Not-so-woke Reds
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/b...oman-wlpwlk9hr
‘Bullies’ force out Red Arrows woman
A female member of the Red Arrows has claimed she quit the display team after making a complaint about bullying and harassment, it can be revealed.
The officer, in her early thirties, joined the elite team this year but after six months lodged a complaint to senior ranks about behaviour that made her feel “uncomfortable”, an RAF source said. They said the woman had raised concerns about a “toxic” environment and that the complaint covered the period up until this summer.
The claim comes after The Times revealed that more than 40 personnel, several of them young female recruits, have given evidence to an inquiry into the Red Arrows in the biggest scandal in the team’s 57-year history. As many as four personnel are now subject to investigation by the RAF and could be thrown out of the force.
Allegations included at least 13 instances of alleged misconduct, including misogyny, harassment, sexual assault, bullying and indecent exposure. It is unclear when the inquiry will conclude and whether it will be made public.The RAF source said: “Although things have happened since the last story came to light, the toxic behaviour is still going on and not enough is being done about it.”
In the latest case, the woman is said to have complained to senior officers about a series of issues within the unit of about 130 people.
Her case is particularly significant because it details bad behaviour from this year, at which point several servicemen had already been moved out of the elite force amid allegations they had acted inappropriately. It also casts doubt on suggestions by individuals in the RAF that problems in the Red Arrows were historical.
Philip Ingram, founder of the Independent Defence Authority (IDA), said he was “aware of the issues highlighted by this young officer”, adding that he “remains concerned that there is no real change in the culture in the Red Arrows”.
He said: “I intend to write to Sir Mike Wigston [the air chief marshal who is head of the RAF] with my concerns around this case, as it continues to highlight a failure in command and culture suggesting nothing has changed from what the IDA brought to his attention over a year ago.”
In August two individuals came forward who had given evidence to the ongoing inquiry into the Red Arrows.
One told The Times that individuals in the squadron “got away with everything” before an inquiry was launched last December by Wigston.
Another source said new female recruits were considered “fresh meat”. She said in August: “At the moment many females are at risk because there are numerous toxic pockets within the air force but there is no urgency to act.”
A third source helping with the inquiry said the allegations about the Red Arrows were the “tip of the iceberg”…..
The defence select committee, which in 2020 carried out a landmark inquiry on women in the armed forces, has reopened its inquiry following a series of scandals. The committee has asked for any new evidence as part of a follow-up after 4,000 women came forward to give evidence to the first inquiry. The women said they had experienced bullying, sexual harassment and discrimination in the armed forces.
There was also said to be “truly shocking evidence” of rape and sex for promotion or advancement.
The RAF said: “The RAF has a zero-tolerance approach to unacceptable behaviour and will complete thorough investigations into any allegations, and take appropriate action. However, we will not offer comment on the circumstances of individual personnel moves.”
‘Bullies’ force out Red Arrows woman
A female member of the Red Arrows has claimed she quit the display team after making a complaint about bullying and harassment, it can be revealed.
The officer, in her early thirties, joined the elite team this year but after six months lodged a complaint to senior ranks about behaviour that made her feel “uncomfortable”, an RAF source said. They said the woman had raised concerns about a “toxic” environment and that the complaint covered the period up until this summer.
The claim comes after The Times revealed that more than 40 personnel, several of them young female recruits, have given evidence to an inquiry into the Red Arrows in the biggest scandal in the team’s 57-year history. As many as four personnel are now subject to investigation by the RAF and could be thrown out of the force.
Allegations included at least 13 instances of alleged misconduct, including misogyny, harassment, sexual assault, bullying and indecent exposure. It is unclear when the inquiry will conclude and whether it will be made public.The RAF source said: “Although things have happened since the last story came to light, the toxic behaviour is still going on and not enough is being done about it.”
In the latest case, the woman is said to have complained to senior officers about a series of issues within the unit of about 130 people.
Her case is particularly significant because it details bad behaviour from this year, at which point several servicemen had already been moved out of the elite force amid allegations they had acted inappropriately. It also casts doubt on suggestions by individuals in the RAF that problems in the Red Arrows were historical.
Philip Ingram, founder of the Independent Defence Authority (IDA), said he was “aware of the issues highlighted by this young officer”, adding that he “remains concerned that there is no real change in the culture in the Red Arrows”.
He said: “I intend to write to Sir Mike Wigston [the air chief marshal who is head of the RAF] with my concerns around this case, as it continues to highlight a failure in command and culture suggesting nothing has changed from what the IDA brought to his attention over a year ago.”
In August two individuals came forward who had given evidence to the ongoing inquiry into the Red Arrows.
