Not-so-woke Reds
Possibly as there was a lack of volunteers. Reds is a constrained tour with the positives and the big negatives of block leave and restrictions when you can take leave, plus a lot of working weekends.
Brings back a few memories. I worked with CW very briefly on 11 Sqn many years ago. I remember you had to put a gen app in for RAFAT. The overall mood seemed to be very negative about it and a sort of 'what's the point?'. I remember CW was very positive about it and spoke very highly of his time there. Glad I listened to him as I ended up posted there very shortly after. I accidentally stumbled across Jet Art Aviation some years later and he seems to have done really well for himself. I didn't know him particularly well, and I didn't fit in too well on the squadron, but I remember him being a proper decent guy.
Anyway... thanks for the mention of the book. Looks good and I look forward to reading it.
Anyway... thanks for the mention of the book. Looks good and I look forward to reading it.
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Positives I suppose would be no detachments such as Afghanistan when the war was on and a preplanned year where you would know exactly what you would be doing.
Never appealed to most. Better drinking culture on a Sqn without the publicity? Never was on my agenda, shame as I would have loved it.
I will simply say that, back in the Cold War, if you did not pop into the sgts mess bar at lunchtime for a swift half or a small wobbly, your annual assessment (AKA ‘Appraisals’ in todays yoof speak) would probably say “Sgt …….. does not support the mess…” and his numbers would be rounded down……..allegedly.
I will simply say that, back in the Cold War, if you did not pop into the sgts mess bar at lunchtime for a swift half or a small wobbly, your annual assessment (AKA ‘Appraisals’ in todays yoof speak) would probably say “Sgt …….. does not support the mess…” and his numbers would be rounded down……..allegedly.
The irony is that, for all the talk of this generation being woke, we are, and have, and are still on Ops. Not training for Ops.
The Reds offers a chance for front line FJ pilots to have a rest and do something different. For all that I take the piss out of them for being (currently) not on the front line, they all have and deserve a respite tour on RAFAT and do a fantastic job.
Last edited by Toadstool; 24th Aug 2022 at 23:41.
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I’ll give you a clue, he was a not a nice person, Bader.
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Last edited by NutLoose; 25th Aug 2022 at 01:17.
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I will simply say that, back in the Cold War, if you did not pop into the sgts mess bar at lunchtime for a swift half or a small wobbly, your annual assessment (AKA ‘Appraisals’ in todays yoof speak) would probably say “Sgt …….. does not support the mess…” and his numbers would be rounded down……..allegedly.
Yes have heard that (but a lot of great leaders are not considered nice people) but Colin "Hoppy" Hodgkinson also served. Lost both legs early 1939. Worked his way back in, in 1942. Discharged 1946 Joined Royal Auxiliary Air Force 1949 to early 50's flying Vampires if memory serves.
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As for the AMM's, they would only be there for, in theory, 12-18months, before doing the Tech's course. However, most got their first choice for one very good and specific reason. With the drawdown in fleets / locations, it benefitted both the RAF and the individual to be based at, and working on, a location and type that appealed to them. A certain "well known rotary station " did, in fact, demonstrate how effective this policy was with regard to how they treated AMM's as they wanted, and got, them back after they became Techs.
The (in)famous lunch time drinking ?....long gone, now replaced with?..... visits to the gym !
It will be interesting to see how these revelations develop and what, if any, effect they have on the public given most simply want to watch, as certain MSM thoughtfully explain to their readers, their, ahem, "aerial stunts " .
Internally is probably an entirely different matter and, whilst these revelations have reached the public domain, many of the issues bear a horrible and uncanny similarity to events at Lossie where it took, as I understand it, an SAC to have the moral courage to stand up in public and address a VSO as to the then flight safety culture...which lead to a significant investigation and some individuals " no longer employed " .
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I will simply say that, back in the Cold War, if you did not pop into the sgts mess bar at lunchtime for a swift half or a small wobbly, your annual assessment (AKA ‘Appraisals’ in todays yoof speak) would probably say “Sgt …….. does not support the mess…” and his numbers would be rounded down……..allegedly.
