German Tornado replacement
I only ever saw Jaguars with WE177s fitted, never a US weapon. Prevention of unauthorised use was one closed HAS door, two RAFP with SMGs, one of whom was up the ladder with a piece of paper...
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
https://www.defensenews.com/global/e...r-eurofighter/Boeing’s F-18 jet may have a leg up in Germany over Eurofighter
COLOGNE, Germany — The race between Boeing’s F-18 jet and the Airbus Eurofighter Typhoon aircraft to replace Germany’s Tornado fighter-bombers has tilted toward the American plane, according to a German media report.
That is after German defense officials received information from the Pentagon about the time needed to certify the Eurofighter to carry nuclear weapons, according to an article in the Süddeutsche Zeitung. Getting the Eurofighter approved for that mission would take between three and five years longer than the F-18, which is considered a nuclear weapons-capable aircraft in the U.S. military, the newspaper reported.......
Boeing’s F-18 jet may have a leg up in Germany over Eurofighter
COLOGNE, Germany — The race between Boeing’s F-18 jet and the Airbus Eurofighter Typhoon aircraft to replace Germany’s Tornado fighter-bombers has tilted toward the American plane, according to a German media report.That is after German defense officials received information from the Pentagon about the time needed to certify the Eurofighter to carry nuclear weapons, according to an article in the Süddeutsche Zeitung. Getting the Eurofighter approved for that mission would take between three and five years longer than the F-18, which is considered a nuclear weapons-capable aircraft in the U.S. military, the newspaper reported.......
They seem to want dual crew in any case.
Super Hornet / Growler
4 decades ago if the YF-17 Cobra went into production, then McD were looking at potential foreign customers...so I came across this artists impressions of potential customers..
Notice second from bottom
Also last year after ILA Berlin 2018, when I saw E/A-18G Growler on static, I heard a rumor, that it may have stuck around tad longer in Germany...demo to Luftwaffe as ECR replacement.
So now the Tiffy may have competition on its hands, partially because of NATO Bucket of Sunshine commitment which the Tonka can port, but the Tiffy cannot. Thus with the F-35 canned...looks like it could be the Super Hornet.
Cheers
https://www.defensenews.com/global/e...5bGHs.facebook
Notice second from bottom
Also last year after ILA Berlin 2018, when I saw E/A-18G Growler on static, I heard a rumor, that it may have stuck around tad longer in Germany...demo to Luftwaffe as ECR replacement.
So now the Tiffy may have competition on its hands, partially because of NATO Bucket of Sunshine commitment which the Tonka can port, but the Tiffy cannot. Thus with the F-35 canned...looks like it could be the Super Hornet.
Cheers
https://www.defensenews.com/global/e...5bGHs.facebook
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
https://www.defensenews.com/global/e...-tornado-jets/
Germany reportedly moving toward a split buy of Super Hornets, Growlers and Eurofighter Typhoons to replace Tornado jets
WASHINGTON — The German air force will reportedly buy up to 90 Eurofighters, 30 F/A-18E/F Super Hornets and 15 EA-18G Growlers to replace the remainder of its Panavia Tornado fighter jet fleet, but the split procurement doesn’t offer an easy answer for Germany’s requirement to field a nuclear-capable jet, a U.K. defense think tank said.
Germany plans to use the Super Hornet, made by U.S. aerospace company Boeing, to fill a NATO requirement to field fighter aircraft capable of dropping the B61 nuclear gravity bomb, according to German business publication Handelsblatt, which first reported the split buy. It will also buy Growlers to replace the Tornados that carry out an electronic attack role.
However, only the legacy F/A-18 Hornet — not the Super Hornet — was ever certified to carry the B61, wrote Justin Bronk, a research fellow with the Royal United Services Institute, a U.K. based thinktank that covers defense issues. That means that the Super Hornet will have to go through the certification process, said Bronk, who called the split buy “the worst of all previously mooted outcomes.”
Boeing spokesman Justin Gibbons said that while the Super Hornet is not yet certified to carry the B61, the company has the U.S. government’s support for future integration.“The F/A-18 Super Hornet is capable of being certified to meet B61 requirements for Germany under its timeline. Boeing has a proven track record of successfully integrating weapons systems that meet the needs of both U.S. and international customers,” he said. Gibbons declined to comment on the timing of Germany’s deadline for competitive reasons..........
Germany reportedly moving toward a split buy of Super Hornets, Growlers and Eurofighter Typhoons to replace Tornado jets
WASHINGTON — The German air force will reportedly buy up to 90 Eurofighters, 30 F/A-18E/F Super Hornets and 15 EA-18G Growlers to replace the remainder of its Panavia Tornado fighter jet fleet, but the split procurement doesn’t offer an easy answer for Germany’s requirement to field a nuclear-capable jet, a U.K. defense think tank said.
