Victor as conventional bomber
The incident referred to in #3 and #6 was probably during Exercise Showpiece, on 27 March 1965, a show of force/firepower demo for the Malaysian PM Tunku Abdul Rahmen and other dignitaries. It took place over the South China Sea to the east of Singapore. The viewing parties were on the 4 RN Carriers that were sailing in line astern, with a screen of Destroyers and Frigates to the south between them and Indonesia. This was at the height of the Confrontation. A line of RFAs were the screen to the north. The air assets in the flypast were a total of 75 RAF, RAAF, RNZAF and FAA including Canberras, Hunters, Sabres, Javelins and the FAA.
After the first flypast the firepower demo had pairs of Sabres, Hunters and Canberras attacking smoke floats, laid between the Carriers and the RFAs, with guns and rockets.
Following a second flypast the same attackers used bombs and rockets. The Grand Finale was the Victor B1A dropping 35 x 1000lbs bombs. The bombs were fused with VT (Radar) fuses for air burst, but it appears that the seperation distance was miscalculated, as the bombs were exploding prematurely, each set off by the bomb ahead, each closer to the Victor. The first 21 fell as planned, but then the fourth septuple carrier malfunctioned and the gap in the stick saved the Victor from self destruction. The fifth set of 7 fell OK. The aircraft suffered some minor damage.My info on the Victor was from talking to the crew in the bar after the somewhat hectic flight.
After the first flypast the firepower demo had pairs of Sabres, Hunters and Canberras attacking smoke floats, laid between the Carriers and the RFAs, with guns and rockets.
Following a second flypast the same attackers used bombs and rockets. The Grand Finale was the Victor B1A dropping 35 x 1000lbs bombs. The bombs were fused with VT (Radar) fuses for air burst, but it appears that the seperation distance was miscalculated, as the bombs were exploding prematurely, each set off by the bomb ahead, each closer to the Victor. The first 21 fell as planned, but then the fourth septuple carrier malfunctioned and the gap in the stick saved the Victor from self destruction. The fifth set of 7 fell OK. The aircraft suffered some minor damage.My info on the Victor was from talking to the crew in the bar after the somewhat hectic flight.
cliver029 Thanks for the info on 648 at Duxford. I had heard she was in pretty poor shape which is not surprising after 40 plus years I suppose. I have chipped in with my pitifully small contribution to the £400k required, but I very much doubt if that amount can be raised in this way. I felt better about contributing than I would to the latest VTTS appeal because as far as I am aware I wont be contributing to inflated salaries at Duxford which is a part of IWM. I do, in fact, know a curator at IWM and can say that the salaries paid there are modest in the extreme.
Victor Mk 1 Performance.
The incident referred to in #26 about a Victor making tyre tracks at Butterworth is true. A 15 Sqn crew were tasked with a heavyweight T/O and were surprised to demolish some approach lights and leave furrows in the grass. As usual it was "Pilot Error" so a Flt Cdr was tasked to show how it should be done. Result - the new lights were demolished again and the furrows reploughed. It was agreed that the ODM was a tad optimistic.
Victor K1/K1A were also seen to kick up rooster tails over the sea after T/O at Gan, as the undercarriage dropped to the free flight position after T/O.
Another example was a 5 aircraft 30 sec stream T/O at AKT. As the formation started to taxi, the windsock, which had been giving a slight easterly component, swung round to give a slight westerly component. The lead crew asked for a change to the westerly runway, which was refused as there was "a VC10 100 miles inbound". After a lot of argy bargy with ATC about T/O with unsafe gaps between Stop and Go speeds the runway change was granted. The lead aircraft took the usual 50 sec ground roll, the No2 several hundred feet more, the No3 even further, and No4 further still. ATC scrambled the Crash Crews to go to the point where No 5 was going to crash. In fact we lifted off on the piano keys and damaged the Safeland Barrier, which was down, with our jet blast as we passed a few feet above it. The reason - each aircraft had heated up the air for the following aircraft.
We landed back a couple of hours later to be met by a very apologetic SATCO and a case of ice cold beer. My captain was the aforementioned Flt Cdr from 15 Sqn.
Victor K1/K1A were also seen to kick up rooster tails over the sea after T/O at Gan, as the undercarriage dropped to the free flight position after T/O.
Another example was a 5 aircraft 30 sec stream T/O at AKT. As the formation started to taxi, the windsock, which had been giving a slight easterly component, swung round to give a slight westerly component. The lead crew asked for a change to the westerly runway, which was refused as there was "a VC10 100 miles inbound". After a lot of argy bargy with ATC about T/O with unsafe gaps between Stop and Go speeds the runway change was granted. The lead aircraft took the usual 50 sec ground roll, the No2 several hundred feet more, the No3 even further, and No4 further still. ATC scrambled the Crash Crews to go to the point where No 5 was going to crash. In fact we lifted off on the piano keys and damaged the Safeland Barrier, which was down, with our jet blast as we passed a few feet above it. The reason - each aircraft had heated up the air for the following aircraft.
