What's it REALLY like to fly in the CAF?
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What's it REALLY like to fly in the CAF?
Recently, I have done a lot of research about flying in the Canadian Air Force (CAF). I understand the all the stages of training and how demanding it is, but WHAT IS IT REALLY LIKE?
I currently have my mulit-IFR rating and I've applied to the CAF to be a pilot. Obviously, flying and training in the CAF is quite a bit different than flying and training in civil aviation. Is there anyone out there WITH FIRST-HAND EXPERIENCE who can explain the differences and similarities? Pros and cons? Likes and Dislikes?
Is there anyone out there who can compare the training that I have done to this point to get my Multi-IFR to the training that I would do in the CAF? I'd like to know how the training differs both in difficulty and curriculum.
Once the initial training is complete what is the life of a CAF Pilot like? Typical week or month... if there is such a thing. What is the advantages of a military flying career as opposed to a civilian one?
Again, I'm looking for both positive and negative input from people who have been there or have some sort of first-hand knowledge.
Cheers,
canucker
I currently have my mulit-IFR rating and I've applied to the CAF to be a pilot. Obviously, flying and training in the CAF is quite a bit different than flying and training in civil aviation. Is there anyone out there WITH FIRST-HAND EXPERIENCE who can explain the differences and similarities? Pros and cons? Likes and Dislikes?
Is there anyone out there who can compare the training that I have done to this point to get my Multi-IFR to the training that I would do in the CAF? I'd like to know how the training differs both in difficulty and curriculum.
Once the initial training is complete what is the life of a CAF Pilot like? Typical week or month... if there is such a thing. What is the advantages of a military flying career as opposed to a civilian one?
Again, I'm looking for both positive and negative input from people who have been there or have some sort of first-hand knowledge.
Cheers,
canucker
Apologies to Canucker...
If I may....
may I submit a sub-question to those in the nod who might be reading this....
Is there any such thing as TOO much experience? (Are the CAF looking for no/low hrs pilots who they can mould into what they want and don't have to worry about breaking bad habits? As opposed to breveted pilots with 500 hrs?)
Thanks...
may I submit a sub-question to those in the nod who might be reading this....
Is there any such thing as TOO much experience? (Are the CAF looking for no/low hrs pilots who they can mould into what they want and don't have to worry about breaking bad habits? As opposed to breveted pilots with 500 hrs?)
Thanks...
Canucker,
There seem to be few CF Pilots that frequent this site.
You may get a better response from The CF Pilots Lounge .
Unfortunately I think you may have to be a member of the CF to browse the forums but I am sure if you e-mail and explain your circumstances you may have some joy.
Good Luck.
There seem to be few CF Pilots that frequent this site.
You may get a better response from The CF Pilots Lounge .
Unfortunately I think you may have to be a member of the CF to browse the forums but I am sure if you e-mail and explain your circumstances you may have some joy.
Good Luck.
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OK guys I will attempt to answer some of your questions but understand a couple of things
1. I’ve been out for a couple of years
2. This is a big subject
I am basing my opinions on my experience as a QFI in Moose Jaw from a few years ago, but even with NFTC the basics are the same.
CAF pilot training can be very long and tough. Previous experience is a plus, as the basics of flying are already there. This helps in the early stages of training. What pilots with lots of experience must be aware of is that the CF does not care how you did it some where else. Saying “Well this is dumb why don’t we do it this way like I did before” is a fast track to getting the spotlight on yourself as having a bad attitude. Attitude goes a long way to the success or failure of your flying training. My advice is, use your experience to your advantage, but keep your mouth shut.
One of the biggest differences between civilian and military training is time. The CF wants people who can be trained and perform within certain time constraints. As a civilian if you are having trouble then you simply dig deeper into your pockets and fly more. This does not happen in the military. If you are having problems there are only limited resources and opportunities available. Sink or swim basically, albeit with a QFI trying to teach you how to swim as best as he can.
Another difference is speed. Most people get their multi-IFR on some thing capable of perhaps about 180 kts. The traffic pattern speed when I was in the Jaw was 240 kts with the Tutor capable of flying over 400 kts. The Hawk can fly much faster than that and coping with the difference in speed can be difficult for some.
What is the typical week of a pilot? Well that depends on what you fly but as a QFI I flew about 10 times, had 8-10 hour work days, could take the jet away on some weekends and went home with a smile on my face.
Now the downside is that I am not sure the CF is a place to have a long career. Spending perhaps 10 or more years in is a good thing but fewer and fewer are staying to the 20 year point. Frozen pay, ground jobs and a government who kicked us in the groin is why I left the CF for more lucrative pastures. I say get your training, have a ball and then use what you have learned to get a job outside the CF. That way you get the best of both worlds military and civilian. Mind you, after having made some cash in Saudi I might try to get back in to get the pension.
Other issues to think about are french training, secondary duties and perhaps not flying the kit you want to. Plenty of wannabe fighter pilots out there flying choppers. My overall experience was that the good outweighed the bad and my advice is go for it.