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I was watching the news this morning and the reporter was commenting that the Ukraine war, one of the most important and tragic world events of this century has all but dropped off the news channels and press, but Boris’s party was dragged out in the press and news channels for over a year and it probably still hasn’t finished.
What with all the posts about Wigston's wokery, the pause in recruiting white guys and the farce of the Red Arrows I'm amazed no one's joined the dots and made the connection. Just as the BBC pointed out about the Lionesses, the Reds really should be called the Whites - distinct lack of diversity! No women, no people of colour, no LGBTQ+, no one with special needs - c'mon RAFAT you can, should and must do better.
Jesus christ.... Why are you people always doing this?
Nutty, you’d be surprised how appealing OO deployments were/are. For all the talk of how things used to be, this generation or the half generation ago are or were involved in proper kinetic operations. We are and have been involved in combat. Oh for the good old days of the Cold War and getting pissed on Wobbly.
The irony is that, for all the talk of this generation being woke, we are, and have, and are still on Ops. Not training for Ops.
The Reds offers a chance for front line FJ pilots to have a rest and do something different. For all that I take the piss out of them for being (currently) not on the front line, they all have and deserve a respite tour on RAFAT and do a fantastic job.
The irony is that, for all the talk of this generation being woke, we are, and have, and are still on Ops. Not training for Ops.
The Reds offers a chance for front line FJ pilots to have a rest and do something different. For all that I take the piss out of them for being (currently) not on the front line, they all have and deserve a respite tour on RAFAT and do a fantastic job.
On the other side of the coin, you have to have that arrogance and mentality to be a leader and a fighter in the first place, so unfortunately it is hard to have one without the other.
Personal experience says otherwise - historically see Gibson and Cheshire.
Personal experience says otherwise - historically see Gibson and Cheshire.
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I was once on an exercise where we were allowed 2 cans of beer per day, we all saved them up and had an excellent party... They didn't see the funny side of that little episode.
Sorry, that wasn't the case at the time. The Reds have always been an attractive tour for many engineers and apprenti were just sent to wherever, irrespective of their wishes although it would be fair to say some did get them fulfilled .
As for the AMM's, they would only be there for, in theory, 12-18months, before doing the Tech's course. However, most got their first choice for one very good and specific reason. With the drawdown in fleets / locations, it benefitted both the RAF and the individual to be based at, and working on, a location and type that appealed to them. A certain "well known rotary station " did, in fact, demonstrate how effective this policy was with regard to how they treated AMM's as they wanted, and got, them back after they became Techs.
The (in)famous lunch time drinking ?....long gone, now replaced with?..... visits to the gym !
It will be interesting to see how these revelations develop and what, if any, effect they have on the public given most simply want to watch, as certain MSM thoughtfully explain to their readers, their, ahem, "aerial stunts " .
Internally is probably an entirely different matter and, whilst these revelations have reached the public domain, many of the issues bear a horrible and uncanny similarity to events at Lossie where it took, as I understand it, an SAC to have the moral courage to stand up in public and address a VSO as to the then flight safety culture...which lead to a significant investigation and some individuals " no longer employed " .
As for the AMM's, they would only be there for, in theory, 12-18months, before doing the Tech's course. However, most got their first choice for one very good and specific reason. With the drawdown in fleets / locations, it benefitted both the RAF and the individual to be based at, and working on, a location and type that appealed to them. A certain "well known rotary station " did, in fact, demonstrate how effective this policy was with regard to how they treated AMM's as they wanted, and got, them back after they became Techs.
The (in)famous lunch time drinking ?....long gone, now replaced with?..... visits to the gym !
It will be interesting to see how these revelations develop and what, if any, effect they have on the public given most simply want to watch, as certain MSM thoughtfully explain to their readers, their, ahem, "aerial stunts " .
Internally is probably an entirely different matter and, whilst these revelations have reached the public domain, many of the issues bear a horrible and uncanny similarity to events at Lossie where it took, as I understand it, an SAC to have the moral courage to stand up in public and address a VSO as to the then flight safety culture...which lead to a significant investigation and some individuals " no longer employed " .
Last edited by Diff Tail Shim; 25th Aug 2022 at 10:06.