RAF Regiment
Leon
I've had a long hard think about our opposing views and this 'light-bulb' moment came to me.
To SAY one prefers men only Rockapes is not an offence, it is an opinion. For the CAS or AOC RAF Regiment to say that no way will they have ladies in the Regiment is an offence.
Similarly, I am opposed to gay marriage for several reasons; it is not an offence for the many in public life who have also expressed that view, BUT if I ran a B&B or similar business and refused admittance to a gay couple, then I would be guilty of discrimination.
I always hold a door open for a lady, not always for men, does that make me a misogynist? For most of us poor old men who are not comfortable with exposing the 'nurturing' sex to front-line danger it is not because we think they are not up to the job, it is because evolution has hard-wired us into this protector role.
As an ex-nav I have seen many jibes made by the '2 winged Master Race' directed against us, the worse being 'the smell of pee from the back seat'; do I complain, NO, because I was born with a sense of humour, although the 'joke' I have mentioned is not funny at all.
As for your moniker - how about using your actual name? Here's mine again.
Brian Wildey
To SAY one prefers men only Rockapes is not an offence, it is an opinion. For the CAS or AOC RAF Regiment to say that no way will they have ladies in the Regiment is an offence.
Similarly, I am opposed to gay marriage for several reasons; it is not an offence for the many in public life who have also expressed that view, BUT if I ran a B&B or similar business and refused admittance to a gay couple, then I would be guilty of discrimination.
I always hold a door open for a lady, not always for men, does that make me a misogynist? For most of us poor old men who are not comfortable with exposing the 'nurturing' sex to front-line danger it is not because we think they are not up to the job, it is because evolution has hard-wired us into this protector role.
As an ex-nav I have seen many jibes made by the '2 winged Master Race' directed against us, the worse being 'the smell of pee from the back seat'; do I complain, NO, because I was born with a sense of humour, although the 'joke' I have mentioned is not funny at all.
As for your moniker - how about using your actual name? Here's mine again.
Brian Wildey
Last edited by Brian 48nav; 17th Jul 2017 at 07:34. Reason: Addition
There are some very valid arguments on both sides, but lets get things in perspective - when was the last time the RAF Regiment were involved in a bayonet charge?
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Its not really bayonet charges that concern me.
Its loads of people with life changing none combat injury's who are dumped out of the services broken to fend for themselves.
If the Mil breaks them due to PC policy changes/lack of people wanting to join up they should pay for what they break.
Personally I think its going to cost a fortune in damage claims but we shall see.
Its loads of people with life changing none combat injury's who are dumped out of the services broken to fend for themselves.
If the Mil breaks them due to PC policy changes/lack of people wanting to join up they should pay for what they break.
Personally I think its going to cost a fortune in damage claims but we shall see.
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Wrathmonk (#87),
1994, I believe. I speak of the late '60s
No special experience of them. They were universally admired for their courage.
None at all on gender grounds AFAIK - and they were all volunteers, of course.
Danny.
...Think that went out when WRAF were "amalgamated" into the RAF...
...From your experience how were female SOE operatives thought of during WW2? ...
...Were there any 'second thoughts' at the time about using females in such role?...
Danny.
minigundiplomat - You might as well ask when was the last time an RAF Typhoon shot down an enemy aircraft? However we still work on the assumption that pilots, male or female may have to do that. Whether or not you are comfortable with the idea of females using the bayonet in combat, you have to work on the assumption that they may have to.
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Ref the RAF and bayonets.
I'm in the RAF, but not in the RAF Regiment. In early 2012 on ops in the Upper Gereshk Valley in Afghanistan I dismounted from a Warrior AFV along with the rest of my patrol and fixed bayonet. A bit of a moment, to say the least and unique in my service career. I'm not telling the story to say "look at me, I'm great!" but to illustrate the fact that it does still happen and not always by whom you might expect. Thankfully, another callsign did the necessary by other means just as we commenced our tab in.
I'm in the RAF, but not in the RAF Regiment. In early 2012 on ops in the Upper Gereshk Valley in Afghanistan I dismounted from a Warrior AFV along with the rest of my patrol and fixed bayonet. A bit of a moment, to say the least and unique in my service career. I'm not telling the story to say "look at me, I'm great!" but to illustrate the fact that it does still happen and not always by whom you might expect. Thankfully, another callsign did the necessary by other means just as we commenced our tab in.
Last edited by Mahogany_Bomber; 17th Jul 2017 at 10:35. Reason: Improve my written England.
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BEagle (#100),
The heart of the matter. Pay your Forces properly, give them decent accommodation, look after their families, and you won't have a recruiting crisis.
Danny.
...The purpose of removing the gender barrier in the RAF Regiment is simply an attempt to mitigate the overall recruiting crisis...
Danny.
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Brian 48nav (#101),
Exactly ! I'm with you 100% !
Danny.
...For most of us poor old men who are not comfortable with exposing the 'nurturing' sex to front-line danger it is not because we think they are not up to the job, it is because evolution has hard-wired us into this protector role...
Danny.
Yes but when push comes to shove can a woman in a trench put a rifle bayonet in some crying conscripts guts and twist it ?
These women are clearly out of their depth and should be nurturing children at home...