Some thoughts for you.
1. I’ve been out for a couple of years
2. This is a big subject
I am basing my opinions on my experience as a QFI in Moose Jaw from a few years ago, but even with NFTC the basics are the same.
CAF pilot training can be very long and tough. Previous experience is a plus, as the basics of flying are already there. This helps in the early stages of training. What pilots with lots of experience must be aware of is that the CF does not care how you did it some where else. Saying “Well this is dumb why don’t we do it this way like I did before” is a fast track to getting the spotlight on yourself as having a bad attitude. Attitude goes a long way to the success or failure of your flying training. My advice is, use your experience to your advantage, but keep your mouth shut.
One of the biggest differences between civilian and military training is time. The CF wants people who can be trained and perform within certain time constraints. As a civilian if you are having trouble then you simply dig deeper into your pockets and fly more. This does not happen in the military. If you are having problems there are only limited resources and opportunities available. Sink or swim basically, albeit with a QFI trying to teach you how to swim as best as he can.
Another difference is speed. Most people get their multi-IFR on some thing capable of perhaps about 180 kts. The traffic pattern speed when I was in the Jaw was 240 kts with the Tutor capable of flying over 400 kts. The Hawk can fly much faster than that and coping with the difference in speed can be difficult for some.
What is the typical week of a pilot? Well that depends on what you fly but as a QFI I flew about 10 times, had 8-10 hour work days, could take the jet away on some weekends and went home with a smile on my face.
Now the downside is that I am not sure the CF is a place to have a long career. Spending perhaps 10 or more years in is a good thing but fewer and fewer are staying to the 20 year point. Frozen pay, ground jobs and a government who kicked us in the groin is why I left the CF for more lucrative pastures. I say get your training, have a ball and then use what you have learned to get a job outside the CF. That way you get the best of both worlds military and civilian. Mind you, after having made some cash in Saudi I might try to get back in to get the pension.
Other issues to think about are french training, secondary duties and perhaps not flying the kit you want to. Plenty of wannabe fighter pilots out there flying choppers. My overall experience was that the good outweighed the bad and my advice is go for it.
Some thoughts for you.
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Just gotta chuck in my 2 cents...
wasn't a pilot, but was an Airnav. As for Saudi, have been out for some years now but I think Saudi's last few comments ring true. These days, you really have to watch out for politicians in uniform. Every now and again when I'm feeling nostalgic, all I have to do is dig out the old jock strap, and check the dents, and all is right in the world again
wasn't a pilot, but was an Airnav. As for Saudi, have been out for some years now but I think Saudi's last few comments ring true. These days, you really have to watch out for politicians in uniform. Every now and again when I'm feeling nostalgic, all I have to do is dig out the old jock strap, and check the dents, and all is right in the world again
Join Date: Sep 2001
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Everything said so far is correct. I think that the CF is a good career but I have been lucky. I've got everything I've asked for and I have yet to have a ground job. Others are not so lucky though and never get anything they want. There are many frustrations but you just have to realize that there are with any job. If your goal is to work for an airline and if you don't want to fly helicopters I would say don't waste your time in the Military. About half of all pilots will fly helicopters and if you go fixed wing you will probably only have 2000-3000 hours after 10 years.
Experience is a plus when you join and I would recommend to anyone coming to Moose Jaw to do some flying training before they get here. It improves your chances of succeeding and doesn't hurt in any way. Just remember you have to learn to do it our way when you get here. The pay is very good now with another increase coming in the near future. You start around $30,000 and after 5 years should be making about $60,000. I have been in 12 years and make just over $90,000. In 8 years I will get an indexed pension of at least $40,000/year. Although rumour has it that the twenty year pension is going away and the minimum time to pension will be 25 years. For saudipc-9, that is something to watch out for if your thinking about getting back in for the pension. It would suck to rejoin after they changed it and half to work 5 extra years for the pension. I have only heard rumours though.
The typical work week as a QFI in Moose Jaw is very different from the one you would most likely have on another squadron. Here we work 40-50 hours per week, fly 300-500 hours per year, and are home every night and every weekend.
Good luck with your decision.
Experience is a plus when you join and I would recommend to anyone coming to Moose Jaw to do some flying training before they get here. It improves your chances of succeeding and doesn't hurt in any way. Just remember you have to learn to do it our way when you get here. The pay is very good now with another increase coming in the near future. You start around $30,000 and after 5 years should be making about $60,000. I have been in 12 years and make just over $90,000. In 8 years I will get an indexed pension of at least $40,000/year. Although rumour has it that the twenty year pension is going away and the minimum time to pension will be 25 years. For saudipc-9, that is something to watch out for if your thinking about getting back in for the pension. It would suck to rejoin after they changed it and half to work 5 extra years for the pension. I have only heard rumours though.
The typical work week as a QFI in Moose Jaw is very different from the one you would most likely have on another squadron. Here we work 40-50 hours per week, fly 300-500 hours per year, and are home every night and every weekend.
Good luck with your decision.
