226OCU/RAF Lossiemouth 1978
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226OCU/RAF Lossiemouth 1978
Fellow Prunners,
I am trying to find the name of the Ecuadorian pilot who was killed on 1 November 1978 when his Jaguar crashed near Selkirk. Plenty of records refer to his nationality - none to his name. The Forms 540/541 for both station and OCU are, apparently, not in the National Archives and are in 'limbo' with the 'reviewers' before being deposited.
Any long memoried prunner who can help gets a free copy of a book tracing RAF aircraft accidents since 1954 to date (2600 serious prangs) and including Roll of Honour (2000 names). {hope this isn't classed as an overt ad - but if so, mia culpa, and apologies all round}
It's the last name I need so please dig deep into the memory buds!!
Old Duffer
I am trying to find the name of the Ecuadorian pilot who was killed on 1 November 1978 when his Jaguar crashed near Selkirk. Plenty of records refer to his nationality - none to his name. The Forms 540/541 for both station and OCU are, apparently, not in the National Archives and are in 'limbo' with the 'reviewers' before being deposited.
Any long memoried prunner who can help gets a free copy of a book tracing RAF aircraft accidents since 1954 to date (2600 serious prangs) and including Roll of Honour (2000 names). {hope this isn't classed as an overt ad - but if so, mia culpa, and apologies all round}
It's the last name I need so please dig deep into the memory buds!!
Old Duffer
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226 OCU / RAF Lossiemouth 1978
Not really much help when it comes to the name of the pilot, but the IFS booklet covering the Jaguars' tenth anniversary states:
1 November 1978: Jaguar GR.1 XX759
An OCU student was flying on a low level navigation sortie, with an instructor acting as chase pilot in a second aircraft. Some 30 mins after take off, the pair encountered deteriorating weather conditions and the student called that he was pulling up. The chase pilot saw XX759 disappear into cloud in a gentle climb but with no sign of the reheat having being lit. The chase pilot remained at low level and told the student to call "VMC on top"; this instruction was acknowledged by the student. Approximately 20 secs later, the chase pilot saw in his left-hand mirror the plan view of XX759 in a near vertical dive before it crashed into the hillside some 300 metres from his position. The aircraft appeared intact prior to the impact and there was no signs of fire. The student did not eject and was killed when his aircraft hit the ground. The Board was unable to determine why the student had lost control of the aircraft, but speculated that he might have been subject to distraction or disorientation, or a combination of both.
1 November 1978: Jaguar GR.1 XX759
An OCU student was flying on a low level navigation sortie, with an instructor acting as chase pilot in a second aircraft. Some 30 mins after take off, the pair encountered deteriorating weather conditions and the student called that he was pulling up. The chase pilot saw XX759 disappear into cloud in a gentle climb but with no sign of the reheat having being lit. The chase pilot remained at low level and told the student to call "VMC on top"; this instruction was acknowledged by the student. Approximately 20 secs later, the chase pilot saw in his left-hand mirror the plan view of XX759 in a near vertical dive before it crashed into the hillside some 300 metres from his position. The aircraft appeared intact prior to the impact and there was no signs of fire. The student did not eject and was killed when his aircraft hit the ground. The Board was unable to determine why the student had lost control of the aircraft, but speculated that he might have been subject to distraction or disorientation, or a combination of both.
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I thought I'd be able to help as "The Cats Bow Out" has a Jaguar Force roll of honour with names and dates. Except..........there's no entry for that date and certainly no Ecuadorian's in the list.
Sorry!
Sorry!
Last edited by gareth herts; 26th Oct 2009 at 13:23.
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And there never was going to be entries for the foriegn students in what was the roll of honour for RAF personnel. I compile the list for that publication, in haste and limited time. I used Target lock as a source document and verified names from PPruNe and other sources until I had a complete list of RAF personnel. I did confim these names with the AHB through a contact I had. Didn't have the time to check out that particular accident. AHB would have the details from 226 OCU's F540. Try them IMHO.
I do know that all the OCU course photos, with names were saved and were with No 6 Sqn when it was canned at Coningsby. I know they were put somewhere for safekeeping.. Will do some digging via contacts.
I do know that all the OCU course photos, with names were saved and were with No 6 Sqn when it was canned at Coningsby. I know they were put somewhere for safekeeping.. Will do some digging via contacts.
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Hi Old-Duffer,
I was a QFI on RFS (Refresher Flying Sqn) at Leeming from '77 to '79 and remember 2 Ecuadorian Officers who came through us prior to the Jag OCU at Lossie. The timeframe sounds about right. One (my stude) was named Lieutenant Aguirre and the other, IIRC, was named Captain Moscoso. They were both fine ambassadors for their country, as well as being good eggs. They surprised us by saying that their air force planned to operate their Jags from Guayaquil airfield, which is some 10000ft AMSL - would have been interesting, to say the least! Sad to hear of this accident, but hopefully my info will go a little way to clearing things up.
I was a QFI on RFS (Refresher Flying Sqn) at Leeming from '77 to '79 and remember 2 Ecuadorian Officers who came through us prior to the Jag OCU at Lossie. The timeframe sounds about right. One (my stude) was named Lieutenant Aguirre and the other, IIRC, was named Captain Moscoso. They were both fine ambassadors for their country, as well as being good eggs. They surprised us by saying that their air force planned to operate their Jags from Guayaquil airfield, which is some 10000ft AMSL - would have been interesting, to say the least! Sad to hear of this accident, but hopefully my info will go a little way to clearing things up.
