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Using Rank on Retirement

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Using Rank on Retirement

Old 21st Jan 2021, 21:43
  #81 (permalink)  
 
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As a civvy, I find the use of 'Captain' by retried airline pilots - and I've come across a few of them who do - rather pretentious, say the least. I don't use 'Senior Member IEEE, except in commercial or technical situations where it is justified.
- just as a friend doesn't use his title of professor in areas in which he wans't a professor.
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Old 21st Jan 2021, 23:22
  #82 (permalink)  
 
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I don't believe that I have seen any mention of the fact, stemming from the events 1970s I imagine, that the general (pun intended) use of ranks, especially in a non Service context including personal correspondence, should be avoided. This, in addition to major (pun intended) reductions in the numbers of people who had served in uniform, whether voluntarily or otherwise, has presumably contributing both to much less use of ranks on retirement, and the civilian population's lack of understanding, or probably lack of interest, in ranks.

None of my civilian friends either knows or is interested in what rank I hold, and this has often led to innocent fun, such as a when a general as a fellow-guest on a yacht running out of Lymington offered to teach me how to tie a clove hitch, something I knew how to do when I was about eight. The "lesson" and my wide-eyed innocence were sadly abruptly ended when the owner clicked what was going on and grassed me up!

Jack
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Old 22nd Jan 2021, 07:54
  #83 (permalink)  
 
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I make the children use my title. They refer to me as Second Officer Bigbad. I donít ask the wife to use my title, unless we are in company , as that would be ridiculous.

I will certainly be using my title on retirement, especially if Iím able to get promoted to First Officer or Relief Captain.
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Old 22nd Jan 2021, 09:03
  #84 (permalink)  
 
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Surely the wife is First Officer Bigbad.
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Old 22nd Jan 2021, 10:09
  #85 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by BIGBAD View Post
.... especially if Iím able to get promoted to First Officer or Relief Captain.
Wow, they really do pamper them in first class!
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Old 22nd Jan 2021, 10:25
  #86 (permalink)  
 
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An old friend of mine, who had previously been an RAF pilot before retirement, took a job on the North Sea Oil Rigs. Whenever any of his colleagues wanted to get his attention they would simply shout "Oi, Aeroplane!" Seemed fair enough.
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Old 22nd Jan 2021, 10:26
  #87 (permalink)  
 
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Smile

Originally Posted by Richard Dangle View Post
Specaircrew...fixed yer post mate



As the Op...could not care less one way or the other. Other than banter and pension, my military life has very little connection to my civilian life. I did 27 wonderful years with so many awesome people (Specaircrew was one of them ). But when its over, its over. look forwards not back. On the other hand if some folk want to hang on to the rank, crack on.

I doubt trivia like this alters public perception one iota.
A perfectly acceptable edit old chap ;-) I didn't realise that you could edit the stuff in quotes so that's opened up a whole new line of lockdown amusement for me. I'm off to quote all those irritating 'virtue signallers' then change their text to what millennials call 'inappropriate' so that I can chastise them for their lack of political correctness ;-) Or shall I just go to the Pub with all the other Flt Lt (Retd) chaps ...........Oh Bugger!
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Old 22nd Jan 2021, 10:33
  #88 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by BIGBAD View Post
I make the children use my title. They refer to me as Second Officer Bigbad. I donít ask the wife to use my title, unless we are in company , as that would be ridiculous.

I will certainly be using my title on retirement, especially if Iím able to get promoted to First Officer or Relief Captain.
I do think that's rather overdoing it, old chap. I just told mine to call me Sir.
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Old 22nd Jan 2021, 11:04
  #89 (permalink)  

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It happened again this morning "Morning Colonel" "Morning Wing Commander". Since he was Army National Service, so probably a young squaddie, and I retired as a Flt Lt, the ranks used seem entirely appropriate!!
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Old 22nd Jan 2021, 11:33
  #90 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by spekesoftly View Post
An old friend of mine, who had previously been an RAF pilot before retirement, took a job on the North Sea Oil Rigs. Whenever any of his colleagues wanted to get his attention they would simply shout "Oi, Aeroplane!" Seemed fair enough.
I did a 2 week first aid instructor course at Halton, and was the only aircrew bloke there. All the rest were Rocks. As soon as they realised my job, it was, "Oi! Fat Wallet!" They were nuts, but great fun.

