Jet2 anyone?
The advert is causing a bit of a stir where I work too, although I've not actually seen it.
I'm sure our whopping 1% pay rise, new pension / NEM will stop everyone from leaving! After all, who wants to be a captain earning close to 100k anyway?!
Beags, thanks for the link. Was wondering if the actual advert had any further info.
I'm sure our whopping 1% pay rise, new pension / NEM will stop everyone from leaving! After all, who wants to be a captain earning close to 100k anyway?!
Beags, thanks for the link. Was wondering if the actual advert had any further info.
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The full page ad running in the 15th Jan edition of RAF News is for 'Approved Training Organisation Technical Instructors' for Jet2. To provide ground and simulator based training.....in Bradford 
!
!
"Mildly" Eccentric Stardriver
in Bradford !
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Looks like Jet2's recently appointed General Manager, Pilot Development, has been busy. Not bad work for an ex-GR4 mate!
And if you consider Lincolnshire as qualifying as Up North enough to be close to East Midlands, a fairly large percentage of the RAF's few remaining flying stations lie within Jet2's operating bases.
30 brand new 737-800s on order. Manning ought to take notice!
And if you consider Lincolnshire as qualifying as Up North enough to be close to East Midlands, a fairly large percentage of the RAF's few remaining flying stations lie within Jet2's operating bases.
30 brand new 737-800s on order. Manning ought to take notice!
Take that....
I currently work/live in that catchment area you mentioned, hence my intrest!
I currently work/live in that catchment area you mentioned, hence my intrest!
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Professor Plum
The advert is causing a bit of a stir where I work too, although I've not actually seen it.
I'm sure our whopping 1% pay rise, new pension / NEM will stop everyone from leaving! After all, who wants to be a captain earning close to 100k anyway?!
The advert is causing a bit of a stir where I work too, although I've not actually seen it.
I'm sure our whopping 1% pay rise, new pension / NEM will stop everyone from leaving! After all, who wants to be a captain earning close to 100k anyway?!
Ps. I don't work for them but have it on very good authority from a friend who did.
Gender Faculty Specialist
ATC, the current basic for captains is 83.5k. In April we are getting a 4% rise (on basic and sector pay and a new long sector rate is being introduced) and a 5k increase. That will take the basic to a gnats under 92k. I reckon last year I took about 7k in duty/sector pay and that will only increase this year.
I did less than 450 hours last year. If you're at a busier base you take home a lot more.
I did less than 450 hours last year. If you're at a busier base you take home a lot more.
Champagne anyone...?
Different bonds are arranged including non-repayment ones. Skippers are getting what amounts to about an 8-9% pay rise over the next year or so; LHS salaries are going to be in the region of £90K+ I think they may have finally realised that they need to pay decent money to keep people.
I did just shy of two years there and enjoyed it. There are stacks of ex-military people in the company who are able to live at home oop north and commute in to Leeds, EMA, MAN etc for a quick two sector day. It's not the land of milk and honey and the T&Cs of the major carriers far outstrip those on offer from Low Fare Finder House. The rosters get pretty chaotic in the summer and rarely survive first contact with reality. Notwithstanding all of that, its a decent enough place to work that offers the opportunities to progress rapidly if do the work/have the ability. No danger of languishing in the RHS for 10-20 years if that sort of thing bothers you.
Jet2 always have regular recruiting panics and do have a high turnover of pilots annually. Lots of "younger" pilots use it as a stepping stone to get onto widebody/LH flying so jump at the first opportunity. I left because oop north isn't home for me and I wanted the long haul lifestyle. That said, I have plenty of ex-RAF mates still at Jet2 who have turned down opportunities to move to bigger carriers and have forged careers in the LHS, as trainers and as managers.
The airlines are all recruiting quite hard at the moment. Whether or not everyone will rush out of the RAF to join up remains to be seen. There have been plenty of regular, similar "it's the end of the world!!" moments over the years and the RAF generally seems to weather the storms....