Thread Starter
Eucadorian Name Resolved
Many thanks 27mm. I put the names into a website called "Scotlandspeople" and got back Cesar Raul Aguirre age 27, whose death was registered in Elgan in November 1978, so it looks like it was your student.
The book offer is available should you want it (it's with the producer at present and won't be available until the year's end).
The book offer is available should you want it (it's with the producer at present and won't be available until the year's end).
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Hi there, long time lurker here, I was 8 years old at the time and my dad was on 8 sqn at the time, (Sqn Ldr George Parker) They had the married quarter four or five doors up from us in North Covesea Terrace. If I recall correctly he had a young wife that was either pregnant or with a very young child at the time and she did not speak English. We actually had them around for supper as they attended the RC Church at Lossie at the time - chaplain was Fr Tony Harris. It was very sad and not a good time at Lossie for the Jaguar force. My brother may also recall (Poison - ex 111, 43 et al)
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Living about 12 miles from Bowhill I decided to go and visit the memorial stone. It isn't easy to find, but with help from the Estate staff I located it. I had planned to go tommorow, but the weather isn't looking good, so went today. I think some of the estate staff are going up on Monday, and they offered to show me the way, but I couldn't make Monday. The memorial is a bit isolated, but I got the impression it isn't forgotten.
Danny
Danny
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Name of pilot.
Hello I know the pilot becouse he is my family.
He was from Imbabura pimampiro Ecuador and was an pilot of the air force of Ecuador.
His Family knows a litle part of his death.
The goberment dont explain details of his death.
Iam sure that his family don't known of his memorial if you can sent a picture or photo of his memorial.
my mail is [email protected].
please write to my email for more details of the pilot he is my cousin.
tanks
Javier
He was from Imbabura pimampiro Ecuador and was an pilot of the air force of Ecuador.
His Family knows a litle part of his death.
The goberment dont explain details of his death.
Iam sure that his family don't known of his memorial if you can sent a picture or photo of his memorial.
my mail is [email protected].
please write to my email for more details of the pilot he is my cousin.
tanks
Javier
Thread Starter
Identity of Ecuadorian Pilot
Thank you for the two recent posts.
I was able to obtain the pilot's name from an RAF pilot who knew him and I have included it in a book I was compiling.
The photographs of the memorial have now been moved because of their age on the system. If you send a private message to Dan Gerous, he will be able to send these direct to your email address.
Old Duffer
I was able to obtain the pilot's name from an RAF pilot who knew him and I have included it in a book I was compiling.
The photographs of the memorial have now been moved because of their age on the system. If you send a private message to Dan Gerous, he will be able to send these direct to your email address.
Old Duffer
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The complete name of the pilot is: Cesar Raul Aguirre Reyes, he born in Ecuador, Province of Imbabura a small city called Pimampiro. He was of the 25th promotion you see the list of members of this in the page:
Escuela Superior Militar de Aviación Cosme Rennella B. - Promociones ESMA
Escuela Superior Militar de Aviación Cosme Rennella B. - Promociones ESMA
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Hello I Am Family Of The Ecuadorian Pilot Who Dead In The Jaguar Crashed.
SORRY FOR MY ENGLISH, I need is posible you send me the photo of the memorial of the Ecuadorian Pilot of the name is Cesar Raul Aguirre Reyes.
He is my father's cousin and the family have poor information of his death occured in november 1th of 1978.
please sent me the photo if you have in your files.
my e mail is j d e s p i n o s a @ h o t m a i l . c o m
Other notice Ecuador retire the jaguar from his air force.
He is my father's cousin and the family have poor information of his death occured in november 1th of 1978.
please sent me the photo if you have in your files.
my e mail is j d e s p i n o s a @ h o t m a i l . c o m
Other notice Ecuador retire the jaguar from his air force.
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I've got your email, and will sort out the pics for you. They are on an external hard drive in amongst all my other pics, so it may take a couple of days for me to find them and post them on to you.
Danny
Danny
Danny,
I was in Melrose at the time of the crash and headed straight up to Bowhill.
Usual scene, but reports later proved unfounded, talked of a 'chute on the other side of the hill. Vis not great but ok.
Was not aware of the memorial but must check next visit.
Pailmerk overseas !
Lo siento por su perdido Sr. Espinosa
I was in Melrose at the time of the crash and headed straight up to Bowhill.
Usual scene, but reports later proved unfounded, talked of a 'chute on the other side of the hill. Vis not great but ok.
Was not aware of the memorial but must check next visit.
Pailmerk overseas !
Lo siento por su perdido Sr. Espinosa
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Hi everyone.
I lived on Bowhill Estate from 1972 until very recently. I still recall this terrible accident. I was 11 yrs old. The location of the accident was just over 1 mile from our house. Not long after the accident, i visited the site a handful of times, last being approx 1986 when i personally went to the locus. I have passed the site many, many times over the years but not went up into the woods off the dirt track which is approx 150 yrs below the crash site. I have recently took a deeper interest into this accident and have carried out some research, although all details i have found are readily available on the internet.
Today, 28/7/12 i took a walk back up. Memories came flooding back of 1978.
My thoughts are with Cesar's family.
I lived on Bowhill Estate from 1972 until very recently. I still recall this terrible accident. I was 11 yrs old. The location of the accident was just over 1 mile from our house. Not long after the accident, i visited the site a handful of times, last being approx 1986 when i personally went to the locus. I have passed the site many, many times over the years but not went up into the woods off the dirt track which is approx 150 yrs below the crash site. I have recently took a deeper interest into this accident and have carried out some research, although all details i have found are readily available on the internet.
Today, 28/7/12 i took a walk back up. Memories came flooding back of 1978.
My thoughts are with Cesar's family.