CG

PS. Foe me, always much more annoying than the 'rank cling-on' issue, is/was serving officers who introduce themselves with, "Hello, my name is Squadron Leader Bloggs." Still grates. Hey ho.
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Old 22nd Jan 2021, 12:02
  #91 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by charliegolf View Post
PS. Foe me, always much more annoying than the 'rank cling-on' issue, is/was serving officers who introduce themselves with, "Hello, my name is Squadron Leader Bloggs." Still grates. Hey ho.
I normally ask people like that if they want to be called 'Squadron' or 'Leader'.
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Old 22nd Jan 2021, 12:07
  #92 (permalink)  
 
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Strangely Consultant Surgeons cease to be called Dr and revert to Mr/Mrs/Miss/Ms etc.

Why are surgeons in the UK called Mr/Miss/Ms/Mrs, rather than Dr?

In most other parts of the world all medical practitioners, physicians and surgeons alike, are referred to as Dr while in the UK surgeons are usually referred to as Mr/Miss/Ms/Mrs. This is because, from the Middle Ages physicians had to embark on formal university training to gain possession of a degree in medicine before they could enter practice. The possession of this degree, a doctorate, entitled them to the title of ‘Doctor of Medicine’ or Doctor.

The training of surgeons until the mid-19th century was different. They did not have to go to university to gain a degree; instead they usually served as an apprentice to a surgeon. Afterwards they took an examination. In London, after 1745, this was conducted by the Surgeons' Company and after 1800 by The Royal College of Surgeons. If successful they were awarded a diploma, not a degree, therefore they were unable to call themselves 'Doctor', and stayed instead with the title 'Mr'.

Outside London and in the largest cities, the surgeon served as an apprentice like many other tradesmen, but did not necessarily take any examination. Today all medical practitioners, whether physicians or surgeons have to undertake training at medical school to obtain a qualifying degree. Thereafter a further period of postgraduate study and training through junior posts is required before full consultant surgeon status is achieved. Thus the tradition of a surgeon being referred to as Mr/Miss/Ms/Mrs has continued, meaning that in effect a person starts as Mr/Miss/Ms/Mrs, becomes a Dr and then goes back to being a Mr/Miss/Ms/Mrs again!
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Old 22nd Jan 2021, 12:24
  #93 (permalink)  
 
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Big Airways Captain

Having been refused a job bombing innocents my next career choice was to drive around not so innocents.
A couple of years after I got onto the Tridents we had our first Hamble blokes come through. Most having attended lesser public schools. A few insisted on the captain nonsense in the pub as well as telephone directory.
One trip the whole crew plus a local hostess girl friend of mine ended up in a Glasgow eating house when everyone used Christian names except the captain insisted that I used his rank or sir.
So in my best Essex vernacular I obliged but added his surname..Farqharson which I missed pronounced as Far - ke - harr -sun upon which he decided to give me elocution lessons.
I stopped after numerous failed attempts as the rest of the crew were struggling not to collapse into a fit of giggles.
Never flew with him again as his ego demanded he went onto the bigger and newer piece of kit.
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Old 22nd Jan 2021, 13:36
  #94 (permalink)  
 
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Thank heavens nobody referred to Mrs Bigbad as Section Officer...... 'twould drive Beagle into a frenzy!
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Old 22nd Jan 2021, 13:37
  #95 (permalink)  
 
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[QUOTE=dagenham;10973092]On the subject of doctors. The degree is five years, the first three or four ( canít remember now ) gains a BA or BSc medicine and the last year the MD I seem to remember

No. If itís a five year course, no BSc (or BA). If itís 6 years then maybe. MD is a post graduate degree awarded for original research. So most (medical) doctors are just plain MB, BS or similar (bachelor of medicine, surgery). Real doctors have a PhD 😁

