Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Aircrew Forums > Military Aviation
Reload this Page >

Obituary: Sir Peter Harding

Military Aviation A forum for the professionals who fly military hardware. Also for the backroom boys and girls who support the flying and maintain the equipment, and without whom nothing would ever leave the ground. All armies, navies and air forces of the world equally welcome here.

Obituary: Sir Peter Harding

Old 25th Aug 2021, 13:12
  #21 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baston
Posts: 3,196
Received 415 Likes on 191 Posts
Fair enough! As I said, the 2 hours notice was scorned by the customers and the forecasters ........ whatever else were we there for but to provide forecasts? I only ever worked with one work-to-rule man, and he did not thrive, no S Met O wanted him around.

The background to the Sunshine episode [I know, never complain, never explain .....] was simply this. Every night we prepared a "Standard Area Forecast" for transmission by BFBS at [I think] 0600. It was for the many 1BR Corps choppers and light aircraft scattered all over N Germany on little pads and strips, and often in a field with just a box-body, a tent and a bowser. This forecast was a top priority, and it took a fair amount of time to prepare, and a fair time to read by BFBS.
The only higher priority [apart from warnings] was the NW Europe Sig Weather forecast which was, essentially, the Group guidance for the forecasters in the Clutch, at Gutersloh and Detmold, and also looked Eastwards for Armageddon.

Both the above were prepared AS LATE AS POSSIBLE to take advantage of the latest data and the phone-ins from troops in the field. Thus the Sunshine episode

Regards

​​​​​​​Sunshine.
langleybaston is online now  
Old 25th Aug 2021, 14:52
  #22 (permalink)  

Avoid imitations
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
Posts: 14,560
Received 401 Likes on 209 Posts
Langley, I remember listening to those forecasts on BFPS. I also remember how poor the winter weather could be on the North German Plain, for weeks at a time……

I once arrived at an exercise deployment field location on top of a low hill, in very poor visibility and cold low cloud only to be told almost immediately by a certain flight commander to get airborne again and do a local area weather check! I told him that without getting airborne again that the weather was barely flyable and was getting worse.

A squadron colleague of mine then volunteered to do an airborne check, making me look a bit stupid and in an obvious attempt to elevate the Boss’s opinion of him. He took off, lifted to the hover and almost immediately disappeared into very low cloud. He had to climb to Safety Altitude and divert to Gutersloh and was unable to get back to the field site for 36 hours! I didn’t look quite so stupid then, at least in the eyes of said Flt. Cdr.
ShyTorque is offline  
Old 25th Aug 2021, 20:20
  #23 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Surrey, UK
Posts: 897
Received 10 Likes on 6 Posts
Originally Posted by langleybaston
Very senior Officers' chopper pilots can be touchy. As in RAFG c. 1981.
This S/Ldr rang me on a very busy night shift for a route forecast eastwards from JHQ [Wegberg? ] ,not an emergency except that he had forgotten to book it.. We never worked to rule, but the "rule" was 2 hours notice, agreed by all and sundry.
He was unamused to be told that he was in a shortish queue, but would get what he wanted well before doors closed..
After some threats and abuse {"do you know who I am?"] crashed around my head I said "Ring back in half an hour Sunshine". Which he did.

The pilot eventually complained to AO C in C who complained to SASO who complained to CMetO who had me on the carpet...Apparently the problem was "sunshine".
At zero dark forty he was lucky I didn't call him w@nker. C Met O had a sense of humour so it wasn't a career-defining moment..

Except that for the rest of my time at JHQ I was known as Sunshine.
Well, you had provided him with a weather forecast...
steamchicken is offline  
Old 25th Aug 2021, 20:34
  #24 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Rural England, thank God.
Posts: 719
Received 19 Likes on 11 Posts
It is worth noting that Flatiron, who used to post a bit here, has today had an addendum to Harding's orginal obit published in today's Times, which sets out to lay emphasis on his service skills rather than his eye for the ladies.
skua is offline  
Old 25th Aug 2021, 22:41
  #25 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Elsewhere
Posts: 608
Received 67 Likes on 27 Posts
Originally Posted by skua
It is worth noting that Flatiron, who used to post a bit here, has today had an addendum to Harding's orginal obit published in today's Times, which sets out to lay emphasis on his service skills rather than his eye for the ladies.
Please try to stay on topic. This is a thread about Met stories.
itsnotthatbloodyhard is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2021, 10:08
  #26 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Their Target for Tonight
Posts: 582
Received 28 Likes on 4 Posts
I understand, and indeed admire, Rick’s defence of a man he respected and liked. However, Peter Harding’s actions within the mores of the time significantly hurt the reputation of the British military in general and the RAF in particular.

What is worse is that he was the man ultimately responsible for the disciplinary action being taken at the time against subordinates who had behaved in a similar fashion. Such utter hypocrisy is not the mark of a leader who deserves respect.
Red Line Entry is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2021, 11:22
  #27 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Pastures new
Posts: 354
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
Originally Posted by Red Line Entry
I understand, and indeed admire, Rick’s defence of a man he respected and liked. However, Peter Harding’s actions within the mores of the time significantly hurt the reputation of the British military in general and the RAF in particular.

