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Britain sends "strong" message to Russia

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Britain sends "strong" message to Russia

Old 23rd Dec 2018, 20:23
  #21 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by SASless View Post
Also stated as "lack of availability".

Can a Dry Dock be deployed to the Black Sea under the terms of the Treaty?
The Russians would likely put an offer in if you could deploy one!
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Old 24th Dec 2018, 07:08
  #22 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by SASless View Post
Can a Dry Dock be deployed to the Black Sea under the terms of the Treaty?
Yes it can as it is not a ‘vessel of war’.
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Old 24th Dec 2018, 08:20
  #23 (permalink)  
 
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It would be interesting to see what the response to Russia deploying a vessel of some description to theEnglish Channel or the Irish Sea for example.

The Russians seem to me to have been relatively reserved in their response to the continued provocation by NATO nations in recent times.

I spoke to a quite senior officer a couple of years ago as he took over the station I was serving at about his previous job. "Oh I've been at JFC dealing with the Russian threat" so I asked him did he not think that the Russian threat was overplayed? "No, they're being quite, err naughty."

I asked him him did he not think that NATO lying about its future intentions and expanding into the former Eastern European states and deploying jets and troops to Lithuania was a gross provocation?"

He didn't have an answer. I realised then that he was an idiot. He hadn't thought about what was going on and was just toeing the standard line. The UK seems quite happy to follow the US in policy in this regard.

I'm not saying that Russia is whiter than white. The recent poisonings are an example, however I wonder if we in the West have forced the issue by being so old fashioned in our thinking.
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Old 24th Dec 2018, 09:11
  #24 (permalink)  
 
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Standard drill in any armed forces anywhere at any time

You trail past the opposition to :-

a) see if they are awake

b) what they actually DO and how fast they do it

c) remind them you're alive

d) show your guys they're not Supermen

d) show your own politicians you are ready

same went for Nelson etc etc
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Old 24th Dec 2018, 10:52
  #25 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Marly Lite View Post
It would be interesting to see what the response to Russia deploying a vessel of some description to theEnglish Channel or the Irish Sea for example.

The Russian Navy regularly transits through the English Channel. Their specialised survey ship Yantar has in past years been hanging about in the North Sea off the East Coast (Lincolnshire). Apart from a shadowing Royal Navy escort nothing happens in response.

The Yantar and other vessels have also been off the East Coast of the US and Canada in recent years.

RFS Yantar, the Russian Navy’s oceanographic vessel – also referred to as spy ship, underwater reconnaissance ship or seabed research ship – was escorted by several NATO ships as it transited the English Channel into the North Sea.
https://navaltoday.com/2018/06/04/na...glish-channel/

The Yantar is a new-build and highly specialised.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-42543712

https://freebeacon.com/national-secu...bmarine-areas/


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Old 24th Dec 2018, 12:31
  #26 (permalink)  
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In exercises took part 17 tanks, included modern Abrams, Leopard-2, Challenger-2...
Now call me an old badger, but when I was doing post met brief AFV recognition slides in 1642, all of those tanks were part of the set. They may well have been "modernized", but they are anything but "modern".
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Old 24th Dec 2018, 13:09
  #27 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Marly Lite View Post
It would be interesting to see what the response to Russia deploying a vessel of some description to the English Channel or the Irish Sea for example.

The Russians seem to me to have been relatively reserved in their response to the continued provocation by NATO nations in recent times...
I find it interesting that you’re implying that the Black Sea is a Russian lake whereas half of it is bounded by three NATO nations, namely Bulgaria, Romania and Turkey. That’s more than Russia borders.


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Old 24th Dec 2018, 13:45
  #28 (permalink)  
 
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Red face

Originally Posted by eckhard View Post


Another Point of Order: it’s “its”, not “it’s”!
Two out of three ain't bad ?
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Old 24th Dec 2018, 14:49
  #29 (permalink)  
 
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NATO and US ships are for decades exercising in the Black Sea. And these are not "paramilitary" boats, sometimes cruisers and destroyers. I have not heard that Russia was overconcerned until anybody was going to enter its territorial waters.
Even this well-known incident https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1988_B...mping_incident was not considered as a "casus belli" at all. It was understood that it just was check of the quality of iron that seamen balls were made of :-)
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Old 24th Dec 2018, 15:54
  #30 (permalink)  
 
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FODPlod,

They were Warsaw Pact countries a few years ago. The US and the UK gave assurances that, upon reunification of Germany, there would be no eastwards expansion of NATO. They reneged upon this unwritten agreement.

My point is that we are provoking/probing the Russians. They then react to this in other or similar ways. Its all a bit childish.
I am no appeaser, but I do wonder if we should relax a bit about Russian intentions. If we had stuck by our word we may have had better relations with Russia.
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Old 24th Dec 2018, 20:22
  #31 (permalink)  
 
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We had a better relationship with Russia, it is not the West's doing that the ex-Warsaw Pact countries decided that they were better off casting in their lot with democracy and capitalism rather than the Russian version of Utopia. Now the problem is amplified because politicians and the media are single tracked on events in Crimea and Ukraine for good reason.

Think which other countries in Europe have local regions of predominantly Russian residents. So where will the next masked, armed and unidentified "advisors" appear to "help" the poor, downtrodden, Russian residents reacquire their "right to independence". It's not rocket science is it? Political posturing is one thing, invading the territory of an independent country is a whole new "mess o' beans". Trust needs to work both ways.

IG
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Old 24th Dec 2018, 20:43
  #32 (permalink)  
 
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What a minute....the Media and other Lefties have been crucifying President Trump for any kind of contact with Putin....He (Putin) is supposed to be isolated and not talked with last time I checked.

Which is it....better relations or isolation of the Russians while Putin is running the show?
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Old 25th Dec 2018, 08:32
  #33 (permalink)  
 
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Botth - much as you dislike someone if they have N -weapons you HAVE to talk to them - see The Fat Boy, India/Pakistan etc
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