Fighter Pilot Longevity ?
LJ: I'm sorry to hear of your losses.
Back to the original question: I've wondered the same thing. I started practising medicine in 2009 and have looked after a number of WWII pilots, as well as a number of aircraft mechanics. I have also looked after a few people who served in various roles in the army, but it seems to me that the RAF personnel seemed to be disproportionately represented and to be in particularly good nick for their ages.
Impressions can mislead, but it would be worth looking into.
Back to the original question: I've wondered the same thing. I started practising medicine in 2009 and have looked after a number of WWII pilots, as well as a number of aircraft mechanics. I have also looked after a few people who served in various roles in the army, but it seems to me that the RAF personnel seemed to be disproportionately represented and to be in particularly good nick for their ages.
Impressions can mislead, but it would be worth looking into.
I had the privilege yesterday of singing at the funeral of Flt Lt George Harris RAF (Ret) in Hong Kong Cathedral. He died last month aged 93. His son gave a moving eulogy. He had tried to enlist at the age of 16 in 1939 but was told to b----- off and come back in two years' time. He did and trained in Rhodesia before flying Mustangs in Burma. I met him here a couple of times and of course he had a fund of riveting stories. He had a son and a daughter and was cremated wearing his RAF pilot's tie.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
....and I suspect it might be whoever pays our pensions. In 1965 the average length of time for a full career officer retiring at 55 to draw his pension was - THREE YEARS!!!
My just about to be my F-i-L showed me those figures from the (as it was then)
Officers' Pension Society.
At one of my resettlement financial seminars in about 1996/7 I asked the question again but no-one seemed to know the answer.
The Ancient Mariner
(F-i-L lived to 91,chuffed to bits that he'd beaten the actuarial odds)
My just about to be my F-i-L showed me those figures from the (as it was then)
Officers' Pension Society.
At one of my resettlement financial seminars in about 1996/7 I asked the question again but no-one seemed to know the answer.
The Ancient Mariner
(F-i-L lived to 91,chuffed to bits that he'd beaten the actuarial odds)
Another factor relevant in early 60s was survival. Our dep nav instructor to us all, to stunned silence, announced at 50% would be dead by 38. He was not far off. I read a novel about a USAF F100 wing in UK which suggested can equally high mortality among aircrew.
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To live a long life you have to have something to live a long life FOR.
90-year-old former aviators mostly have two things in common: they did all the wrong things as far as good health is concerned when they were young, but they settled into a meaningful, healthy and satisfying life in retirement. They found something other than flying to live for.
Not as easy, or as common, as it might seem.
90-year-old former aviators mostly have two things in common: they did all the wrong things as far as good health is concerned when they were young, but they settled into a meaningful, healthy and satisfying life in retirement. They found something other than flying to live for.
Not as easy, or as common, as it might seem.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Albert, very true. Of my Rotary Club most of the members when I joined, and all older than me, are still there 20 years on with only two who have shuffled off, one very old and one a heavy smoker.
I would think that the screening that military pilots have to pass just to be admitted to the club would put them among the healthiest people so it makes sense that on average they would stay healthy longer.
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Two boys, sired in (almost) exactly those circumstances. Mind you, on the ME fleet I found going away for a couple of weeks of intense alcohol, nicotine, food, & gasoline fuelled fun, without 'adult' supervision, infinitely more relaxing than putting in face time on the sqn.
Why daughters?
Personally I subscribe to the 'g' school of thought. On my first squadron (Lightnings) all new offspring were daughters but then a 'g' limit was imposed on the F6 fleet in an attempt to reduce fatigue index consumption and all subsequent issue on our squadron were sons, my first included. My second son 3 years later was born while I was on a ground tour thus furthering the 'g' theory.
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The problem with answering the OP's question is that fighter pilots are a small statistical subset, even in a survey of RAF officers. My extensive research (5min on google!) threw up two surveys for pilots generally; an ALPA (US pilots union) which showed pilots dying three years younger than wider population. Confusingly, figures from a study of American Airlines pilots showed the opposite, with them living five years longer than average American white males.
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....and I suspect it might be whoever pays our pensions. In 1965 the average length of time for a full career officer retiring at 55 to draw his pension was - THREE YEARS!!!
My just about to be my F-i-L showed me those figures from the (as it was then)
Officers' Pension Society.
