Should Europe do a real Tornado IDS replacement?
 

Hi folks

it seems to me the Eurofighter is not the perfect aircraft for replacing the Tornado's in the mid range strike and long patrol missions.

The US seem to have an upcoming requirement to replace the aging Strike Eagle that appears to be a flying mirror with regard to radar cross section and manufacturers are pitching bomber version of the F22 and F23.

There was a photo of a FB23 desk model somewhere that I did a quick & dirty cut out on and recoloured it.

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z...g?t=1234481091

Shouldn't Europe work on something like this : real supercruise with a serious load, real stealth, a lot of range, two man cockpit for demanding missions..

The Typhoon can do nifty turns and climb fast, but isn't that what was needed 20 yrs ago? A NG Tornado IDS successor seems more usefull in todays / tomorrows world.

Looks a bit like the TSR2..... Isn't there a petition about that somewhere?

'Europe' Balls'ed up the Tonka, and then, after many delays the 'Tiffy'. Maybe the days of the European Tri / Quad 'Fighter by commitee' days are over........ I hope.

Advo

Occasional Aviator
 

You took some similar words out of my mouth there. The front end does look very TSR2 ish, But I also wondered whether the shape behind the two glazed areas was an inflight refueling receptacle, or maybe an auto astro navigation hatch stolen from an SR71.

Hmmm with F22 wings, TSR2 front and SR71 astro gear, maybe this is the FB22 "borrowed bomber", in which case it would be just perfect for the British:ok:

Edited to add: It's dirty due to the British government insisting on a UK engine fit, which never quite worked.

Does Warton still have the manned FOAS mock-up from the late '90s? I remember thinking that the bomb-bay appeared large enough to accommodate a couple of daisy cutters...:E

I/C

Does it really ?

http://www.suchoj.com/andere/TSR2/images/TSR2_13.jpg

Probably not a lot of fuel in that wings & definetely no stealth..

I wonder if investing more billions in the Eurofighter is a real good idea, from an operational / strategical standpoint.

Put a decent AESA radar in existing Eurofighters and invest in a Tornado IDS mission capable aircraft might be a better solution for the next 25 yrr I think.

Ahh b****x to all that.

Just imagine how many Mossies you could re-engineer fo' a fraction of that :}

...and just how small the radar return from all that plywood. So there we have it - a budget NG IDS, totally suited for our cash-strapped excuse for a nation :ugh:

The picture in the first post in actually a FB-23 rather the a FB-22.

The FB-22 looks more like this :

http://news.xinhuanet.com/mil/2004-0...6062225280.jpg

I'm wondering if the European airforces will be able to field a strike aircraft that will not be "one step behind at service entry" but not cheap...

Airbus studying manned successor for German Tornados
 

It seems at least the Germans are clear about the fact the Eurofighter is a good interceptor and great dogfighter but not a Tornado IDS replacement.

https://www.flightglobal.com/assets/...x?itemid=67469

"Airbus Defence & Space is eyeing a potential opportunity for European industry to develop a next-generation combat aircraft to replace the German air
force’s Panavia Tornado fleet post-2030."

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/ar...rnados-426634/

Manned aircraft :hmm::hmm::hmm::hmm:

In light of the Brexit vote, I guess we could start asking what would we use a Tornado replacement for? I understand the need for Typhoon to defend the motherland/fatherland, but Tornado?
In light of the fact that we are about to be shat on from a great height by our European "allies", it may be a good time to start winding our necks in re:expeditionary warfare and sticking our noses in other people's wars. Spend the money on the Reserves and build up a decent "Home Guard".
You never know, it may stop the likes of Blair et al from volunteering our boys to lose lives and limbs over meaningless bondu thousands of miles away.


Apologies for the thread drift.....

but how are the OUTS going to rebuild the Empire without a Strike Force?

We didn't have any the first time round........

Hunterboy, I had that thought too before I read your post.

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/ar...ounced-422866/

Interesting to see if Brexit affects this

Tornado Replacement
 

Not sure what is meant by Europe ..... Tonka. Having worked on the programme some time ago, it was very evident that the Germans were and still are extremely proud of this aircraft and its capabilities. They have been very clever in the way that they developed their fleet and as a consequence intend to operate it up to 2040. Compare this with the RAF who seemingly cannot wait to scrap it and its un-doubted capabilities in favour of the new 5th Generation toy. I note that in a recent statement, the MoD said that the 10 Tornado's operating against IS have been responsible for over 60% of ALL recce and intellegence gathering. There is so much more to Tornado than a simple bomb truck and Italy and Saudi intend to operate their jets till 2025. In my experience, Germany and Italy brought a huge technical input to the success of this highly under-rated jet. It is difficult to see that any similar future development programme would be any less successful (is that the right word) than F35.

well the F-35 buy may be another casualty of OUT

Buster, I'm not so sure the RAF 'seemingly cannot wait to scrap it and its un-doubted capabilities in favour of the new 5th Generation toy' More likely the RAF have flown the ar$e$ off their Tornados since GW 1 (over 25 years continuous operations in the ME). Some aircraft are approaching twice the original design life (8000 hours vice 4000) and any further life extension would be very/prohibitively expensive.

You mean this?

http://www.urbanghostsmedia.com/wp-c...E-Replica1.jpg