You all seem to be overlooking the Fireball XL5 and Supercar option.........

That Supercar idea might be the answer. Cheap as chips with its 60s-era technology and it would only need the Royal Navy to recruit funny but strange looking puppets to pilot to it. If that goes over budget (as it most likely would) and belly up, the UK could always look at restarting a production line for Thunderbird 6 instead, thereby safeguarding jobs for the British aerospace industry. Sorted. :ok:

No to what?
The AV-8B and A-10 also flew over A-stan, so what? That doesn't make them suitable future strike aircraft for the Fleet Air Arm.
Your logic fails. Both Rafale and F-35 are multi role aircraft. Rafale is currently operational. So too is the F-18F. Funnily enough, the RAA seems to prefer the Super Hornet to the Rafale. Why do you think that is?
Just to keep you current with the history of Military Aviation, the F-16 Falcon started as an air-to-air fighter, and ended up through various blocks and mods as a decent air-to-ground platform. Typhoon may go through a similar evolution, but that depends on requirements and budget, as well as parallel tech advancement.

EDIT: sorry, looks like Typhoon is already air-to-ground certified, back in 2008. :O Oops, wasn't keeping up.

So we are agreed then - Bin Dave, chop harriers and gap till Big Lizzie gets wet, order up some plastic superbug.

Leave gr4 till bugs get here, chop gr4 and buy more bugs - common fleet twixt crab and matelot, crab have bugs and tiffin.

all other money into SH/AT

Where is my consultancy fee?

Probably the best summing-up I've heard in a long time - nice one!

doff's fez in salute - "I thank you"

Follow-up: Deliver conformal tanks, weapon pod, Selex IRST and Meteors to US Navy to retrofit late Block II Bugs, and for the extra Block IIs that they buy when LockMart presents them with the real price for Dave-C.

Develop Phoon to full potential with some of the $ saved by Dave-B cnx, and fill the gap left when LockMart presents them foreign suck..., I mean the international partners with the real price and schedule for Dave-A.

35 Billion black hole in procurement, 25% cuts across the MOD to save 5 Billion a year, and £20 Billion in Trident costs to cover.

If you lot think 2 new carriers, JSF or F18 are arriving anytime soon, you are dreaming.

The RN will consist of Albion & Ocean, a few subs and very few escorts. RM and CHF may survive, with the Merlin if they do.

The RAF will consist of enough Typhoons to guard the UK, no Nimrod, no RJ, no tankers, no Puma/Merlin and very possibly no A400M. I can't realistically see the new Chinooks arriving either.

The Army will be minus an amoured brigade with a smaller logs chain and minus anything else they can chop around the edges. Lynx will go and Wildcat looks iffy.

I'm afraid Mr Osborne stiffed any procurement plans when he threw us the Trident funding hospital pass.

Sitting here debating whether you'll get F18 or JSF may pass the day, but flies in the face of reality. I'll post a 'I got it hugely wrong' thread on Oct 22 if I have, but can't really see it.

"The rafale M is flying over A-stan,"

does it still need an entandard/mirage to hold its hand/carry the targeting pod for it?

MGD - I'll hold you to that one but I suspect your assessment is more righter than moine!

I don't care so long as there is plenty of stuff to see at the Airshows!:ok:

FB

By the way, has anyone thought about the idea of splitting the Army between the R.A.F. and R.N.:)

They're keeping Ocean? Problem solved!

Ocean flight deck length = 170m
Sea Fury takeoff distance = 170m (ish)

Just need to work out how to hang a Meteor on VR930 and we're sorted.

'Course, after my consulting fee, and the £2.7 Bn 10-year PFI PBL support deal we'll need to put in place with BAE, she'll only be available for ops one day a month. Less if the RNHF insist on taking her to shows.

:E

I/C

astronaute

I'll take that as a yes then

The yes is, you WILL NEVER GET the F-35 !:hmm:

Astro - why don't you go off a google 'French military victories' come back to us when you find some. Now there's a good 13 year old.

Lowob... Nice!

If Converteam do get the task of coming up with an EMCAT, I hope they make a better job of it than their efforts onboard my current place of employment.:ugh:

"The Rafale is on the block 3, soon it will be on the 4, then it will do everything you can ask to an omni-role fighter !"

only 25 years after it first flew, impressive!

Rafale's development process has been just as troubled as jsf in its own way, its merely further down it by virtue of being older

Dream on mate ! The Rafale is flying out of the PAN and CVNs.

All the F-18 pilots ( USN) are impressed by the plane.

Recall me what kind of naval fighter do you have !!!:hmm:

May I point out that the planned UK JSF buy is in penny packets until the '20s. We literally plan to buy a handful. The inevitable slippage is moving that to the right.

The intention at the moment is to save money - as soon as possible. What on earth leads anyone to think the government would even consider buying a new type - in numbers - which would require a large up front payment?

I would suggest that the likely option, without a current threat requiring a carrier, is to retire the GR7/9 force early, try and sell off the first CVA to India or elsewhere (including the GR7/9 wing as air assets), and look at harmonising the entry into service of the second CVA to coincide with the purchase of the F35C.

Time to adapt the design for EMALS and spread the cost.