European Army
Interesting that this moribund thread has been dead for well over a year while Europe has faced a real war on its continent. PESCO is yet another indication that the EU offers nothing for its own security, never mind that of Europe. NATO is the guarantor of European defence, it always has been since its inception, despite EU sullenness, despite US isolationists. It's not that NATO needs the Russian bear, it's the Russian bear that creates the need for NATO. I don't see any change to that any time soon, no matter what happens in the Ukraine or the wider world. Time for the EU to confront its own prejudices and support NATO to the hilt.
Well, there are Federal Unions and Federal Unions, of course. I'm sure that you are right. The EU will try to become one, just like the USA. The difference is that the latter was essentially formed of immigrants who turned their backs on whence they came as well as on the indigenous population that they came to. As Territories became States that in turn joined the Union (ack 'Oklahoma') they created a Nation that could out produce all others. The EU has done none of that and never will. Herding cats comes more to mind. It is a political creation run by a Commission that has more in common with the Politburo than a Democratic Parliament. Left to its own devices the EU will collapse under its own squabbling contradictions and in doing so invite in Europe's enemies. The Europeans, as ever, need protection from themselves. The USA, as ever, will fulfil that need through NATO and, as ever, be resented for doing so. The alternative is Armagedón.
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"As Territories became States that in turn joined the Union (ack 'Oklahoma') "
To be pedantic they started out with 13 States that then joined together to form the USA.
Mr Lincoln made it a club you can't leave.
Territories such as Kansas, OK, Alaska etc were administered by the US Govt until such times as they petitioned to become States - they were already in , they just took a measure of control and responsibility from the Feds
To be pedantic they started out with 13 States that then joined together to form the USA.
Mr Lincoln made it a club you can't leave.
Territories such as Kansas, OK, Alaska etc were administered by the US Govt until such times as they petitioned to become States - they were already in , they just took a measure of control and responsibility from the Feds
"As Territories became States that in turn joined the Union (ack 'Oklahoma') "
To be pedantic they started out with 13 States that then joined together to form the USA.
Mr Lincoln made it a club you can't leave.
Territories such as Kansas, OK, Alaska etc were administered by the US Govt until such times as they petitioned to become States - they were already in , they just took a measure of control and responsibility from the Feds
To be pedantic they started out with 13 States that then joined together to form the USA.
Mr Lincoln made it a club you can't leave.
Territories such as Kansas, OK, Alaska etc were administered by the US Govt until such times as they petitioned to become States - they were already in , they just took a measure of control and responsibility from the Feds
That a Federal Union equates to checking out of Hotel California is accepted absolutely and should be noted now by all EU members, just as it was by the UK.
Well, there are Federal Unions and Federal Unions, of course. I'm sure that you are right. The EU will try to become one, just like the USA. The difference is that the latter was essentially formed of immigrants who turned their backs on whence they came as well as on the indigenous population that they came to. As Territories became States that in turn joined the Union (ack 'Oklahoma') they created a Nation that could out produce all others. The EU has done none of that and never will. Herding cats comes more to mind. It is a political creation run by a Commission that has more in common with the Politburo than a Democratic Parliament. Left to its own devices the EU will collapse under its own squabbling contradictions and in doing so invite in Europe's enemies. The Europeans, as ever, need protection from themselves. The USA, as ever, will fulfil that need through NATO and, as ever, be resented for doing so. The alternative is Armagedón.
I always liked the fact that the State of Oklahoma quickly adopted the R&H song as the State Song - goes with a real whizzz!!!
If they 'd gone to a committee they'd have finished up with something colourless, worthy and boring (see Oh Canada, Advance Australia and similar).
No one would have written "they say we belong to the land , and the land we belong to is grand!" with added Whoops.
If they 'd gone to a committee they'd have finished up with something colourless, worthy and boring (see Oh Canada, Advance Australia and similar).
No one would have written "they say we belong to the land , and the land we belong to is grand!" with added Whoops.
I always liked the fact that the State of Oklahoma quickly adopted the R&H song as the State Song - goes with a real whizzz!!!
If they 'd gone to a committee they'd have finished up with something colourless, worthy and boring (see Oh Canada, Advance Australia and similar).
No one would have written "they say we belong to the land , and the land we belong to is grand!" with added Whoops.
If they 'd gone to a committee they'd have finished up with something colourless, worthy and boring (see Oh Canada, Advance Australia and similar).
No one would have written "they say we belong to the land , and the land we belong to is grand!" with added Whoops.
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... in other words (forgive me) you cannot create a powerful state by agreement - it's only war and force that work. Ok, those are not your words but that's the practical meaning. The USA only exists as it does because of conquering Mexico and defeating the Confederates. China, Russia, India - all big because of conquest. So a situation where it happens by agreement, which you seem to want to compare to the Soviet Union (another creation of force) ..... is apparently impossible. So much for mankind .....
"thank heavens for the lingua franca"
Ah yes - an English phrase using Portuguese to describe a common language as French .....................
Wasn't it Bill Bryson who observed that "English is a language that lurks in dark alleyways and mugs other languages for items of value"?
Ah yes - an English phrase using Portuguese to describe a common language as French .....................
Wasn't it Bill Bryson who observed that "English is a language that lurks in dark alleyways and mugs other languages for items of value"?
Tabs please !
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
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https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-ne...e-5000-troops/
EU plan to create commando unit for new rapid reaction force
The European Union could have its own special forces commandos under controversial plans for a rapid reaction force of 5,000 troops, The Telegraph can disclose…..