At one of my resettlement financial seminars in about 1996/7 I asked the question again but no-one seemed to know the answer.
My just about to be my F-i-L showed me those figures from the (as it was then)
Officers' Pension Society.
At one of my resettlement financial seminars in about 1996/7 I asked the question again but no-one seemed to know the answer.
• A UK male who was aged 60 in 2010 would generally have a life expectancy of 86 years and a similar female would have a life expectancy of 88 years.
• A retired male Officer who was aged 60 in 2010 would have a life expectancy of 90 and a similar female would have a life expectancy of 92.
• A retired male Other Rank who was aged 60 in 2010 would have a life expectancy of 87 and a similar female would have a life expectancy of 90.
The morale of the story is clear. I should have enlisted for only a couple of years, got commissioned and then identified as female.
ONS did quite a bit of work on this, and the AFPS15 discussion document claimed that in general, those who were commissioned into the Armed Forces tended to live a little longer than civilian counterparts. Those who were enlisted lived a slightly shorter life.
• A UK male who was aged 60 in 2010 would generally have a life expectancy of 86 years and a similar female would have a life expectancy of 88 years.
• A retired male Officer who was aged 60 in 2010 would have a life expectancy of 90 and a similar female would have a life expectancy of 92.
• A retired male Other Rank who was aged 60 in 2010 would have a life expectancy of 87 and a similar female would have a life expectancy of 90.
The morale of the story is clear. I should have enlisted for only a couple of years, got commissioned and then identified as female.
• A UK male who was aged 60 in 2010 would generally have a life expectancy of 86 years and a similar female would have a life expectancy of 88 years.
• A retired male Officer who was aged 60 in 2010 would have a life expectancy of 90 and a similar female would have a life expectancy of 92.
• A retired male Other Rank who was aged 60 in 2010 would have a life expectancy of 87 and a similar female would have a life expectancy of 90.
The morale of the story is clear. I should have enlisted for only a couple of years, got commissioned and then identified as female.
In light of this discussion, when my Stn Cdr asked me what my career aspirations were a while back, told him to draw more in pension than I did in salary. He initially frowned, then you could see the cogs turn before he realised I might just be on to something. He still wouldn't let me put that and lottery winner down as aspirations on JPA though. No sense of humour some people 😁
But I do also wonder whether as hard as the military life can be sometimes it is also a lifestyle that leads to longevity? Relatively active, we are supposed to take care of ourselves - fitness tests, medicals etc and a bit of mental challenge trying to square circles, all the things that we read about as being good for warding off dementia, heart disease etc. Certainly a lot of my civilian family and friends of the same age but without the military lifestyle look far more harassed, haggard and overweight than I do.
Edited to add - the M/F question - does that also extend to associated Branches / Trades? I know a few Comms Engineers and ABMs and daughters seem to be the norm there too. My ex's father was a very senior Comms type, desperate for a son, over the years and tours he kept popping out daughters. Good for me at the time, but he did look harassed!!!
Last edited by Melchett01; 9th Apr 2017 at 10:50.
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May I suggest that g is not the cause of sex selection in offspring but rate of change of g. This may explain the motor sport connection especial considering the frequency of rate of change.
Pontious Navigator
Was the novel any good, and if so, could you give the title please?
But back to the thread. I read a report somewhere which said the most important thing regarding longevity for retired officers was if they got another job. Those that did, lived far longer than those who simply retired at 55 and did nothing afterwards.
I read a novel about a USAF F100 wing
But back to the thread. I read a report somewhere which said the most important thing regarding longevity for retired officers was if they got another job. Those that did, lived far longer than those who simply retired at 55 and did nothing afterwards.
Last edited by Argonautical; 9th Apr 2017 at 14:33. Reason: spelling
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If we're going to include WW2 pilots, as several have here, that can only be used to bump up the average by the statistical atrocity of ignoring the thousands who died tragically young in that conflict.
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It's just another perk of flying - Fly high, fly fast and live (a tiny bit) longer!
Albeit minimal, Einstein's twin paradox (time dilation) theories back you up (assuming you don't cock-up on the job, that is).
The case of the travelling twins ? Einstein Online
Albeit minimal, Einstein's twin paradox (time dilation) theories back you up (assuming you don't cock-up on the job, that is).
The case of the travelling twins ? Einstein Online