Afghanistan 2021 Onwards
Horrific - but no question you'd have to make some rapid military decisions on the flight deck and go regardless of the consequences.
Do C-17s have external cameras that look back at the airframe from the wings?
Tried to google - but unclear.
Assume that the Apaches would be telling the crew they had people hanging off the jet.
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The first crew might have not been aware but following crews would, I take it has sunk in to the heads of those on the airfield watching that depart it was a bad idea, the trouble is in doing that they are actually acting against their chances of getting away as they are stopping jets from departing and landing.
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Don’t sell arms to any third world country (do we still use that?)? So you would deny them the means to defend themselves? And of course that would need all countries to do the same. Good luck persuading China, Russia, France etc with that.
But my main question - you seem to suggest they could pay the west to defend them? Really, or have I misunderstood?
The first crew might have not been aware but following crews would, I take it has sunk in to the heads of those on the airfield watching that depart it was a bad idea, the trouble is in doing that they are actually acting against their chances of getting away as they are stopping jets from departing and landing.
Video online of person outside tied to aircraft - taken from inside the jet at altitude.
Ghastly.
I see the more forces are being flown the Kabul to help control the airfield but how on earth are they going to extract them at the end of the operation? Surely as they start to pull out, the crowds will get more desperate and the forces to control them will be less.
Or, hard as this might be for some to stomach, a deal which sees the Taliban controlling the airfield perimeter in return for humanitarian aid or talks leading to diplomatic recognition. In the long run that might be seen as wiser.
Last edited by Easy Street; 17th Aug 2021 at 08:29.
C130s (needing less runway length to be kept clear) and then the last few hundred by helicopter to Pakistan, I should imagine with some form of collapsing perimeter to a rooftop HLS for crowd control purposes
Or, hard as this might be for some to stomach, a deal which sees the Taliban controlling the airfield perimeter in return for humanitarian aid or talks leading to diplomatic recognition. In the long run that might be seen as wiser and less humiliating.
Or, hard as this might be for some to stomach, a deal which sees the Taliban controlling the airfield perimeter in return for humanitarian aid or talks leading to diplomatic recognition. In the long run that might be seen as wiser and less humiliating.
Using own forces keeps control in “allied” hands but there may be a price. If crowd pressure mounts as we saw in the clips of the C-17 trying to taxi, there will come a point where shots will be fired which will not play well in the media. Perhaps now would be a good time to buy shares in razor wire?
Still, enough armchair strategy, I am sure “they” have a plan.
It’s a conundrum. In some ways, getting the Taliban to take charge of the airport seems the better option. A chance for them to show they are in authority and if any civilians got hurt in the process it would be down to them, they have fewer compunctions in this regard. I see some snags though. There are probably a lot of people on the airfield that they have an interest in and they might want a say in who goes and stays as part of the deal, and they might want “departure fees”
Using own forces keeps control in “allied” hands but there may be a price. If crowd pressure mounts as we saw in the clips of the C-17 trying to taxi, there will come a point where shots will be fired which will not play well in the media. Perhaps now would be a good time to buy shares in razor wire?
Still, enough armchair strategy, I am sure “they” have a plan.
Using own forces keeps control in “allied” hands but there may be a price. If crowd pressure mounts as we saw in the clips of the C-17 trying to taxi, there will come a point where shots will be fired which will not play well in the media. Perhaps now would be a good time to buy shares in razor wire?
Still, enough armchair strategy, I am sure “they” have a plan.
The new "government" will eventually clear everyone from the airport - they need it themselves..... right now they're probably too busy freeing their mates and rounding up the more obvious opponents as well as trying to make sure everything keeps running - food,water, electricity.
The pictures of mob scenes at the airport don't rebound on them yet so its not a priority
The pictures of mob scenes at the airport don't rebound on them yet so its not a priority
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But my main question - you seem to suggest they could pay the west to defend them? Really, or have I misunderstood?
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One thing that comes out of this is the UK Governement have got away with this lightly, imagine the repercussions if the runway at Brize was still out of action.
Horrific - but no question you'd have to make some rapid military decisions on the flight deck and go regardless of the consequences.
Do C-17s have external cameras that look back at the airframe from the wings?
Tried to google - but unclear.
Assume that the Apaches would be telling the crew they had people hanging off the jet.
Do C-17s have external cameras that look back at the airframe from the wings?
Tried to google - but unclear.
Assume that the Apaches would be telling the crew they had people hanging off the jet.
How each of them deals with it is going to be a personal choice. If it were me, I'd take the view that anyone hanging onto the outside of my aircraft has their own agency and the consequences of their choices are reasonably foreseeable to them. Their choices don't get to affect the prospects of those being evacuated in my aircraft. We go, regardless. That being so, I would not want a camera or an Apache telling me there were people hanging off the outside, and I wouldn't attempt to correlate videos of people falling with any sorties I might have flown. So please don't tell me how terrible or horrific the decision to go "must" have been, because as far as I'm concerned it wasn't, and I don't appreciate the implication that I'm an emotionless psychopath.
My personal take. Others will differ. Hopefully those looking out for the crews (whether colleagues, commanders, friends or family) will avoid clumsy one-size-fits-all approaches. Maybe someone can tell us how train drivers are counselled after on-track suicides? I'm willing to bet that no-one tells them "that must have been horrific"...
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I am sure that the runway at Brize was very rapidly deemed fit for use. But I do admire the innate ability of some to pick out the trivia!
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oh, and it is ‘welched’
Seriously though - anybody remember the 'Taliban Last Stand' building where the head shed had their HQ? Seems very ironic now...
(NB: and why the heck does L aser make l@ser!!? Is it a quirk of vbb script?)