PPRuNe Forums

PPRuNe Forums (https://www.pprune.org/)
-   Military Aviation (https://www.pprune.org/military-aviation-57/)
-   -   Serious question for a QFI (https://www.pprune.org/military-aviation/462169-serious-question-qfi.html)

Lightning Mate 31st Aug 2011 09:42

Newt, good morning mate. :)

You are more clever than I thought - you replied before I posted!!!!!

jindabyne 31st Aug 2011 09:47

newt

lower mate, lower;)

Lightning Mate 31st Aug 2011 09:49

Newt doesn't do low mate!!

Spent a lot of his time up at 100 feet. :E

airpolice 31st Aug 2011 09:59

Quality Banter
 

Spent a lot of his time up at 100 feet.
:D

Now that IS funny.

newt 31st Aug 2011 11:53

Clearly I'm still hypoxic from the experience!!

Must be all the clear air in Scotland:ok:

cats_five 31st Aug 2011 12:14


Originally Posted by Lightning Mate (Post 6669101)
In straight and level flight lift must exceed weight because the tailplane is generating a downforce for longitudinal stability.

The sum of all lift in straight and level flight (positive and negative, from all parts of the plane) = gravity, otherwise you would be going up or down.

Lightning Mate 31st Aug 2011 12:16

Owza fishin' mate?

Lightning Mate 31st Aug 2011 12:26


The sum of all lift in straight and level flight (positive and negative, from all parts of the plane) = gravity, otherwise you would be going up or down.
Sorry buddy - lift is a FORCE and cannot equal gravity because that is an ACCELERATION.

Back to Sir Isacc Newton.

Fox3WheresMyBanana 31st Aug 2011 12:39

Lightning Mate is right.

Lift is defined as a force.

However, formally, 'g' is referred to as the "acceleration due to gravity" to avoid this kind of argument.

The force on a mass caused by the acceleration due to gravity is, formally, weight.

The forces on an aircraft are in balance in straight, UNACCELERATED flight, which fits a constant rate of climb or descent as well as straight and level.

I haven't seen anyone correctly use momentum yet.
If you want a clear physical explanation of any of this, please PM me. I do this for a living.

Now, can we get back to interesting stuff like victory roll trimming and LL jokes?

F3WMB
MRAeS, MInstP

ktk 31st Aug 2011 13:26

not much time to trim here!! Mind you if he got it wrong!!

airpolice 31st Aug 2011 14:55


Lightning Mate is right.

Fox3, ffs no more of that, it will go to his head and then we'll be right in the deep end.

SI Units. (Expressions to make you sigh)

The way I was tought is that Isaac Newton discovered Gravity when an Apple fell on his head. Four Apples = 1 Pound therefore 1 pound = four Newtons.

Kilowatts is what the Electric fire used to run on and a Litre's like a Metre only better 'cause it's wetter.

BEagle 31st Aug 2011 15:54

The dear old Frightening was so ancient that its ASI was calibrated in 'furlongs per fortnight'....;)

Is there any truth in the story that the fuel gauge read 'Empty....Fumes....Not enough....Still Not Enough....All you're getting but really not enough'

Or that the altimeter read 'Ground pounders....Mud movers....Learning Command....Truckies....Air Defence Sky Gods and V-bombers only'?

newt 31st Aug 2011 16:23

Close BEagle but no cigar!!:D

Fox3WheresMyBanana 31st Aug 2011 16:31

From what I've seen, the Altimeter should be

Groundpounders, Buccaneers, War, Falkland Islands, and then a biiig gap before mud movers. Americans are somewhere above Learning Command.

Lightning top speed 4 million furlongs per fortnight (though that's an awful lot of AARs in a fortnight!)

FCSoverride 31st Aug 2011 17:20

I think.... momentum is mass x velocity. Velocity is a vector, thus momentum is a vector too, i.e. it has both magnitude and direction.

What this means is that, even at constant "speed" momentum changes around the loop (it swings around with the aircraft's velocity). Newton said roughly that "the rate of change of momentum is directly proportional to the applied force and takes place in the direction of that force".

To loop the loop, we need an extra bit of force perpendicular to the momentum vector to unbalance the forces on the aeroplane, i.e. to accelerate the aircraft mass towards the centre of the loop. This is produced by pulling back on the stick to increase angle of attack, increasing the lift generated by the wings, whilst maintaining airspeed with the throttle.

jindabyne 31st Aug 2011 19:56

Nobody's mentioned nibble (and flap) :ooh:

The_Agent 31st Aug 2011 21:11

my go at answering.
 
FCSOveride has a great answer for you right there.

I always like to relate answers to real world examples. Therefore: talk to your son next time you go around a roundabout. Ok, it's lateral 'g', but the principle is the same (get him to lean 90 degrees to the right if it helps).

Before you his the roundabout, there is no lateral 'g', right? Start going round it and he will be thrown to the outside of the car. Keep going round, and the 'g' force will remain. A loop or a break is similar.

In the case of a loop though, we already at 1 (not zero) 'g'. If I pull up into a loop with 4 'g', then that's what I will feel (initially). At the top of the loop I will be doing the same thing with my aircraft but now the plus 1 'g' I would normally feel is acting the other way so I would feel about 2 'g'. (3 'g' in the vertical). You need to picture "plus 1 'g'" acting vertically downwards at all times.

In truth no-one flies constant 'g' loops - it wouldn't look like a loop. A barrel roll is different.

For breaks, if you have the power, 4 'g' will remain the same forever. Depending on aircraft type and power available, it may reduce as, has already been pointed out, increased lift increases drag, reducing speed (unless you have more power).

newt 31st Aug 2011 21:38

Watch out Jindy as you can be banned for being rude!! Nibbles and flaps is very close to the edge!:\

teeteringhead 1st Sep 2011 07:02

And if, by chance, you have a helium balloon in the back of the car as you drive your son around the roundabout (traffic circle), he (and you) may be surprised at the way IT leans.........

Lightning Mate 2nd Sep 2011 07:27


not much time to trim here!! Mind you if he got it wrong!!

Did I detect a bit of roll/yaw coupling?

S'all abaht B/A ratio innit.

Morning Newt.


All times are GMT. The time now is 16:22.


Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.