Crab.

You are boring me.

Wow, what scintillating witty banter Tourist - maybe if you are bored you could entertain us with your endless supply of heroic dits, top tips and a virtuoso solo blowing of the RN trumpet;)

There is no point wondering what SAR-H or Long SAR will bring - even those bidding for it won't know yet what the final setup will be.

There may be SAR helicopters, of as yet undetermined types, at 10, as yet undetermined locations flown by a number of probably quite professional crews from all walks (including sideways) of SAR life.

If you know more, you had better write and tell the DfT.

I think you're both boring us all. Yes, obvious retort really, but doesn't mean it's not true!:)

Pot calling kettle or what!

Crab.

You are boring me too, in fact it's people like you who make me pleased to be a civvy.

I am not going to get involved in a who is better than who slagging match but it is obvious you have never flown with an observer.

Generally they have flown as ASW observers before flying SAR and as such they have skills WSops don't have, control grades for one, this allows them to control other aircraft in IMC (and in the good old days that included the nimrod), as well as directing ships as the ASW commander. they also fly as aircraft captain (or they did when I was one) a strange one for he light blue to understand but it generally worked well.

We were trained in SAR from day one and it was an integral part of both training and front line life, but was always regarded as secondary role however once appointed SAR we then had a further course to complete before being released on the general public.

Like I said I'm not getting involved in a who's better debate, although the final result is the same the ethos is different.

Nuff said, off to count my pay packet.

Someone other than the pilot acting as aircraft commander isn't all that strange to the light blue fraternity - it happened regularly in the Nimrod fleet. In fact, it was the logical thing to do and I quite liked the concept, in that scenario it worked very well. Different ways, different days........

I cansee - and it is clear that you have never flown with a RAF Radop and don't understand just how much training they get both pre front line and continuation trg.

Isn't that exactly what you have just done???

Or is it just that because most of our Radops are not officers, they cannot possibly be as good or better than your Observers?

In defence of the senior service Crab@, in the days when MoD(PE) project managers had to know quite a bit about the kit they were procuring (the how to maintain it was a given, but how to use it wasn't), the RN chap who taught me most about their HAS Mk5/6 work was an old and bold Chief Petty Officer Roy Henshaw, who I hope won't mind me mentioning his consummate skill.

Tuc - shame most of their pilots don't seem to share that view (of NCOs)

Crab - Does your obvious bitterness towards the dark blue always cause you to resort to sour, insidious snipes? It's 180 deg out from anything I've experienced during my 32 years in the RN.

Crab,

Are you sure about that? Everyone always said that Roy Henshaw was a top bloke...:p

Talking of which, I do hope the old trials tapes from about 92 have been kept. During debriefing, Roy was heard on the tape to moan (words to the effect) “******* piece of ******* S**T software, it’s telling me the sub’s just done a 180 in the last 200 yards. Better off in a ******* Wessex”.

Boss - “Roy, the company are sitting listening to this”.
Roy - “Well I hope they don’t get ****** paid”.

They weren't, Roy, they weren’t. Not until they fixed it.

Unfortunately what should have been a thought-provoking thread appears to have been hijacked by two tedious dick wavers. Having worked with many aircrew of differing services and nations, and of all ranks, I am of the opinion that the vast majority are highly professional, proud of what they do and generally top blokes with whom you wouldn't hesitate to have a beer and spin some dits. It's a shame that PPRune provides a soapbox for the tiny percentage of f*ckwits who would normally be sat on their own in the corner of the Mess/Wardroom/Crewroom/Pub wandering whether there was a party going on to which they hadn't been invited.

There, I feel better now.

Thank you for your valuable contribution Llamaman

You have certainly helped things along.

He has; you haven't.

216 posts in and he seems to have nailed you :ok:

FFS its all irrelevant anyway
The contract is going to be outsourced to the Indian Navy. They've plenty of volunteers looking for wives over here
They'll be taking on the maritime patrol task as well - you didn't really think those P8s were ordered for service in the Indian Ocean did you?
The whole job is going to be outsourced - even the Coastguard emergency phones will be answered in Bangalore - and they will be using local knowledge to manage the callouts

Once the transition starts and the jobs start to become available, do we really think the military will manage people into positions? Or will it develop into a free for all and the future winning bidder will just fill slots from where ever aircrew are available? Can't help but fear the last year or two of military SAR may become a difficult place to work if people start jumping ship early...

Despite the desire of the military to facilitate an ordered exit and transition, I fear it will be a total 'free for all' , particularly as the enhanced redundancy terms finish on 31 dec 15, so there will be much early 'ship jumping' to capitalise on that where possible. I think that the last year or so of mil SAR will be bloody hard work for the few people left behind!