Germany plans to use the Super Hornet, made by U.S. aerospace company Boeing, to fill a NATO requirement to field fighter aircraft capable of dropping the B61 nuclear gravity bomb, according to German business publication Handelsblatt, which first reported the split buy. It will also buy Growlers to replace the Tornados that carry out an electronic attack role.
However, only the legacy F/A-18 Hornet — not the Super Hornet — was ever certified to carry the B61, wrote Justin Bronk, a research fellow with the Royal United Services Institute, a U.K. based thinktank that covers defense issues. That means that the Super Hornet will have to go through the certification process, said Bronk, who called the split buy “the worst of all previously mooted outcomes.”
Boeing spokesman Justin Gibbons said that while the Super Hornet is not yet certified to carry the B61, the company has the U.S. government’s support for future integration.“The F/A-18 Super Hornet is capable of being certified to meet B61 requirements for Germany under its timeline. Boeing has a proven track record of successfully integrating weapons systems that meet the needs of both U.S. and international customers,” he said. Gibbons declined to comment on the timing of Germany’s deadline for competitive reasons..........
Boeing has a proven track record of successfully integrating weapons systems that meet the needs of both U.S. and international customers
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/n...ment-2jlqfb53q
Nuclear row over US jets splits Angela Merkel government
The German defence minister has angered her centre-left coalition partners by forging ahead with a plan to buy 45 US fighter jets, 30 of which will be fitted to carry American atom bombs.
Germany’s fleet of roughly 90 Tornado jets, the symbol of Berlin’s commitment to upholding the Nato nuclear umbrella, must be replaced from 2025. Yet Angela Merkel’s coalition is rancorously divided over the next generation of nuclear-capable aircraft. The defence ministry, controlled by Mrs Merkel’s close ally Annegret Kramp-Karrenbauer, wants 90 Eurofighters from Airbus, the European aerospace giant, and 30 F-18 Super Hornets and 15 F-18 Growler jets from Boeing, its American rival. The left-wing Social Democratic party (SPD), however, is uncomfortable about spending so much on US hardware and its MPs insist on having a say in the decision.
The dispute came to a head on Sunday when it emerged that Mrs Kramp-Karrenbauer had emailed her US counterpart, Mark Esper, saying that Germany was ready to order the F-18s.
The US has about 150 B61-12 air-launched nuclear bombs in Europe, with 20 or so stored at the Büchel air base in western Germany. Opinion polls suggest that an overwhelming majority of the public want them gone but the government regards them as a pillar of the country’s Nato membership. Torben Schütz, a research fellow in security and defence policy at the German Council on Foreign Relations (DGAP), said the F-18 order was “very closely bound up with Germany’s continued role as an active partner in Nato’s shared nuclear deterrent”.
Anti-nuclear MPs have accused Mrs Kramp-Karrenbauer of cutting the Bundestag out of the decision. Fritz Felgentreu, the defence spokesman for the SPD group in the Bundestag, said it would withdraw its support for the ministry unless it changed course. “As long as we have no opportunity to examine the ministry’s choice, to evaluate it critically and to compare it against the alternatives, the SPD will certainly not go along with this process,” he said.
The nuclear question has taken on a sharper significance since Russia stationed large numbers of medium-range cruise missiles within striking range of European capitals. While the other seven EU states which house US bombs have all bought state-of-the-art F-35 fighter jets to carry them, Germany’s choice to acquire a combination of older models from Europe and the US reflects its delicate strategic tightrope act.
“Franco-German and US-German relations are at the centre of this in political terms,” Mr Schütz said. “If you order as many Eurofighters as possible you strengthen Airbus, which is . . . supposed to develop and build the next generation of fighter jets at the behest of the French and German governments. But at the same time it’s important for Germany to maintain relations with the US, which is where buying American aircraft helps.”
Nuclear row over US jets splits Angela Merkel government
The German defence minister has angered her centre-left coalition partners by forging ahead with a plan to buy 45 US fighter jets, 30 of which will be fitted to carry American atom bombs.
Germany’s fleet of roughly 90 Tornado jets, the symbol of Berlin’s commitment to upholding the Nato nuclear umbrella, must be replaced from 2025. Yet Angela Merkel’s coalition is rancorously divided over the next generation of nuclear-capable aircraft. The defence ministry, controlled by Mrs Merkel’s close ally Annegret Kramp-Karrenbauer, wants 90 Eurofighters from Airbus, the European aerospace giant, and 30 F-18 Super Hornets and 15 F-18 Growler jets from Boeing, its American rival. The left-wing Social Democratic party (SPD), however, is uncomfortable about spending so much on US hardware and its MPs insist on having a say in the decision.