Female front line 360 -
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-40612479
Female front line 360 -
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-40612479
This 70 year old 'has been' has just returned from a 55 mile solo cycle ride ( please don't clap too loudly! ) during which I pondered my next message to LJ.
I'm sorry Melmothtw, but i am not just going for the man I am going for his jugular.
Leon - your moniker is the most offensive I have seen on here in my time as a PPruner and can be interpreted only one way - that you are the worst kind of misogynist. I guess you must have been 10 years old when you chose that! Does six figure salary wife know that is the name you use?
I am amazed that the mods let that one through - or maybe in their innocence like me they saw a Polish sounding name and thought you must be descended from one of the WW2 heroes who fought with the RAF.
The first thing you can do now is make an apology to all those you have attacked here, but particularly Danny42C and then, because I and no doubt others find it difficult to believe that you are an officer and gentleman, reveal your identity and proof that you are not a troll! I'm thinking all this talk about flying in fast jets and helicopters with female pilots is all bullsh*t.
If you aren't prepared to do so, I hope that someone who knows you may 'Out' you. When you choose a new moniker I suggest 'six figure salary wife's lapdog'. Better still I think you should be banned.
If I have upset others here with this post then you know who to blame, and it is not me!
I'm sorry Melmothtw, but i am not just going for the man I am going for his jugular.
Leon - your moniker is the most offensive I have seen on here in my time as a PPruner and can be interpreted only one way - that you are the worst kind of misogynist. I guess you must have been 10 years old when you chose that! Does six figure salary wife know that is the name you use?
I am amazed that the mods let that one through - or maybe in their innocence like me they saw a Polish sounding name and thought you must be descended from one of the WW2 heroes who fought with the RAF.
The first thing you can do now is make an apology to all those you have attacked here, but particularly Danny42C and then, because I and no doubt others find it difficult to believe that you are an officer and gentleman, reveal your identity and proof that you are not a troll! I'm thinking all this talk about flying in fast jets and helicopters with female pilots is all bullsh*t.
If you aren't prepared to do so, I hope that someone who knows you may 'Out' you. When you choose a new moniker I suggest 'six figure salary wife's lapdog'. Better still I think you should be banned.
If I have upset others here with this post then you know who to blame, and it is not me!
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For the purpose of the wider discussion and without rancour, can we not simply accept the view (but not necessarily agree with it ) that some forum members believe that the RAF Regiment and other military units whose primary role is to close with and kill the enemy should retain gender as a selection criterion? And vice versa.
I'm genuinely interested in what other types of occupation or parts of life in general would proponents of the status quo consider gender inclusion/exclusion to be acceptable? How have their views been formed? Personal experience? Cultural norms? Gender stereotyping or honestly held belief that some jobs/aspects of life are better done by one gender or another?
Any links to peer reviewed research on the topic gratefully received as I seek to expand my knowledge beyond my own limited personal experience. Hopefully my username and quotes from previous posts won't be used in evidence against me! My apologies for not previously using my real name on the internet, I realise that it would only be seen by 2 billion of my closest friends. Time to go public with my real name (this feels very liberating), my parents actually named me Bamboo Bomber but I never really liked and so changed it as soon as I left home to join up. There, said it.
I'm genuinely interested in what other types of occupation or parts of life in general would proponents of the status quo consider gender inclusion/exclusion to be acceptable? How have their views been formed? Personal experience? Cultural norms? Gender stereotyping or honestly held belief that some jobs/aspects of life are better done by one gender or another?
Any links to peer reviewed research on the topic gratefully received as I seek to expand my knowledge beyond my own limited personal experience. Hopefully my username and quotes from previous posts won't be used in evidence against me! My apologies for not previously using my real name on the internet, I realise that it would only be seen by 2 billion of my closest friends. Time to go public with my real name (this feels very liberating), my parents actually named me Bamboo Bomber but I never really liked and so changed it as soon as I left home to join up. There, said it.
None at all on gender grounds AFAIK - and they were all volunteers, of course.
And all those females wishing to join the RAF Regiment will be the same - volunteers. Nobody is forcing them to join. And those that do will, I'm sure, do an equally fine job or be shown the door. And why shouldn't they be given the chance to do what they want to do?
Off topic, but this has to be one of the most unintentionally funny threads outside of Jet Blast for ages - only normally see such internet meltdowns on t'other (Army) site. And, of course, on sci-fi forums since it was announced the next Doctor Who was going to be a ....... woman. Shock horror.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Wow how bitter this thread.
My daughter in the RAuxRAF Regt was initially trained in all arms. When they later tried to restrict her to radios she rebelled.
On one occasion, having broken her ankle during the week, she had it strapped up so she could exercise on the Warcop ranges.
On exercise in the States she was section leader of a combined RAF/NG section.
When she found they actually paid her she was delighted. When she got her tax free bounty she could not believe it.
Yes, if they want to join, let them provided they meet the qualifying criteria
My daughter in the RAuxRAF Regt was initially trained in all arms. When they later tried to restrict her to radios she rebelled.
On one occasion, having broken her ankle during the week, she had it strapped up so she could exercise on the Warcop ranges.
On exercise in the States she was section leader of a combined RAF/NG section.
When she found they actually paid her she was delighted. When she got her tax free bounty she could not believe it.
Yes, if they want to join, let them provided they meet the qualifying criteria