One told The Times that individuals in the squadron “got away with everything” before an inquiry was launched last December by Wigston.
Another source said new female recruits were considered “fresh meat”. She said in August: “At the moment many females are at risk because there are numerous toxic pockets within the air force but there is no urgency to act.”
A third source helping with the inquiry said the allegations about the Red Arrows were the “tip of the iceberg”…..
The defence select committee, which in 2020 carried out a landmark inquiry on women in the armed forces, has reopened its inquiry following a series of scandals. The committee has asked for any new evidence as part of a follow-up after 4,000 women came forward to give evidence to the first inquiry. The women said they had experienced bullying, sexual harassment and discrimination in the armed forces.
There was also said to be “truly shocking evidence” of rape and sex for promotion or advancement.
The RAF said: “The RAF has a zero-tolerance approach to unacceptable behaviour and will complete thorough investigations into any allegations, and take appropriate action. However, we will not offer comment on the circumstances of individual personnel moves.”
As a humble and retired airline pilot I have followed this thread with interest. I have flown with many ex Red Arrows pilots and found them in the main extremely pleasant people coupled with fairly self - evidently stellar flying skills. Reading some of the above is a reflection of the world we now live in. There is obviously and deliberately a lack of detail but much reference to toxic behaviour and ‘inappropriate’ actions but no precise evidence at least to the wider public. Cue the standard internet pile on, including of course here but the reality is that outwith the inner circle we don’t know what actually happened. As a commercial aviator after a long and stressful day I have found comfort and stress relief from a glass or three of ‘refreshment’. It is unsurprising that the display and fast jet pilots wind down in a similar manner. Indeed I have joined in after a long flight with many former team members in my long haul days. I am not sure what we expect of either the Reds or fast jet pilots in general when the skill set must surely be a high level of controlled aggression, courage, concentration and physical / mental fitness. Put bluntly it is unlikely that you become a fast jet pilot if you really wanted to be an accountant in Woking. So there is in the modern era an intolerance of any behaviour that doesn’t fit the now societal need. The recent RAF push for ‘diversity’ would highlight the way it is going. In conclusion this is just a personal alternative view with the caveat that if there really was very bad behaviour defined by any era then certainly that is unacceptable.
As a humble and retired airline pilot I have followed this thread with interest. I have flown with many ex Red Arrows pilots and found them in the main extremely pleasant people coupled with fairly self - evidently stellar flying skills. Reading some of the above is a reflection of the world we now live in. There is obviously and deliberately a lack of detail but much reference to toxic behaviour and ‘inappropriate’ actions but no precise evidence at least to the wider public. Cue the standard internet pile on, including of course here but the reality is that outwith the inner circle we don’t know what actually happened. As a commercial aviator after a long and stressful day I have found comfort and stress relief from a glass or three of ‘refreshment’. It is unsurprising that the display and fast jet pilots wind down in a similar manner. Indeed I have joined in after a long flight with many former team members in my long haul days. I am not sure what we expect of either the Reds or fast jet pilots in general when the skill set must surely be a high level of controlled aggression, courage, concentration and physical / mental fitness. Put bluntly it is unlikely that you become a fast jet pilot if you really wanted to be an accountant in Woking. So there is in the modern era an intolerance of any behaviour that doesn’t fit the now societal need. The recent RAF push for ‘diversity’ would highlight the way it is going. In conclusion this is just a personal alternative view with the caveat that if there really was very bad behaviour defined by any era then certainly that is unacceptable.
I am not sure what we expect of either the Reds or fast jet pilots in general
CG
If you join ANY close knit professional team you have to expect to put up with some banter and severe leg pulling until you have settled in and proved your credentials . (Male OR female newbies !)
Last edited by Haraka; 21st Oct 2022 at 17:37.
Cheers mopardave!
Usually behaviour of that sort is indicative of a superiority complex (we know best) which leads to a rejection of different ideas and fresh blood. (But that doesn't reinforce the stereotype that sells)
Last edited by beardy; 21st Oct 2022 at 18:30.
”Posted @withrepost • @mace_curran With Halloween rapidly approaching this seems like an appropriate question. Is your team playing dress-up?
Looking back at the various teams I’ve been part of, there’s a distinguishing factor that greatly affected my performance
Whether or not I was able to be ME
This was something I didn’t recognize until years after
In the thick of it, I was too busy trying to act how I thought a young fighter pilot was supposed to act
A lot of energy went into worrying about what everyone else thought
Was I laughing at the right jokes, was I not easily offended, was I being a “bro”?
