D-Day 80 Year Anniversary
FB
"so if they ever needed to do a substantial airborne drop in the future war scenario,"
I thought the days of a mass airdrop in a war died (with a lot of brave men) at Arnhem and Dien Bien Phu - 70 years ago.
Airborne forces almost always use a helicopter these days
I thought the days of a mass airdrop in a war died (with a lot of brave men) at Arnhem and Dien Bien Phu - 70 years ago.
Airborne forces almost always use a helicopter these days
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I have always thought that the Levene reforms were a missed opportunity to find out exactly how much the Army really believes it needs an airborne capability by making it directly liable for the associated cost of maintaining an airlift fleet of the requisite size. I am sure that it would quickly come to the conclusion that it had better things to spend the money on.
More horses than tanks...
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Apart from Operation Trent (and several drops during Corporate) - its a capability thats probably best not just gaffed off because it hasn't been used in a while. When was the last time the AD Force shot down an aerial intruder? When did the silent service last loose off a nuke?
Apart from Operation Trent (and several drops during Corporate) - its a capability thats probably best not just gaffed off because it hasn't been used in a while. When was the last time the AD Force shot down an aerial intruder? When did the silent service last loose off a nuke?
"Mildly" Eccentric Stardriver
I may be wrong, but I believe the last mass drop (36 x C-130) was Exercise Bold Guard way back in September '74. I left the fleet at the end of '75, and the RAF at the end of '76, so I'm open to correction.
Herod: I suspect you may be correct, as that was back in the UKJATFOR era, and I doubt there has been a proper 'mass drop' since that concept wound up. (I'd add that it cleaned out all other Hercules tasking for a number of days around the exercise.)
Happy to be corrected.
"Mildly" Eccentric Stardriver
ICM: Yes indeed, and of course Bold Guard was a tragedy. For those who don't know, it's on Wiki. I was on one of the last aircraft; 35 or 36, and the whole DZ was a blaze if red flares and lights. From my RHS, as we flew over I could see the freighter that shouldn't have been there. We naturally didn't drop, but diverted.
Total BS AGAIN. Cost cutting exercise got shot of Herks. Now trying to make out its all a plan to not have enough airlift in place.
How this twice bankrupt chancer is a Minister of State astounds me. And he keeps getting jobs.?????,
How this twice bankrupt chancer is a Minister of State astounds me. And he keeps getting jobs.?????,
" its a capability thats probably best not just gaffed off because it hasn't been used in a while"
that why the RN keeps HMS Victory I guess and the USN "Constitution" - but you can't just keep capability forever if its never used. No-one uses large scale paratroop drops any more and hasn't for at least 40 years - more like 65 in the west. Battleships have gone, cavalry has gone, torpedo bombers have gone...........
that why the RN keeps HMS Victory I guess and the USN "Constitution" - but you can't just keep capability forever if its never used. No-one uses large scale paratroop drops any more and hasn't for at least 40 years - more like 65 in the west. Battleships have gone, cavalry has gone, torpedo bombers have gone...........
I recollect seeing Starlifters for a mass drop going overhead, I am pretty sure this was the Arnhem 50th as six C-141s were used to drop UK and US paratroops. Which is a round about way of saying could not HMG have asked the US nicely to help out again with the planned June 6th drop?
" its a capability thats probably best not just gaffed off because it hasn't been used in a while"
that why the RN keeps HMS Victory I guess and the USN "Constitution" - but you can't just keep capability forever if its never used. No-one uses large scale paratroop drops any more and hasn't for at least 40 years - more like 65 in the west. Battleships have gone, cavalry has gone, torpedo bombers have gone...........
that why the RN keeps HMS Victory I guess and the USN "Constitution" - but you can't just keep capability forever if its never used. No-one uses large scale paratroop drops any more and hasn't for at least 40 years - more like 65 in the west. Battleships have gone, cavalry has gone, torpedo bombers have gone...........
It seems to me the decision on capability is being made on the decision to withdraw the C130, whilst replacing it with eurotrash which is some way from providing the same flexibility.
We could get rid of all armour - lets face it, the last armour engagement was 1991 and that wasn't exactly 'the Fulda Gap'.
Our ASW haven't sunk a submarine since WWII - they can go.
AD fleet haven't shot down an aggressor since 1945 - in the bin you go.
Apache's were actually bought to kill tanks - they haven't done that - useful, but off they go.
Subs have never fired a nuke, and last sunk a ship in 1982 - gone.
When was the last time regiments went over the top accompanied by pipe and drum - gone
Red arrows? Minesweepers?
So, we have an Air Force of a few heli's, transport and some bombers, with a bit of ISTAR, a Navy of carriers and a few escorts, some infantry and SF. Job done.
Form follows function
"… the decision on capability"
'Form follows function'; but form is limited by budget, which is limited by politics, limited by public perception - shaped by governments.
'Form follows function'; but form is limited by budget, which is limited by politics, limited by public perception - shaped by governments.
"So, we have an Air Force of a few heli's, transport and some bombers, with a bit of ISTAR, a Navy of carriers and a few escorts, some infantry and SF. Job done."
We're not a million miles away from that now unfortunately - but as safetypee says there is budget (far too low IMHO) and you start by cutting the things you're least likely to need. Parachuting large numbers of troops is clearly one.
We're not a million miles away from that now unfortunately - but as safetypee says there is budget (far too low IMHO) and you start by cutting the things you're least likely to need. Parachuting large numbers of troops is clearly one.
Our ASW haven't sunk a submarine since WWII - they can go
Not quite true actually. You forgot the Santa Fe which was crippled by the combination of a Wessex 3 with depth charges and a Wasp with AS12. It ran ashore in Grytviken and was later scuttled.
Mog
Not quite true actually. You forgot the Santa Fe which was crippled by the combination of a Wessex 3 with depth charges and a Wasp with AS12. It ran ashore in Grytviken and was later scuttled.
Mog