BBMF visit question.
 

I would like to take my ex father in law ex AG (tail end charlie in Lancs, and Stirling too - not sure where he sat) there next week. I've had a quick look at the website and although it talks about availability, could someone let me know if there is something in the hanger to look at and rummage around? Also, how often do the tours take place (looking at arriving, 1400ish) and how long do they realistically last? Finally, my companion is quite fragile these days - is he allowed to look inside the bomber (if its there)?

He holds the MM and ended up doing 36 years, so one of us bullet pushers ended up doing good. ;)

Many thanks.

Al

Al,
Have you considered taking the gentleman a few miles further down the road to visit Just Jane?

The ride sounds like a great idea, and just what he needs at the moment.

Lincolnshire Aviation Heritage Centre

Thanks so much for the suggestion.

Al,

I was there last August - it was outstanding. The Lanc, several Spitfires and Hurricanes, Dakota and Chipmunk in the hangar and Typhoons operating from the ASP just the other side of the wire. Tour was about an hour with an extremely knowledgable guide (as they all are) and it was the highlight for many of the cadets I was bussing round (they didn't get bored;)).

Phone the visitor centre first to find out what's in residence. Also let them know you're bringing a MM winner from that period - it adds to the richness of the history of the Flight and you may get a more personalized service.

Hope you both have a great day.:ok:

R

Many thanks R.

Hi Al,

If you arrive a little earlier you may see a Typhoon practice at 1300 local.

It is a bit hit and miss if the slots are used though.

RAF Coningsby - Flying Information

'Beginning on Monday 16 March 2009, the Typhoon Display aircraft will be practicing for the forthcoming display season. Typhoon flying practice may take place over the airfield on weekdays, (Monday to Friday) within the following time slots: 0800 - 0830hrs and 1300 - 1330hrs. These times have been chosen to minimize noise disturbance to the local schools during lesson and exam times.

Daily display flying practice will then be reduced from approximately the beginning of May 2009 when the Pilot will have completed his work up phase.'

TJ

Another dimension to consider - the plan evolves!

Many thanks T.

No probs, Al. Hope you both have a great day out!

TJ

RAF MM - an unusual award
 

I too hope the day goes well - my limited experience of BBMF is that they are really helpful and will do what they can, existing commitments permitting. One thing intrigues me though

.

I'd be really interested to hear how he got the MM if you know. That's normally an army bravery award, but some RAF NCO aircrew POWs got it for successfully escaping from captivity - was that the case?

Its going to sound dubious, but I have never discussed it with him and we have just never talked about our respective careers. He never talks about his (wartime) service at all and I don't ask him.

I never knew that fact about the MM, but you're absolutely right. It could be that in the mists of time, I have got it confused with the DFM - I'll let you know.

MM Citations

Al

Well MM or DFM it doesnt matter, it is still a medal to be very proud of. Speaking as a post war nav whose biggest problem was finding that the sandwiches in the in-flight rations were a bit stale, I have the highest regard for these guys, and think they all deserved a medal, although of course that never happens. I have talked to scores of WW2 veterans over the years and never ceased to be amazed at the experiences they had. I really hope he has a great day, and who knows, it might encourage him to talk about his career.

Had a great day there in February surrounded by Spits, Hurricanes, Chipmunks and the wonderful Dakota and Lancaster. For an older gentleman it's an easy walk along the side of the hanger. If he was a rear gunner in the Lanc he'll be within inches of where he sat, as the tail is very close to the visitor viewing area. Nothing to clamber over, but the guides really know their stuff and there are usually mechanics working on the airframes.

There are also two separate base viewing areas and as already mentioned, you are likely to see Typhoons up close and personal.

Hope it is a wonderful day for you both.

Thanks both.

John isn't up to it this week, so we have put it on hold. Tanker - agreed, what difference does it make? I spoke with his daughter about it, and she thinks it was a DFM, so it was prob my mistake.

What he talks about is not the operational flying as such (I did take him to Munchengladbach once and he looked around, sniffed and said; '.. looks a bit different from the ground' - and that was it), but instead the esoteric craic, the gossip and the banter - the colour on the tapestry that we are going to lose because it wasn't and couldn't be properly captured and transcribed. The fact that he always hated Rockapes because one stole his push bike in 40-something, the waiting to get back to a decent breakfast and then hitting the sack like you would after any night shift in a cold room with people snoring, how crappy a certain bomber was because the seat was poor, or how the crews hated it and grumbled all the time and ached to get onto Lancs, and inter crew politik.