We landed back a couple of hours later to be met by a very apologetic SATCO and a case of ice cold beer. My captain was the aforementioned Flt Cdr from 15 Sqn.
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I recall one Victor departure/arrival at AKT about 71/72. I think an engine failure after Go. They hit the dump switches and made a tight visual. The fanboy instructed no smoking on the station with a pervading odour of Avtur.
I recall lots of Victor takeoffs at Akrotiri. Looking back through the periscope you got a good view of the Vulcan static display as you climbed away 
Admittedly rumour had it that some of them occasionally got airborne.
Admittedly rumour had it that some of them occasionally got airborne.
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TTN, indeed, they used to mark the start of the weekend with the Thursday night landing and the start with a late Monday or early Tuesday departure. Four or five nights in Kyrenia. Of course interrupted by the odd shopping expedition to UK, bacon run to Malta, fish run to Madeira and chaffing dish and alabaster run to Teheran.
Last edited by Pontius Navigator; 26th Jan 2017 at 08:46.
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Cause and effect. Think also that this is what the Black Buck Bang might have looked like in the pre-dawn darkness.
Thank you KB, live 21x1000 lb drop at El Adem circa 1966/67 from a slide taken, IIRC, by a Daily Telegraph photog.
Thank you KB, live 21x1000 lb drop at El Adem circa 1966/67 from a slide taken, IIRC, by a Daily Telegraph photog.
Think also that this is what the Black Buck Bang might have looked like in the pre-dawn darkness.
Apologies if I've missed a post. Were the B2s (how many B2s were there?) all delivered as Blue Steel carriers or were they modified later? Were they all Blue Steel carriers or were just some of them done? What about the SRs? Was that a separate build on some Bs that were modified?
I know, questions, questions. I've done the web but different sites produce different numbers and answers.
I know, questions, questions. I've done the web but different sites produce different numbers and answers.
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
Think also that this is what the Black Buck Bang might have looked like in the pre-dawn darkness.
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
No idea - but it was mid 1980s. Like the miines which migrate out of the minefields they move around and pop-up elsewhere.
I see another popped up in 2003 - albeit one dropped by a Harrier.
Falkland Islands News Network - Financial Information and News
I see another popped up in 2003 - albeit one dropped by a Harrier.
Falkland Islands News Network - Financial Information and News
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RedhillPhil
I was on IX sqn at Coningsby and Cottesmore when new Vulcan B2's were being delivered from Avro's. All of ours were conventional free fall versions. I imagine those being delivered to Scampton may have been Blue Steel as that was their role. Ours was free fall.
ACW
I was on IX sqn at Coningsby and Cottesmore when new Vulcan B2's were being delivered from Avro's. All of ours were conventional free fall versions. I imagine those being delivered to Scampton may have been Blue Steel as that was their role. Ours was free fall.
ACW
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ACW, this being a Victor thread . . .
As far as I know they were only BS. I believe Avro made sets of bomb doors and alternative fuselage skin to replace the BS nose indent.
When the Victor BS was converted by BAE it is possible they may have been able to get similarly manufactured bomb doors from HP, but as HP was long gone and they had some diff manufacturing the wings, may be not.
It would be interesting to know what BAE did when they did the conversions.
As far as I know they were only BS. I believe Avro made sets of bomb doors and alternative fuselage skin to replace the BS nose indent.
When the Victor BS was converted by BAE it is possible they may have been able to get similarly manufactured bomb doors from HP, but as HP was long gone and they had some diff manufacturing the wings, may be not.
It would be interesting to know what BAE did when they did the conversions.
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PN
We will have to disagree then. I never saw any conversions from Blue Steel to Free Fall at Coningsby and Cottesmore on newly delivered aircraft. But there again I may be wrong.
Sorry for the senior moment - I thought all B2's were Vulcans. Victor K2's came after the B2.
ACW
We will have to disagree then. I never saw any conversions from Blue Steel to Free Fall at Coningsby and Cottesmore on newly delivered aircraft. But there again I may be wrong.
Sorry for the senior moment - I thought all B2's were Vulcans. Victor K2's came after the B2.
ACW
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ACW, indeed the Coningsby Wing received brand new Skybolt aircraft. Scampton had the earlier free fall Mk 2 which were then rebuilt as BS with their bomb door sets put in storage. I forgot the BS was a retrofit itself so post-BS was a 'simple' demodding.
If you can find an ex-BS I think you will find the new BS nose fairing. The other difference is the Red Shrimp mounting plate on the port side as well as the starboard.
If you can find an ex-BS I think you will find the new BS nose fairing. The other difference is the Red Shrimp mounting plate on the port side as well as the starboard.
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