What is worse is that he was the man ultimately responsible for the disciplinary action being taken at the time against subordinates who had behaved in a similar fashion. Such utter hypocrisy is not the mark of a leader who deserves respect.
Worth noting too that he issued the first edition of “Ethos, Core Values and Standards of the RAF”. As you say, hypocrisy.
kintyred is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2021, 18:34
  #28 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 1,055
Received 23 Likes on 11 Posts
Instant PVR ?

.“Ethos, Core Values and Standards of the RAF”.
Didn't Lord Trenchard initiate that admirable and noble concept ? .
Did

In ye olden days when PVR stood for 'Instant stoppage of Flying and Flying Pay and a posting to two years night duty in the nearest Command Bunker' before actually being allowed to leave, I admired the chutzpah of those who discovered and exercised the instantly effective counter gambit.

Was Sir PH merely trying to expedite his PVR ?

LFH
...

Last edited by Lordflasheart; 26th Aug 2021 at 18:43. Reason: additional musings
Lordflasheart is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2021, 20:54
  #29 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Cape Town South Africa
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
From Rick O’Molony - Wessex Pilot - Peter Harding 18 Sqn, ‘68 - 70

Originally Posted by langleybaston
Doing the honourable thing these days is so old-fashioned. Sir Peter did a good job for his country.

If he were French, a bit on the side would have added to his CV of course.
From Rick O’Molony: I had the honour to serve as an officer, flying the Wessex with him being Squadron Commander of 18 Squadron, ‘68 - ‘70, Odiham, Acklington and Gutersloh.
Finest Leader of Men, I have ever encountered in my varied careers. He was the Best of the best, as a military leader. Commanding presence, brilliant, innovative mind. His single emotional indiscretion, cost the British Services a major loss of one of it’s most brilliant minds and leaders of his era. History is littered with heroes and famous leaders that had illicit affairs of the heart in their lives, but few were discarded as callously as this towering leader of men - Sir Peter - my Captain my Captain. Most of my fellow RAF Officers and men that served under him, carry the same sentiments that I do.
RickOmo is offline  
Old 27th Aug 2021, 10:40
  #30 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Their Target for Tonight
Posts: 582
Received 28 Likes on 4 Posts
Oh Rick, give it a rest! An ‘affair of the heart’ - really? So following his heart, Peter Harding gave up his career voluntarily to settle down with his finally-discovered soulmate, enabling them to spend the rest of their years in a loving relationship. What a sweet and uplifting story…

Sir Peter was thinking with an organ all right, but it wasn’t his heart!
Red Line Entry is offline  
Old 28th Aug 2021, 08:59
  #31 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Ferrara
Posts: 8,254
Received 329 Likes on 194 Posts
To quote a better writer than me:-

Friends, Romans, countrymen, lend me your ears;
I come to bury Caesar, not to praise him.
The evil that men do lives after them;
The good is oft interred with their bones;
So let it be with Caesar.

Asturias56 is offline  
Old 28th Aug 2021, 12:58
  #32 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Hong Kong
Age: 79
Posts: 539
Received 22 Likes on 13 Posts
At least he took her to the Dorchester.
Barksdale Boy is offline  
Old 28th Aug 2021, 13:16
  #33 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: York
Posts: 620
Received 23 Likes on 14 Posts
Originally Posted by Barksdale Boy
At least he took her to the Dorchester.
was he on ‘actuals’ 😉
dctyke is online now  
Old 30th Aug 2021, 06:59
  #34 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 509
Received 21 Likes on 6 Posts
Surely one ceiling looks very much like another!

Personally I would say it doesn't matter how good a leader he was-if he didn't follow the rules of behaviour (in this case shagging a married woman) he needed to go. I remember it well-a number of people whom I knew who had been 'dealt with" were ready with letters to send to the PM in the event that he had not been 1021'd. Only question I would have is who would write it?
vascodegama is offline  
Old 30th Aug 2021, 20:01
  #35 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baston
Posts: 3,196
Received 415 Likes on 191 Posts
Surely one ceiling looks very much like another!

mirrors?

langleybaston is online now  
Old 31st Aug 2021, 11:43
  #36 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Cheshire, California, Geneva, and Paris
Age: 67
Posts: 866
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
It was lucky that you didn't have to send your letter to the present PM as he would have wanted " a piece of the action"
DC10RealMan is offline  
Old 31st Aug 2021, 14:51
  #37 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Under the clouds now
Age: 86
Posts: 2,498
Received 12 Likes on 10 Posts
Originally Posted by DC10RealMan
It was lucky that you didn't have to send your letter to the present PM as he would have wanted " a piece of the action"
He has probably been there already!
brakedwell is offline  
Old 1st Sep 2021, 10:04
  #38 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Somewhere Sunny
Posts: 1,600
Received 14 Likes on 8 Posts
In August 1991 Sir Peter Harding was flown down to an international sporting event which had a significant RAF involvement in it (and I was team manager at this stage). I met him off the helicopter (well, a Gp Capt did and I stood behind him) and he was accompanied by a women who was not his wife. He seemed quite animated around her. The Gp Capt, looking a bit flustered explained she was a researcher 'from the House of Commons' and not to mention it. Similarly, the woman in question was kept out of the publicity photos.

I can't remember if it was Lady Buck, when the scandal broke several years later, but I often wondered who this much younger woman was, and why she was being taken to official events.

Last edited by Whenurhappy; 1st Sep 2021 at 10:24.
Whenurhappy is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.