The post war period of service life remains generally murky to me, but he also talks a bit about the different grades of aircrew Warrant Officer that they had for a while and how that was treated with derision and scorn. When it became clear there were no slots for AGs in Vulcans and a possible discharge was on the cards, he went into admin. He was the Families Officer at Akrotiri in 74 and does talk of the pronto evacuation of the patch at BG in Limassol which sounded quite tasty. I think he would have rathered been sitting behind some .303s and not his in-tray.

Al, sorry to hear that John is unwell and visit put on hold for the moment.
Perhaps you might cheer him up by pointing him to the thread "Gaining An R.A.F Pilots Brevet In WW11" in this section (if you haven't done it already!!)
Please stress that it would be invaluable if he could pass on his memories before too late, as cliffnemo and regle are doing.
Just see what reactions those 2 have from all the readers who just can't get enough. I know many don't want to talk about the WW2 losses, but if he doesn't tell, then ALL the memories have gone, the ones who aren't still here as well as his. Even for family use, do get it on tape.
He might say "they're gone but not forgotten" but they will be if he doesn't pass that knowledge on.
I do hope he is strong enough and the BBMF boys can coax him into the Lanc.

Good call:ok:

Hi Al R.

Could I recommend a visit to the Yorkshire Air Museum at Elvington, Nr York. If you write to the director, explaining he is an ex D.F,M tail 'end charlie' he may be given permission to enter the Halifax with a guide. He may be allowed to sit in all seats, ask questions. and enjoy a meal in the N.A.A.F.I. at a reasonable price I wrote to the director, was given permission as a veteran to go inside the aircraft with a quide. Think there is a section on air gunnery, as well as other aircraft
Very nostalgic. They will mention a donation can be made.

PLEASE. How about you contributing , on his behalf, some of his stories to 'Gaining a Pilots Brever in ww 2' he is more than welcome.

N.B Members of the public are not allowed inside the aircraft, due irresponsible behavior ' in the past.

Al, what a great idea, especially with the added advice from others. PPRuNe at its best! cliffnemo and Icare9 both are spot on the money. The stories that Cliff, Reg and others enthrall us with on this forum always result in pleas for more of the same. Please try to persuade John to contribute his recollections if only by proxy. As someone who:
he is obviously a man of discernment and principle! :ok:
In all seriousness though we owe him and his colleagues our very freedom. I salute them all!

Al . Please tell John it wasn't me wot pinched his bike.
.
However , if he 'tunes in' to my thread he may be amused in a future tale of how a certain W/O helped the country's post war export effort by exporting old 'sit up and begs' in the bomb bay of a Lancaster . via Hemswell . Glatton. Pomigliano (Naples).
Tell him to join in the fun.

http://i274.photobucket.com/albums/j...IGLIANO169.jpg
I Q FOX At POMIGLIANO.

Icare,

I certainly will try. He suffered a close bereavement the other week and at the risk of being insensitive, I don’t want to bombard him with well meaning random acts of kindness when all he might want to do is draw breath for a week or two first. He had a heart attack a year or two back as well so I am just giving hm space. Thank you for the thought.

Cliff,

Thanks for that. I’ll print off the thread and hand it to him. He isn’t IT literate mind. He was at Hemswell (not sure when or who with); he and I went for a wander in the 90s and he took me for a tour around the old Barrack Blocks. There was a market there if I remember rightly. He showed me a poem that he had, all about tail end Charlies and I'd love to come across it again. It took a special bloke to do the job, and do it effectively.

Chuggers,

He grumbles that Rocks stole his bike AND his daughter although he might be mellowing a bit now. I wonder if he ever got his bike back? :ok:

Hi Al,

Unfortunately, due to deployment, the Typhoon practice displays scheduled for RAF Coningsby will now take place at RAF Leuchars. See link reference Typhoon displays.

29 R OCU at Leuchars

RAF Leuchars practice display

'Start date/time: 21/04/2009 11:50 UTC
End date/time: 22/04/2009 14:30 UTC
Activity period: APR 21 1150-1230, APR 22 1350-1430
Lower height limit: 000
Upper height limit: 100
AIR DISPLAY BY MIL FAST JET ACFT WI 5NM RAD 5622N 00252W
(RAF LEUCHARS, FIFE). DISPLAY BELOW 4000FT AGL EXCEPT FOR FINAL ZOOM CLIMB.'

See following thread for RAF Coningsby BBMF/Typhoon practice and display authorisation NOTAMs.

Validation PDA day Coningsby

TJ