As for surgeons being Mr, I always thought that was because they originally were barbers. Anyway, itís a ludicrous bit of inverted snobbery that causes much confusion. Unique, I believe, to the U.K.
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Old 22nd Jan 2021, 14:04
  #96 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by DON T View Post
Strangely Consultant Surgeons cease to be called Dr and revert to Mr/Mrs/Miss/Ms etc....
Fascinating! I did wonder how it worked as a Mr Edmondson had the dubious task of refurbishing my Main Re-circulation Pump fitting a plastic valve in and so on a couple of years ago. I was initially a bit concerned the NHS was using local plumbers, possibly with a background in comedy, brought in to ease the backlog or something. But, thru some basic research, seems he was "only" the Trusts Cardiac Clinical Director, their Chief of Surgery and the Chair of the Clinical Board overseeing 5 London Hospitals in all 3 roles!

In my consultation ahead of Surgery he said "Well, Mr H 'n' H, I can do your Op myself but I have 4 weeks work booked in and then have to take some Leave and so I'm away for a further 3 weeks of golf so I can arrange for a colleague to step in if you wish." to which my instant response was "Sir, you have a fabulous 3 weeks golf! I'll see you on the operating table when you get back if that's OK with you!". Natural respect comes to those like Mr E who was totally unassuming - only prior research revealed who he really was .... and showed he was well deserving of the informal title of "Sir" rather than "Mr" and well above "Dr"!

If I'd gone Private, I dare not think how much that would have cost me - as it was the whole NHS Team were brilliant. Oh, and it seemed he'd had a really great 3 weeks batting golf balls round various greens in some sunny, exotic climes!!! He was quite taken aback when that was the first (and about the only) question I asked him when we met up 8 weeks later! I figured that he'd done about 10,000 ops so it was just easier to say "Chop away!" and not worry about it. Still clicking happily away as I type this!

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Old 22nd Jan 2021, 14:10
  #97 (permalink)  
 
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After retiring from the RAF I went on to manage a department at a UK Airline, quite a lot of the guys around the HQ were ex RAF or Navy; Two of the Fleet Managers, some of the Safety Pilots, a lady in Flt Ops Project Management, the Safety Manager, even the Airline MD. All super, super people, all had been commissioned, some had been fairly senior, not one of them mentioned a rank.
My direct boss there had retired as a Sqn Ldr navigator on Tornadoes, but I only knew his leaving rank because I asked once out of interest, he wouldn't go on about it. The rest of the ex-forces people were nearly all RAF/RN pilots which I knew from the odd dit in the pub, although I have no idea what rank, they seemingly never needed to mention it. Which is as it should be, we were working for an airline then, we were no longer in the RAF or RN and we'd each gone off, retrained, reinvented, and come into a new career. I liked knowing they had a forces background but it wouldn't make a difference to the professional respect I had of them.

I think it's a little pitiful to try and maintain a rank once you're out. You're out, let it go, become the new you.
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Old 22nd Jan 2021, 14:28
  #98 (permalink)  
 
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There was an obit. in the papers a few years back about a local Councillor in I think it was Guildford - when he died they discovered he held the GC (possibly WW2 bomb disposal?) - he'd never mentioned it - I think his wife knew but "he never wanted a fuss - and he felt it was irrelevant to his job"
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Old 22nd Jan 2021, 14:38
  #99 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Asturias56 View Post
he held the GC (possibly WW2 bomb disposal?) - he'd never mentioned it - I think his wife knew but "he never wanted a fuss - and he felt it was irrelevant to his job"
Classy. If I had the GC, the ribbon would even be on my pyjamas!

CG
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Old 22nd Jan 2021, 14:47
  #100 (permalink)  
 
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Natural respect comes to those like Mr E who was totally unassuming - only prior research revealed who he really was .... and showed he was well deserving of the informal title of "Sir" rather than "Mr" and well above "Dr"!

Dear Hot Ďn High,

A curious thing to say. Prior research will usually reveal a lot of extraneous roles, but means nothing about skill. Professors of surgery are renowned for being totally handless. And Mr is definitely not above Dr.

BTW if itís the Mr E I knew, he was pretty good at squash.

To return to the point of the OP, surely we leave all these things behind on retirement? Next phase in life and all that. Past performance is no guide to future performance.

caramba
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