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Russian fleet sailing in to the North sea

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Russian fleet sailing in to the North sea

Old 26th Oct 2016, 12:47
  #101 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Onceapilot View Post
Someone please tell me that NATO actually has a political gameplan for how to treat this floating deployment and the problems it might cause or suffer? How about having a strategy for the refuel/provisioning issue? Is the, "individual members decide", a satisfactory stance for NATO?

OAP
Isn't Russia a member of NATO's Partnership for Peace (PfP) programme? Sounds like an ideal framework for making some reciprocal logistical support arrangements.
Partnership for Peace
The Partnership for Peace (PfP) is a North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO) program aimed at creating trust between NATO and other states in Europe and the former Soviet Union; 22 states are members...
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Old 26th Oct 2016, 13:40
  #102 (permalink)  
 
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FODPlod

At the moment NATO doesn't like the idea that Russia came to the aid of an ally that has been invaded by people that are supported and trained by NATO members to overthrow a legal Government.

As Libya has proven when you get idiot leaders deciding to replace someone with not even a Plan A then you create even more instability. Sadly I expect nothing less from Western Governments with weak leadership.
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Old 26th Oct 2016, 14:07
  #103 (permalink)  
 
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Breaking on Sky News UK.

Russia's Embassy in Spain says that the request for Russian warships to refuel in the Spanish port of Ceuta has been withdrawn.
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Old 26th Oct 2016, 14:16
  #104 (permalink)  
 
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There's always Gib.......
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Old 26th Oct 2016, 14:29
  #105 (permalink)  
 
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now would be a great time for an (old) Top Gear channel crossing in a Hilux.

They are more likely to recognise Clarkson than Boris.
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Old 26th Oct 2016, 17:25
  #106 (permalink)  
 
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So do we think that the Russian Task Group can get to Syrian waters without refuelling? Could they ask the Algerians for help?
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Old 26th Oct 2016, 17:53
  #107 (permalink)  
 
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Interesting question, Philip. The Baltic Fleet Tanker Lena deployed about a week before the Kuznetsov Task Group down to the Azores. Possibly she will be part of the support to the Kuznetsov group?

Baltic Fleet Tanker Kola is currently heading for the English Channel.

https://www.vesselfinder.com/vessels...MMSI-273318510

Northern Fleet Tanker Kama has been part of previous Kuznetsov Med deployments. She was in the Sea of Azov/Black Sea last week so will likely deploy in support?

https://www.vesselfinder.com/vessels...MMSI-273431840

Malta has also supported previous Kuznetsov Task Force deployments. It will be interesting to see if Malta allows elements of the task force to enter Valletta?
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Old 26th Oct 2016, 18:00
  #108 (permalink)  
 
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They are not short of assets or options it seems.

Although it makes the case for a nuclear powerplant...............

Arc
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Old 26th Oct 2016, 18:10
  #109 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by TEEEJ View Post
Interesting question, Philip. The Baltic Fleet Tanker Lena deployed about a week before the Kuznetsov Task Group down to the Azores. Possibly she will be part of the support to the Kuznetsov group?

Baltic Fleet Tanker Kola is currently heading for the English Channel.

https://www.vesselfinder.com/vessels...MMSI-273318510

Northern Fleet Tanker Kama has been part of previous Kuznetsov Med deployments. She was in the Sea of Azov/Black Sea last week so will likely deploy in support?

https://www.vesselfinder.com/vessels...MMSI-273431840

Malta has also supported previous Kuznetsov Task Force deployments. It will be interesting to see if Malta allows elements of the task force to enter Valletta?
As I see it, Malta will be put under a lot of EU pressure not to support the Task Force.

Turkey as ever is a wild card, they as NATO members might try to stop Kama transiting to the Med, not sure what the political ramifications of this would be though.

So Kola would seem to be the most reliable source of fuels.

I have no idea of the capacity split between Fuel Oil for the Kuznetsov, diesel for the subs and corvettes etc and aviation fuel...
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Old 26th Oct 2016, 19:36
  #110 (permalink)  
 
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It would be nice to have some NATO naval assets in the way if only to make the Russians have to alter course and increase revs? A little close manoevering and some high jinks would force the battle group to burn more fuel than in their passage plan! That could cause a little embarrassment.
What's the naval equivalent of Bingo and Joker?

MB
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Old 26th Oct 2016, 20:26
  #111 (permalink)  
 
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Philip,
I don't think that Turkey would try to stop any Russian Navy vessels through the Turkish Straits. If they took the option for the likes of Kama then they would have to stop all the others. The Russian Navy "Syrian Express" from the Black Sea has been going on for years now transporting arms and supplies to Syria. After recently patching up relations with Russia I don't believe that they are going to go back down that slippery slope.

See list of Russian Navy vessels through the Bosphorus.

https://turkishnavy.net/foreign-wars...horus-in-2016/

It looks likely that the main task force group is going through the Strait of Gibraltar? Tug Nikolay Chiker sent an international weather message during 18 GMT on HF using Morse Code.

Date/time, Lat/Long, course, speed groups from the message.

