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Deployable Mission Rehearsal Trainers

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Deployable Mission Rehearsal Trainers

Old 11th Apr 2021, 08:02
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Deployable Mission Rehearsal Trainers

Containerised F-35 simulators being deployed aboard QE, for emergency and mission rehearsal training. As an ex Sim instructor, I wonder who will provide the instructors......
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Old 11th Apr 2021, 10:41
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Where will they find the instructors?

I would bet very good money itíll be other fully qualified F35 pilots.

For emergencies anyone can run the console. For more demanding stuff any supervisor or instructor.

With a decent script and suitably qualified people nothing is difficult.

BV
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Old 11th Apr 2021, 12:09
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I was in the sim business when this idea was first mooted. The company that got the contract was trying to recruit civilian sim instructors and technicians including for time at sea. They were not offering huge money. They did not get much interest.And, whilst not wishing to disagree with BV, operating a complex scenario with multiple ground and air “Computer Generated Forces” can be quite a specialist skill. Still, I suppose the current pilots will have plenty of time at sea to master it!

Last edited by Timelord; 11th Apr 2021 at 12:37.
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Old 11th Apr 2021, 13:12
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I'm sure that the experience of sitting in a simulated cockpit in any sort of sea state will be....quite interesting. Probably somewhat disorientating too...??

Unless, that is, these things are simply Part-Task Trainers?
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Old 11th Apr 2021, 13:35
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BEagle and Timelord

Firstly Iím sure I remember hearing that specialist cradles had been procured to eliminate the motion of the ocean though I may be wrong.

Secondly, I and many of my brethren are fully qualified simulator operators and instructors alongside our role as QFIs. Itís part of the lifestyle nowadays.

Modern sims have been designed to be user friendly and the complex scenarios you describe are all in a days work now.

In fact, the old days of sim instructors who were experts on the sim but werenít qualified on type are no longer the norm.

Who better to put an F35 pilot through his paces than another F35 pilot? Why pay a civilian to become suitably qualified (and security cleared) when you have a ready pool of pilots in the wardroom?

BV
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Old 11th Apr 2021, 14:22
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"Firstly I’m sure I remember hearing that specialist cradles had been procured to eliminate the motion of the ocean though I may be wrong."

'Twould require a massively complex arrangement to counter ship's heave, even if you could sort pitch and roll. I imagine random undemanded applications of +/- 1/2 G in the box would cause a certain amount of gyro-toppling and lunch regurgitation.😬

Mog
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Old 11th Apr 2021, 15:39
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BV - I must have done thousands of hours in the VC10 sims as an instructor - as did all the other QFIs! The offboard stuff was done by sim sqn personnel, who also looked after the safety aspects, but the button pushing etc. was down to anywhere between 1 and 3 training flight aircrew.

Mog's analysis was the effect to which I was referring!
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Old 11th Apr 2021, 15:45
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This is already being covered on the Future Carrier thread - see this video - the civilian contractor speaking is ex-RAF fast jet.

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Old 11th Apr 2021, 16:00
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BEagle

Whilst that may have been true a few years back things have moved on a little since then.

I speak from experience when I say that modern sims allow pretty complex missions to be run by one person. If they do require two then two qualified pilots are just as easy to find as one.

At home base itís a good idea to have contractors if theyíre available but when deployed I donít see the need.

I should point out I have no idea what or who will be available on a QE Carrier. My other concern about security clearance is not something I know about for certain either.

BV
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Old 11th Apr 2021, 16:47
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It would be a shame if operating the sims became too automated. There were hours of fun to be had driving a simulated Toyota Hilux round a simulated Helmand whilst the crew tried to position for a Brimstone attack, and then hiding the occupants in a ditch whilst they tried to find and strafe them.
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Old 11th Apr 2021, 17:29
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Originally Posted by Mogwi View Post
"Firstly Iím sure I remember hearing that specialist cradles had been procured to eliminate the motion of the ocean though I may be wrong."

'Twould require a massively complex arrangement to counter ship's heave, even if you could sort pitch and roll. I imagine random undemanded applications of +/- 1/2 G in the box would cause a certain amount of gyro-toppling and lunch regurgitation.😬

Mog
I believe the plan is to place the sims on the carrier elevator and run it up and down to cancel heave...and have the ship be in to wind at all times during sim runs to cancel out sideways translation (whatever ship mates call that...lol)
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Old 12th Apr 2021, 07:42
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As attractive as it might seem to have fellow aircrew run the sims, this could impinge on crew availability if your crews are on differing routines. Would the manning numbers take account of the extra burden on duty cycles?
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Old 12th Apr 2021, 08:16
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HEDP

I would suggest that the simulator is a much more integral part of life on the F35 than it ever was on legacy types. I wouldnít expect pilots to be flying all day every day and the simulator may actually take primacy at times.

Itís a brave new world. Iím not saying I love all elements of it but it is what it is.

BV
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Old 12th Apr 2021, 10:22
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BV, indeed. It might not be too much of a stretch to say that the traditional roles of sim and live flying are being reversed. Weapons practice is almost totally simulator-bound due to the expense and large safety traces of contemporary weapons. EW kit can't be meaningfully stimulated or transmit for real-world COMSEC reasons. Radars likewise. 5th gen aircraft can't rehearse LO tactics without giving away clues to their vulnerabilities. Datalinks can't be used to their wartime potential due to peacetime frequency band constraints. About the only thing that can be done without constraint in the aircraft is general handling for currency/safety purposes. Given that balance I'd expect F35 QWIs, EWIs and other supervisory pilots to be routinely operating the sim.
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Old 12th Apr 2021, 11:23
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Plenty of BAe Systems Simulator Instructor Pilots on the F35B at RAF Marham. I know a couple and one who left when he realised he was going to have to go sea!!

https://www.baesystems.com/en/career...structor-pilot
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Old 12th Apr 2021, 14:34
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So, does anyone know the answer to the original question? Are any BAe personnel going to sea? I would have thought they would need sim techs even if the pilots do their own instructing / operating. Maybe these devices are so reliable that they only need an on / off button.
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