to any other radio services unless you are authorised by a designated person to do so.

There are two offences under law:

Under Section 5(1)(b) of the WT Act 1949 it is an offence if a person "otherwise than under the authority of a designated person,

either:

(i) uses any wireless telegraphy apparatus with intent to obtain information as to the contents, sender or addressee of any message whether sent by means of wireless telegraphy or not, of which neither the person using the apparatus nor a person on whose behalf he is acting is an intended recipient;

This means that it is illegal to listen to anything other than general reception transmissions unless you are either a licensed user of the frequencies in question or have been specifically authorised to do so by a designated person. A designated person means:

the Secretary of State;
the Commissioners of Customs and Excise; or
any other person designated for the purpose by regulations made by the Secretary of State.
or:

(ii) except in the course of legal proceedings or for the purpose of any report thereof, discloses any information as to the contents, sender or addressee of any such message, being information which would not have come to his knowledge but for the use of wireless telegraphy apparatus by him or by another person."

This means that it is also illegal to tell a third party what you have heard.

With certain exceptions, it is an offence under Section 1 of the Regulation of Investigatory Powers Act 2000 for a person - "intentionally and without lawful authority to intercept, at any place in the United Kingdom, any communication in the course of its transmission by means of:

a public postal service; or
a public telecommunication system."
It is similarly an offence to intercept any communication in the course of its transmission by means of a private telecommunication system.

This means that it is illegal to listen to telephone calls, including mobile phone networks which are designated as forming part of the public telecommunications system.

Common questions answered

Q. Am I breaking the law by owning a scanner?

A. No, but it is illegal to use one to listen to frequencies other than general reception transmissions or those parts of the radio spectrum which your transmitting licence, if you have one, allows you to use. You could be prosecuted for this.

Q. Can I get a licence to use a scanner?

A. No, there is no scanner licence.

Q. Could I get authority to listen to emergency service transmissions, for example? I am interested and might be able to help.

A. No, authority is reserved for people acting under statutory authority. If you wish to listen in to messages, you should obtain the permission of the person sending them.

Q. Isn't it all right to listen as long as I don't pass on what I hear?

A. No, using radio equipment to listen in, except as provided by section 5(1)(b) of the WT Act, is an offence, regardless of whether the information is passed on.

Q. Isn't this all a bit heavy?

A. No. No-one likes their private or business conversations to be listened to. Parliament has passed these laws to protect the privacy of radio users.

If you require more information on the law regarding receive-only radio and scanners, please write to:

RA3/Enforcement Policy Unit,
Radiocommunications Agency
Wyndham House
189 Marsh Wall
London
E14 9SX

For further information on other radio matters contact the Agency's 24 hr Enquiry Point on 020 7211 0211

or e-mail on [email protected]

In other words, if you do listen in for your interest, good on you and thanks for your interest - but keep it under your hat!

..................hope this helps.

Am I right in saying that 5680 is an international distress frequency and therefore its monitoring is positively encouraged?

And doesn't that go for 2182, too?

Standto

Sorry mate but you are being just a little paranoid but thanks for the concern.

In any case you have lost the battle

Just try looking Here , Here and Here

And there are many, many more.

I appreciate your concerns, but anyone who wishes to use a scanner for unscrupulous( I really must get a Dictshu..Dicktion...oh sod it book of words :D) purposes isnt really going to pay attention to the WT Act 1949.


Oh and the last Policeman who saw me with a scanner at a Military Airbase, came over, had a chat then took a list of Freq's to put into his scanner (which was turned on on the seat next to him.)

You dont sound too chilled to me chum.

But lets not detract from the thread. Anyone of whatever branch of HM's armed forces or otherwise who straps a SAR Bird to their butt and goes into Action is a Goddamned Hero. it looks like the operation a couple of nights ago just went to reinforce that view.

You dont buy a beer in my Local. Nuff said!!

To be honest, I couldn't give a flying **** how anyone spends their spare time. All I've tried to do, is point out the possible pitfalls, which the UK Govt feel strong enough about to post advice on their website. If people don't heed that advice then so be it. It is their advice, not mine.

I did point out that unless the person was wearing dark glasses, a grey overcoat and spoke in a dodgy accent then I wouldn't particularly take an issue with someone parked outside a high security front line fighter base listening to ops..................this isn't Greece,after all!

On the subject of distress frequencies, I quite agree monitoring them alone would make perfect sense. However, I would bet you would spend a long time dialled into 125.5 or whatever before you got a hit. Allied to that, my understanding is that once a distress is acknowledged, unless there is extenuating circumstances, the recovery op is run on a seperate frequency to leave the distress channel clear for the next poor unfortunate.

As a final point on scanners, whatever you do, don't programme your local plod frequencies in. If you and your scanner were ever to part company, you might find that the rozzers may well take an unhealthy interest.

Whatever, enjoy your leisure time. Life is too short not to.

as a final note, on the subject of the thread itself, SAR is a noble profession and I quite agree!

Oh I See,

No, you would be wrong. 5680 is the primary day, world-wide SAR control frequency. It is used to exercise control over SAR operations and not as a distress frequency.

Mad Mark!!! :mad:

Stanto

Point taken, no hard feelings

StandTo

I now wish I hadn't bothered, but thank you for having my interests at heart, I am indeed well aware of the regulations.

Can we get back to talking about helicopters now?

Quite right - Back to helicopters.

No sig - I have a friend at the ARCC and he thanks you for your comments. My friend tells me that it was a busy day for SAR with a long range medevac from the QEII, a FJ ejection, a fatal civ air and the ferry on fire (plus the usual other routine SAR jobs!).

It was particularly refreshing to see such a 'can do' attitude from so many people. During the ferry incident there were crews calling in and manning up without being tasked and aircraft were being super-glued back together. The final count was 7 British military helicopters under orders, one Norwegian military and 2 civvie. Not to mention the poor Nimrod who got handed a bunch of squaks to allocate, a list of suitable rigs and the unenviable task of on-scene aircraft coordinator. Well done to all you guys.

Very glad this one had a happy ending
:D

Nasty noisy things with spinning wings

You mark my words no good will come of em, taint natural:D

Mad Mark

I’m not too sure you’re right there. I also thought I caught a whiff of ARCCK in your reply as they tend to confuse co-ordinate with control as well!

;)

Nice to see everyone involved in a SAROP getting a mention for a change! Public role of ARCC used to be limited to trying to explain to members of the press that "No, the Nimrod can't winch up any survivors, it's a fixed-wing ac and can't actually hover" - "Oh right. Can it scoop them up then?" - "??". Or alternatively, "No, we don't know where the missing walkers are; that's why they're still missing" - "Well when will the helicopter find them then?"
Still, well done to all involved; and best wishes to all still at ARCC.
By the way, what exactly is a "routine SAR job"?;)

Rumour has it that it was an NCO aircrew controller during this incident. Anyone heard the same?