Historic Overweight C130 Incident
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By the time the Flt Eng and then the Captain had asked me to chuck a bit of extra fuel on-board and hide it, the fuel state on the 10 was often higher than it was supposed to be.
The times I spent shoving fuel up the fin then transferring it back and so on until it just read zero ish and then back and forward between the wing tanks to get it reading correct quantityish, while losing and hiding the extra 1000Ibs. First thing the Eng did on take off was open the fin tank up and watch the centre miraculously top up.
The times I spent shoving fuel up the fin then transferring it back and so on until it just read zero ish and then back and forward between the wing tanks to get it reading correct quantityish, while losing and hiding the extra 1000Ibs. First thing the Eng did on take off was open the fin tank up and watch the centre miraculously top up.
I'm sure that I can recall reading that during the Berlin airlift a Dakota with a load of pressed Aluminium planking had a hell of a job getting then keeping airborne. Upon landing it was ascertained that the number of pieces of the Aluminium planking which equated to X lbs turned out to be steel planking which of course were many more lbs.
I seem to recall: At the start of the Falklands affair we were not allowed to go above standard TOW (160,000 lbs?) out of Lyneham. There we were off over the hill with falling ground beneath us. So we had to put in to Gib for fuel. Gib takeoffs were authorised at 175,000 lbs, thus ensuring an exciting start across Algeciras Bay with the Spanish frontier looming. Never did understand the thinking behind those rules! Happy days.
By the time the Flt Eng and then the Captain had asked me to chuck a bit of extra fuel on-board and hide it, the fuel state on the 10 was often higher than it was supposed to be.
I recall coming out of Dulles late one night, with a full load of pongos. When the Air Engineer checked the fuel, we were over max ramp weight... All because the bone idle GE hadn't been monitoring the refuelling panel to check that the fuel quantity from the bowser was being correctly loaded. Why he signed for more fuel than had been requested, I cannot imagine - I suspect he was hoping that no-one would notice...or care.
What to do now.... Fortunately we weren't over the MOS max ramp weight which had been approved for the South Atlantic around 20 years earlier, but that was a 'war only' clearance. So, 'invite' the GE to arrange for defueling to the correct weight, but keep the pongos on board as there would be less fatigue on the aircraft than if they all trooped out, bouncing the jet on its undercarriage as they went. It would also mean that they would be less grumpy!
Dulles weren't terribly happy at having to find a bowser though...
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Same old same old.....Many people have been killed and will be killed due to psi and bar
being around 15 times higher. Not just inflating A/C tyres but all sorts of industry around the globe. It's going to take many years to resolve, as my mum still say's it's
70 deg out there and I say 21c. Anybody out there who is really fat? you are still, just Whatever scale you use will make you feel better?
being around 15 times higher. Not just inflating A/C tyres but all sorts of industry around the globe. It's going to take many years to resolve, as my mum still say's it's
70 deg out there and I say 21c. Anybody out there who is really fat? you are still, just Whatever scale you use will make you feel better?
November 1963 in Borneo. A Single Engine Pioneer was operating at a 200 yd jungle strip up country. The payload of the SEP was 2000 lbs ( inc pilot and fuel ). Pilot is in seat about to start the engine, when an Infantry subaltern arrives and asks if it OK to put half a dozen Jerrycans in the back, as they are needed at the next destination.
Pilot agrees, and stays in his seat, the Jerrycans are loaded and strapped down in the back. Attempts Take-off but aircraft does not reach flying speed, aborts and runs off the end into the jungle. Wings pulled off in the impact but pilot uninjured. It transpired that the Jerrycans were full of water and the aircraft was 300 lbs overweight.
Hasty local purchase of all the bathroom scales that could be obtained, for issue to all fixed-wing and helo operating up country, with strict instructions on how to use them.
Pilot agrees, and stays in his seat, the Jerrycans are loaded and strapped down in the back. Attempts Take-off but aircraft does not reach flying speed, aborts and runs off the end into the jungle. Wings pulled off in the impact but pilot uninjured. It transpired that the Jerrycans were full of water and the aircraft was 300 lbs overweight.
Hasty local purchase of all the bathroom scales that could be obtained, for issue to all fixed-wing and helo operating up country, with strict instructions on how to use them.
Saw a mate at the supermarche petrol station putting air in the tyres of his Mondeo -"What pressure are you putting in ?" I asked. "30 psi"
"Well you have just put in 3 atmospheres, that is about 45 psi". Left him scratching his head. And gauge was in psi and atm too
"Well you have just put in 3 atmospheres, that is about 45 psi". Left him scratching his head. And gauge was in psi and atm too
"Mildly" Eccentric Stardriver
I operated an aircraft years ago where we fuelled in litres, converted it to kg for the tech log and flt plan, the main tank gauges were in gallons, and the outboard gauges were in US gallons, both of which had to be converted again into kg for the contents check on the plan. Kept the brain active.
In China we ran a mix of AS332s. The ASIs could be in either knots or KPH, the altimeters in feet or metres with ATC allocating altitudes in metres, the RCDIs in ft/min or ms/sec and the pressure gauges in lbs/in or bars. Our loads were delivered in kilos and had to be converted to lbs.
Fortunately most of them had fuel gauges that with a flick of a switch read in either lbs or kilos.
Fortunately most of them had fuel gauges that with a flick of a switch read in either lbs or kilos.