The dispute came to a head on Sunday when it emerged that Mrs Kramp-Karrenbauer had emailed her US counterpart, Mark Esper, saying that Germany was ready to order the F-18s.
The US has about 150 B61-12 air-launched nuclear bombs in Europe, with 20 or so stored at the Büchel air base in western Germany. Opinion polls suggest that an overwhelming majority of the public want them gone but the government regards them as a pillar of the country’s Nato membership. Torben Schütz, a research fellow in security and defence policy at the German Council on Foreign Relations (DGAP), said the F-18 order was “very closely bound up with Germany’s continued role as an active partner in Nato’s shared nuclear deterrent”.
Anti-nuclear MPs have accused Mrs Kramp-Karrenbauer of cutting the Bundestag out of the decision. Fritz Felgentreu, the defence spokesman for the SPD group in the Bundestag, said it would withdraw its support for the ministry unless it changed course. “As long as we have no opportunity to examine the ministry’s choice, to evaluate it critically and to compare it against the alternatives, the SPD will certainly not go along with this process,” he said.
The nuclear question has taken on a sharper significance since Russia stationed large numbers of medium-range cruise missiles within striking range of European capitals. While the other seven EU states which house US bombs have all bought state-of-the-art F-35 fighter jets to carry them, Germany’s choice to acquire a combination of older models from Europe and the US reflects its delicate strategic tightrope act.
“Franco-German and US-German relations are at the centre of this in political terms,” Mr Schütz said. “If you order as many Eurofighters as possible you strengthen Airbus, which is . . . supposed to develop and build the next generation of fighter jets at the behest of the French and German governments. But at the same time it’s important for Germany to maintain relations with the US, which is where buying American aircraft helps.”
The problem is the SPD rep has thrown the toys out of his pram because he didn't have a chance to grandstand and then negotiate a quid-pro-quo to let the decision go-ahead in return for a favour somewhere else. It's not one they're going to die in a ditch for as they know the electorate won't be impressed
If date of the first first flight was a criteria, they wouldn’t have looked at the Hornet either. The F15EX isn’t your daddy’s F15A, same could be said for the Hornet’s Germany will be receiving. I would imagine mission criteria and budgeting drove the decision, not the date the prototype flew.
When the Germans needed a replacement for the Lockheed F-104G in the strike role, the US piled on the pressure, aiming to persuade Germany to procure a US-built fighter.
In those far off days, the Germans had enough balls and backbone to procure the aircraft that their own industry was producing, that their own taxpayers and workers were benefiting from and effectively told the US that if they wanted the Luftwaffe to deliver American nuclear weapons, then they, the US, would have to integrate the B61 on their new Tornados.
It was very much in the USA's interest to 'burden share' with its allies, and it integrated B61 on the Tornado without further demur.
The same is true today, and if Germany were to stick to its guns again, the USA would need to decide whether it wanted the Luftwaffe to share in the strike role, and if it does (and it will) then it would have to integrate the B61 on the Luftwaffe's choice of platform. Unless a gutless and supine German Ministry of Defence gives the impression that it can be bullied into selecting the platform that the US wants it to procure....
Design of a nuclear weapons pylon for the Eurofighter is well advanced, thanks to the Belgian campaign, when the Commander of the Belgian Air Component was shown a strike mission in the sim/rig, with production representative software. Nuclear weapons integration on the Super Hornet is not any further advanced. For Speedywheels - the Super Hornet does not have any strike capability.
In those far off days, the Germans had enough balls and backbone to procure the aircraft that their own industry was producing, that their own taxpayers and workers were benefiting from and effectively told the US that if they wanted the Luftwaffe to deliver American nuclear weapons, then they, the US, would have to integrate the B61 on their new Tornados.
It was very much in the USA's interest to 'burden share' with its allies, and it integrated B61 on the Tornado without further demur.
The same is true today, and if Germany were to stick to its guns again, the USA would need to decide whether it wanted the Luftwaffe to share in the strike role, and if it does (and it will) then it would have to integrate the B61 on the Luftwaffe's choice of platform. Unless a gutless and supine German Ministry of Defence gives the impression that it can be bullied into selecting the platform that the US wants it to procure....
Design of a nuclear weapons pylon for the Eurofighter is well advanced, thanks to the Belgian campaign, when the Commander of the Belgian Air Component was shown a strike mission in the sim/rig, with production representative software. Nuclear weapons integration on the Super Hornet is not any further advanced. For Speedywheels - the Super Hornet does not have any strike capability.
I haven't followed it closely. Isn't the issue the germans wont/cant give the codes to the US and probably from the US side too. To be able to get it working with the eurofighter?