ASW aircraft - what is needed?
 

Can a 2.2 g aeroplane, cleared to no lower than 250 ft, with underslung big fan engines and no MAD do the job?

I know that if you don't have a MAD, then you don't need to fly those gut-wrenching cloverleafs (or vomit inducing MAD compensation runs), but isn't a MAD still a useful secondary sensor?

And don't the Nimrods and P-3s pull more than 2.2 g? And don't they go below 250 ft to prosecute an ASW attack?

My memory's not what it was, and it's a very long time since I flew on a Nimrod (nearly 30 years since I flew on a succession of sorties, then 20 years since I flew on a single trip) and my recollections are hazy.

Input from current/recent Nimrod or Orion blokes would be VERY much appreciated.

If it could discharge sonobuoys then whats the problem?

There always seemed to be more than that to ASW, didn't there?

Disregard my last, posted in haste:uhoh:

Errr...where did the 2.2g and minimum of 250 feet come from?

anyone...

Cheers...FD...:confused:

ASW aircraft - what is needed?
A requirement for one.

The ability to find a company that can build one.

Are we talking organic or carrier carrier borne?

But, if you're carrying a MAD equipped, air-drop, sub-tracking, ScanEagle UAV - which can stay on station for up to 24 hours after launch, why carry around another one of your own? :cool:

ASW aircraft - what is needed?

Firstly, a credible threat.

Or rather, sufficiently credible to justify the enormous expense of Nimrod '2000'.....

Which is emphatically NOT the same as the need for a multi-sensor air platform to replace the Nimrod in its current OOA applications, of course.

A Group Captain once reminded me that, as the Hercules has an Active Dipping Sonar and a full passive Sonics suite, then I should withdraw my objections to him wasting RAF money buying equipment for it.

On the assumption I was wrong (as he was supported by my 2 Star) it would seem the solution is more C130s. Er, can we have them without the sonics please?

Flight Detent,

Boeing's own figures for their P-8A.

They seemed like drawbacks to me.

Are they?

Ah this...

http://www.boeing.com/defense-space/...p8a/index.html

Just as long as all the bells and whistles are able to synchronise and relate to the kit used by the rest of the asw task group. No point being all shiny with link 16 if you cannot simulcast and tx to a ff that's on link 11.

Ya gotta think system rather than platform.

Unless you know how it networks with the planned Global Hawk ocean surveillance platforms, ScanEagle, surface and space platforms - and the capability of the systems on board - it's a question that can't be answered.

I would, however, suspect, that any seeming obvious omissions or because we have no visibility of the other systems which fill the perceived hole.

Dummies they aint.

Not every export customer will have the whole ASW 'infrastructure' that the USN has (eg India, who are buying theirs with a MAD), so looking at the P-8 on a platform basis is valid.

And while dummies they ain't, they are cash-strapped - especially on this programme, and there are some surprising omissions weapons and kit-wise.

And I remain fascinated to know whether this platform could do 'traditional' ASW in the way that Nimrods and P-3s do. Am I wrong in thinking that a "not below 250 ft" clearance and a 2.2 g airframe limit would inhibit this?

They're simple questions, and I'd really hope that some of our Kinloss PPRuNers might put me out of my (and their!) misery.

Define What exactly are you asking?

Multi-role is the way ahead:ok:







imo

I guess I mean the ability (in extremis) to prosecute an autonomous engagement against a fast-moving underwater target.

Is 2.2 g enough? Is 250 ft low enough?

Do current platforms go beyond those limits?

OK; I'll bite. Attitude + vertical and throttles to 200% RPM?

Random thought for the day - Could a suitably configured non-ASTOR Global Express do that job?

Yes, but there are far more efficient, versatile and cheaper options than a large business jet for the task.

Regards,
MM

How about this
 

I think we ought to buy one of these:

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Russi...aid/0194233/L/

Absolutely no idea how good it would be for ASW but what a hoot.