I recall coming out of Dulles late one night, with a full load of pongos. When the Air Engineer checked the fuel, we were over max ramp weight... All because the bone idle GE hadn't been monitoring the refuelling panel to check that the fuel quantity from the bowser was being correctly loaded. Why he signed for more fuel than had been requested, I cannot imagine - I suspect he was hoping that no-one would notice...or care.
What to do now.... Fortunately we weren't over the MOS max ramp weight which had been approved for the South Atlantic around 20 years earlier, but that was a 'war only' clearance. So, 'invite' the GE to arrange for defueling to the correct weight, but keep the pongos on board as there would be less fatigue on the aircraft than if they all trooped out, bouncing the jet on its undercarriage as they went. It would also mean that they would be less grumpy!
Dulles weren't terribly happy at having to find a bowser though...
What to do now.... Fortunately we weren't over the MOS max ramp weight which had been approved for the South Atlantic around 20 years earlier, but that was a 'war only' clearance. So, 'invite' the GE to arrange for defueling to the correct weight, but keep the pongos on board as there would be less fatigue on the aircraft than if they all trooped out, bouncing the jet on its undercarriage as they went. It would also mean that they would be less grumpy!
Dulles weren't terribly happy at having to find a bowser though...
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Had to find a solution to a similar solution in Bermuda a few years ago when a structural fuel leak necessitated fully draining the aircraft. No defuelling facilities available, and definitely none that would take 72 tonnes. We proceeded to increase the island's carbon footprint somewhat by burning the stuff in a corner of the airfield over the course of 2 days. Not in a bonfire either.
When Hunting were shutting up shop, they had the damned Electra's sitting on the compass bay burning and turning for the same reason, day in and day out, and I wasn't talking about a lone aircraft, they simply had nowhere to put it and their bowser was being sold empty!.
The worst I saw weight wise were Nigerian's and we were banned from assisting them because we could become liable if anything happened, they used to stock up on anything that was hard to come by at home from cases of bog roll to sanitary products and nappies.
I watched them fill a Lear 35 and I mean fill, until the poor thing was groaning at the seams, they left a gap at the front about a foot high and lifted the pilot in so he could slide across all of this stuff and drop into the cockpit.
It departed to Stanstead I think to refuel, and upon landing, the nose wheel steering system gave up the ghost because of the weight it was trying to turn, we had an Engineer who was told to travel down to look at it, he refused as overtime meant he ended up losing money because of the tax, he was told it was his job on the line and was told he would go take a look or be sacked.... fair play he did just that, arrived, walked up to the aircraft, took a look, agreed with the pilot, it was indeed U/S and departed for home leaving the pilot and dead aircraft behind for the weekend...... oddly enough they never tried to send him again..
The other that stands out was a Nigerian King Air, they used to arrive, the crew would get in, the cabin was filled with everything including TV's all the way to the back bog, the Eng would then sit on the said bog and extra stuff was packed in to the door.. often they would still be left with the odd item they couldn't physically get in, but it wasn't for trying, it would then depart..
Some of the stuff we used to get was something else, we did a Nigerian HS125 and the first thing we did was call Rentokil, they would toss a bug bomb inside it then leave it a couple of days, they were something else, I mean a lot of the screws in the leading edges were predrilled, IE they had drilled the knackered screws out and used an easy out to get them out...... then an easy out to reinstall them!!!!! ahhh happy days.
..
Last edited by NutLoose; 18th Jan 2017 at 22:44.
I understand the USA lost a space probe due to a lbs/kg cock up. When discussing overweight situations it may be that the a/c is also outside the C of G limits. So if the added weight does not kill you then the C of G excess may.
ancientaviator62, the US cock-up was because Lockheed Martin used imperial units when NASA used metric. So on 23 Sep 1999, the US lost a $125 million spacecraft somewhere over Mars...
CNN - Metric mishap caused loss of NASA orbiter - September 30, 1999
CNN - Metric mishap caused loss of NASA orbiter - September 30, 1999
I've always liked the story of the "last Herk out of Saigon".
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Redphil - my old man told the story of a lb kg problem on airstrip planking as a Dakota going into Imphal Kohima after the battle - he was out there in 1945 and left the RAF long before Berlin so I assumed he was correct
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Didn't they lift some portacabin for the Pongoes out in NI up a hill and after working out the weight decided they could do it with a reduced fuel load, upon attempting the lift it wouldn't budge, landing on, it was found the RSM had decided they might as well carry a few other things they needed, so had filled it with furniture etc.
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Husband, wife and 5 kids in a Birdog.
The Opportunity to Make History: Vietnam War Hero?s Flight to Freedom Remembered | Naval Historical Foundation
Chinooks were first used in combat in 1965 during the Vietnam conflict. During the last days of the war, one Chinook is reported to have carried 147 refugees in a single lift.
The Opportunity to Make History: Vietnam War Hero?s Flight to Freedom Remembered | Naval Historical Foundation
Chinooks were first used in combat in 1965 during the Vietnam conflict. During the last days of the war, one Chinook is reported to have carried 147 refugees in a single lift.
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I'm surprised that nobody has yet mentioned the Gimli Glider. A new Air Canada Airbus, the Captain had mixed up Lbs of fuel, Litres and Kgs. It was cruising along quite happily then it all went quiet, he deadstick landed it on an old disused airfield while a stock car race was underway.
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