What I should have been worrying about was the flying, the tactics, and being as good at my job as possible
When members of your team feel like they have to create two versions of themselves that don’t align, it’s not sustainable
It’s a surefire way to lose talented people…to burn them out
I’ve talked a lot about trust lately
Part of that environment of trust is inclusivity
Don’t create barriers that don’t need to be there
Invest in getting to know your people
Understand what motivates them…this investment will pay for itself 10x over
They aren’t all the same, even if they all wear the same uniform
#culture #inclusiveleadership #trust #community
📸: 2011, while in the Intro to Fighter Fundamentals course... starting to realize I need to "dress up" to fit in”
it’s not harmless, it’s not fun, and it degrades operational capability.
”Posted @withrepost • @mace_curran With Halloween rapidly approaching this seems like an appropriate question. Is your team playing dress-up?
Looking back at the various teams I’ve been part of, there’s a distinguishing factor that greatly affected my performance
Whether or not I was able to be ME
This was something I didn’t recognize until years after
In the thick of it, I was too busy trying to act how I thought a young fighter pilot was supposed to act
A lot of energy went into worrying about what everyone else thought
Was I laughing at the right jokes, was I not easily offended, was I being a “bro”?
What I should have been worrying about was the flying, the tactics, and being as good at my job as possible
When members of your team feel like they have to create two versions of themselves that don’t align, it’s not sustainable
It’s a surefire way to lose talented people…to burn them out
I’ve talked a lot about trust lately
Part of that environment of trust is inclusivity
Don’t create barriers that don’t need to be there
Invest in getting to know your people
Understand what motivates them…this investment will pay for itself 10x over
They aren’t all the same, even if they all wear the same uniform
#culture #inclusiveleadership #trust #community
📸: 2011, while in the Intro to Fighter Fundamentals course... starting to realize I need to "dress up" to fit in”
”Posted @withrepost • @mace_curran With Halloween rapidly approaching this seems like an appropriate question. Is your team playing dress-up?
Looking back at the various teams I’ve been part of, there’s a distinguishing factor that greatly affected my performance
Whether or not I was able to be ME
This was something I didn’t recognize until years after
In the thick of it, I was too busy trying to act how I thought a young fighter pilot was supposed to act
A lot of energy went into worrying about what everyone else thought
Was I laughing at the right jokes, was I not easily offended, was I being a “bro”?
What I should have been worrying about was the flying, the tactics, and being as good at my job as possible
When members of your team feel like they have to create two versions of themselves that don’t align, it’s not sustainable
It’s a surefire way to lose talented people…to burn them out
I’ve talked a lot about trust lately
Part of that environment of trust is inclusivity
Don’t create barriers that don’t need to be there
Invest in getting to know your people
Understand what motivates them…this investment will pay for itself 10x over
They aren’t all the same, even if they all wear the same uniform
#culture #inclusiveleadership #trust #community
📸: 2011, while in the Intro to Fighter Fundamentals course... starting to realize I need to "dress up" to fit in”
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
The old excuses - it was just harmless banter, a joke, a bit of fun, they’re thin skinned - used by racists, homophobes, bullies, sexists through the years.
So what do we do? Do we act like automatons because the fun police have instigated a campaign of fear lest anyone gets their leg pulled? There's a world of difference between "harmless banter" and abuse. Abuse, bullying and intimidation are unacceptable and I'd hope that anyone feeling threatened could vocalise their discomfort......I'd also hope those dishing out the "banter" would have the intelligence to know when to draw the line. Are we not just getting a little thin skinned? The fun and team spirit were certainly being sucked out of my final career and working life become rather dull as a result. We've lost any sense of perspective in so many things.
In this respect are the armed services divorced from normality?
I did 41 years as an MoD scientist, cheek by jowl with the RAF and army. I merely have no idea what is being discussed.
Put a job before us, we did it.
What happened to integrity, loyalty and the work ethic? Never mind good manners?
FFS
I did 41 years as an MoD scientist, cheek by jowl with the RAF and army. I merely have no idea what is being discussed.
Put a job before us, we did it.
What happened to integrity, loyalty and the work ethic? Never mind good manners?
FFS
What happened to integrity, loyalty and the work ethic? Never mind good manners?
FFS
FFS
An Astrophysisist I worked with once pointed out to me that if you just predicted that today's weather would be the same as yesterday's, you would have an 80% chance of being correct.
Apparently a significantly higher percentage than that achieved by Meteorologists
Last edited by Haraka; 22nd Oct 2022 at 16:24.
Couldn't agree more.......of course that kind of behaviour is unacceptable. I'm not suggesting it is and you well know that.