Its formation could allow the EU to “respond decisively and prevent and manage crises in order to assert itself as a more credible security and defence actor”, according to a report by EU officials and MEPs.….
The joint military force could be deployable without the unanimous support of the EU’s 27 member states in order to prevent it becoming snarled up in political wrangling….
According to the latest official report, the “European Union Rapid Deployment Capacity”, known as the EU RDC, would have a minimum of at least 5,000 troops.
This excludes the special operations forces, intelligence operatives, medical care and evacuation units, as well as air and sealift personnel that would come as extra to ensure that the “EU RDC is prepared to address all possible crisis situations”.….
The scheme is supported by France and Germany on the basis of a “coalition of willing”, as long as no EU governments object, and is also supported by Italy and Spain, who back an even larger formation of up to 50,000 troops…
EU plan to create commando unit for new rapid reaction force
The European Union could have its own special forces commandos under controversial plans for a rapid reaction force of 5,000 troops, The Telegraph can disclose…..
Its formation could allow the EU to “respond decisively and prevent and manage crises in order to assert itself as a more credible security and defence actor”, according to a report by EU officials and MEPs.….
The joint military force could be deployable without the unanimous support of the EU’s 27 member states in order to prevent it becoming snarled up in political wrangling….
According to the latest official report, the “European Union Rapid Deployment Capacity”, known as the EU RDC, would have a minimum of at least 5,000 troops.
This excludes the special operations forces, intelligence operatives, medical care and evacuation units, as well as air and sealift personnel that would come as extra to ensure that the “EU RDC is prepared to address all possible crisis situations”.….
The scheme is supported by France and Germany on the basis of a “coalition of willing”, as long as no EU governments object, and is also supported by Italy and Spain, who back an even larger formation of up to 50,000 troops…
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-ne...e-5000-troops/
EU plan to create commando unit for new rapid reaction force
The European Union could have its own special forces commandos under controversial plans for a rapid reaction force of 5,000 troops, The Telegraph can disclose…..
Its formation could allow the EU to “respond decisively and prevent and manage crises in order to assert itself as a more credible security and defence actor”, according to a report by EU officials and MEPs.….
The joint military force could be deployable without the unanimous support of the EU’s 27 member states in order to prevent it becoming snarled up in political wrangling….
According to the latest official report, the “European Union Rapid Deployment Capacity”, known as the EU RDC, would have a minimum of at least 5,000 troops.
This excludes the special operations forces, intelligence operatives, medical care and evacuation units, as well as air and sealift personnel that would come as extra to ensure that the “EU RDC is prepared to address all possible crisis situations”.….
The scheme is supported by France and Germany on the basis of a “coalition of willing”, as long as no EU governments object, and is also supported by Italy and Spain, who back an even larger formation of up to 50,000 troops…
EU plan to create commando unit for new rapid reaction force
The European Union could have its own special forces commandos under controversial plans for a rapid reaction force of 5,000 troops, The Telegraph can disclose…..
Its formation could allow the EU to “respond decisively and prevent and manage crises in order to assert itself as a more credible security and defence actor”, according to a report by EU officials and MEPs.….
The joint military force could be deployable without the unanimous support of the EU’s 27 member states in order to prevent it becoming snarled up in political wrangling….
According to the latest official report, the “European Union Rapid Deployment Capacity”, known as the EU RDC, would have a minimum of at least 5,000 troops.
This excludes the special operations forces, intelligence operatives, medical care and evacuation units, as well as air and sealift personnel that would come as extra to ensure that the “EU RDC is prepared to address all possible crisis situations”.….
The scheme is supported by France and Germany on the basis of a “coalition of willing”, as long as no EU governments object, and is also supported by Italy and Spain, who back an even larger formation of up to 50,000 troops…
FB
As long as no EU governments object (to its creation is how I read it)? Earlier it says they could deploy without the unanimous support of the 27 EU member states, (to its deployment of course)? So if any object to its creation, can they be brushed aside, the same as if they objected to its deployments? Or if they have accepted its creation in the first place, then started objecting to any or some deployments? And once again, where does NATO fit into this wannabe scheme? Just a few questions regarding another wasteful EU adventure to become a single super state!
FB
FB
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Or to put it another why, why we readily accept certain arbitrary boundaries like the UK and reject others like England or say Cornwall (it sticks out a bit after all) or the seven Saxon Kingdoms
Not that I want to hijack the thread mind
Having been born in the UK and lived just a little over half my life in the US, I still can't see what's so bad about the possibility of the EU becoming a "single super state"
Or to put it another why, why we readily accept certain arbitrary boundaries like the UK and reject others like England or say Cornwall (it sticks out a bit after all) or the seven Saxon Kingdoms
Not that I want to hijack the thread mind
Or to put it another why, why we readily accept certain arbitrary boundaries like the UK and reject others like England or say Cornwall (it sticks out a bit after all) or the seven Saxon Kingdoms
Not that I want to hijack the thread mind
NOT
SV has a point - but my take is that most nation states congealed about people speaking the same language - even Germany eventually. Countries with significant minorities speaking a different language have always been under more strain - the Austro-Hungarian Empire, USSR, China, the Ottoman Empire.
SV has a point - but my take is that most nation states congealed about people speaking the same language - even Germany eventually. Countries with significant minorities speaking a different language have always been under more strain - the Austro-Hungarian Empire, USSR, China, the Ottoman Empire.
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The UK has more than one language - it's just that the people who speak only that language are able to ignore the others. The US has Spanish now - which you can ignore if you want to but it's important. You can imagine that English might have been that language for the EU until we muffed it. Now whatever way it develops into a greater power it won't be with much influence from us.
FB