RAL48 26181 99359 70057 22222 at 1833 GMT

35.9N 05.7W Heading East at 6-10 Knots

Map Link

https://goo.gl/maps/gkY3hUh9vGL2


Nikolay Chiker appears to have switched off AIS around midday.

https://www.vesselfinder.com/vessels...MMSI-273531629
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Old 26th Oct 2016, 21:27
  #112 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Madbob View Post
It would be nice to have some NATO naval assets in the way if only to make the Russians have to alter course and increase revs? A little close manoevering and some high jinks would force the battle group to burn more fuel than in their passage plan! That could cause a little embarrassment.
What's the naval equivalent of Bingo and Joker?

MB
Are you familiar with the INCSEA agreements? As I recall, they are still active.
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 17:05
  #113 (permalink)  
 
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Are you familiar with the INCSEA agreements? As I recall, they are still active.
Some people are so keen to start a war.

A US friend who did 8 years out of Ft Bragg says he often goes to Political campaign events of either party.

When they advocate attacking someone he always makes a point of congratulating them on their speech afterwards and asking of their family, then asks why they have not enlisted.
The never find a recruiter one falls flat when he says that is what he volunteers for 2 weekends a month and happy to arrange an appointment.
Since 2001 post 9/11 and pre Afghanistan adventure there have been no Politicians kids who have signed up in his catchment area in California.
He knows it as "Lets some other schmucks kid die syndrome"
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 17:18
  #114 (permalink)  
 
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He knows it as "Lets some other schmucks kid die syndrome"
Both the prospective VPs have sons who are active duty Marines.
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 17:43
  #115 (permalink)  
 
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racedo, you can look this up:
Senator John McCain(R-Arizona) and
Senator James Webb (D Virginia (he only served one term, 2006-2012) had sons serving in the Marines during the war, in the war.

I like your friend's style.
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Old 28th Oct 2016, 20:11
  #116 (permalink)  
 
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The situation in regards to Malta.

No Russian war ships will be refuelled in Malta, Foreign Minister George Vella said today, dismissing claims that the flotilla was planning a stopover on the island on their way to Syria.

Contacted by Times of Malta, Dr Vella would not, however, confirm or deny whether a request had been made by the Russians for a fleet stopover in Malta.

It is not known whether any request from the Russians was turned down on constitutional or ethical grounds.
Russian warships will not be refuelled in Malta - Opposition asks if permission was granted, then withdrawn, minister avoids direct reply - timesofmalta.com


The following Portugeuese Air Force video from earlier in the week provides an update on the tanker situation. In addition to Sergei Osipov there was also tanker Dubna and Kama.

https://www.facebook.com/PortugueseA...7575554048937/

From

https://www.facebook.com/PortugueseAirForce/?fref=nf


Confusion over Kama was due to the Marine Traffic AIS website having the incorrect Kama picture. That image shows the Murmansk registered Kama but the data is for a another Kama.

Vessel details for: KAMA (Ore/Oil Carrier) - IMO 8860822, MMSI 273431840, Call Sign UIPW Registered in Russia | AIS Marine Traffic

Northern Fleet Kama doesn't appear to be on AIS.

Tanker Dubna at following link but doesn't have AIS active.

https://www.vesselfinder.com/vessels/DUBNA-IMO-7347471


Tanker Osipov has now switched off AIS. This morning she was anchored off Morocco and then noted underway.

Vessel details for: OSIPOV (Unspecified) - MMSI 273546000, Call Sign Registered in Russia | AIS Marine Traffic

Tug Nikolay Chiker is underway and heading east. Position from HF Morse weather message during 13 UTC

RAL48 28121 99357 70027 22222 @1324Z

35.7N 02.7W Heading East at 6-10 Knots

https://goo.gl/maps/JsABa4Z345L2

Nikolay Chiker still on AIS as of 1817 UTC

Map Link

https://goo.gl/maps/8zBx7Ct65aA2

Vessel details for: NIKOLAY CHIKER (Tug) - IMO 8613334, MMSI 273531629, Call Sign RAL 48 Registered in Russia | AIS Marine Traffic
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Old 29th Oct 2016, 19:42
  #117 (permalink)  
 
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At least according to this, the Admiral Kuznetsov is quite the POS...


Russia's Dilapidated Aircraft Carrier Keeps Getting Banned From Ports


Sounds like one could justify banning it from a port as a pollution hazard (it might sink and muck up the water)
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Old 1st Nov 2016, 13:58
  #118 (permalink)  
 
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Overhead image of Kuznetsov from GeoEye-1 satellite from last Friday.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CwHVGg7W8AAehmE.jpg

https://twitter.com/DigitalGlobe/sta...49319637508096

From

https://twitter.com/DigitalGlobe
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Old 1st Nov 2016, 14:24
  #119 (permalink)  
 
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Interesting image. I get the sensation they're paining the foredeck; there seems to be some drums in the unfinished area. Why is of course a different question.
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Old 1st Nov 2016, 17:12
  #120 (permalink)  
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UN Blue?

However look at the aircraft parked in the shadows, they are also light blue.
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