I did just shy of two years there and enjoyed it. There are stacks of ex-military people in the company who are able to live at home oop north and commute in to Leeds, EMA, MAN etc for a quick two sector day. It's not the land of milk and honey and the T&Cs of the major carriers far outstrip those on offer from Low Fare Finder House. The rosters get pretty chaotic in the summer and rarely survive first contact with reality. Notwithstanding all of that, its a decent enough place to work that offers the opportunities to progress rapidly if do the work/have the ability. No danger of languishing in the RHS for 10-20 years if that sort of thing bothers you.
Jet2 always have regular recruiting panics and do have a high turnover of pilots annually. Lots of "younger" pilots use it as a stepping stone to get onto widebody/LH flying so jump at the first opportunity. I left because oop north isn't home for me and I wanted the long haul lifestyle. That said, I have plenty of ex-RAF mates still at Jet2 who have turned down opportunities to move to bigger carriers and have forged careers in the LHS, as trainers and as managers.
The airlines are all recruiting quite hard at the moment. Whether or not everyone will rush out of the RAF to join up remains to be seen. There have been plenty of regular, similar "it's the end of the world!!" moments over the years and the RAF generally seems to weather the storms....
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Geograohy for Tiny Tykes.
Herod(your #26),
Nay, lad - 'tis the Capital of Pakistan !
D.
...Eh oop, lad. Dinst tha' know that Bradford is part of England's finest county; the "Independent Republic of West Yorkshire"?...
D.
Last edited by Danny42C; 19th Jan 2016 at 21:48. Reason: Sort it out.
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Take your time
The airline business is requiring a lot of pilots and there will be other options in the business.
Jet2 have long been at the back of the market when it comes to T's & C's and the latest pay rise puts them just about in the game.
If you want to live in the north it is not a bad deal but for those in the south there are much better pickings to be had that reflect the cost of life in the London area.
Jet2 have long been at the back of the market when it comes to T's & C's and the latest pay rise puts them just about in the game.
If you want to live in the north it is not a bad deal but for those in the south there are much better pickings to be had that reflect the cost of life in the London area.
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A & C
Jet2 have long been at the back of the market when it comes to T's & C's and the latest pay rise puts them just about in the game.
If you want to live in the north it is not a bad deal but for those in the south there are much better pickings to be had that reflect the cost of life in the London area.
Jet2 have long been at the back of the market when it comes to T's & C's and the latest pay rise puts them just about in the game.
If you want to live in the north it is not a bad deal but for those in the south there are much better pickings to be had that reflect the cost of life in the London area.
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Stop Start makes an interesting point here:
However, I sense this time there is a potent cocktail of events that we've never seen before:
- Pilot recruitment to the UK civil market has never been this great before. Ever.
- The RAF is smaller than it has ever been before, resulting in 'strategic shock' of losing a large pool of pilots.
- The ability to turn on the training pipeline is blunted for several reasons:
a) QFI mass is lower than ever due to the shrinkage of the training system post SDSR 2010 and the restructure of the UAS system. The only way to grow this mass is to poach pilots from the FL - requiring a reduction in FL ops and temporary reduction in student pilot output? Furthermore, factor the increased number of FTRS posts at the flying training schools; this generates a whole cadre of QFIs that the FL (particularly OCUs) will never be able to get their hands on.
b) Availability of training aircraft is smaller than before - witness numbers of Tucanos available on the line every day and sale of 3 x King Air post SDSR 2010.
c) The implementation of MFTS is 12-18 months away for EFT, BFJT and ME AFT. the student output numbers, and ac numbers, are fixed at a rate much lower than required to surge.
- We've had a very successful SDSR 15 in terms of platform numbers that will necessitate a increase in pilot mass - regardless of pilot outflow.
- 1998-2000 were peak years for RAF pilot recruitment (over 500 pilots recruited across those years). All of those pilots are now hitting their 16/38 points.
- The new pension has removed the 16/38 point (or at least value of pension at that point) for our second/third tourists. A significant retention lever has just gone.
- The first tourists are of the SDSR 2010 redundancy generation. I wouldn't underestimate the enduring damage that has done to their loyalty.
I haven't seen the full Manning picture, but suspect in the short term improving retention is the only answer. The longer term challenge of ramping up the training system will, I imagine, require some pretty innovative thinking.
As Stoppers says, the RAF generally weathers the storms, but it'll be interesting to watch how this time around.
There have been plenty of regular, similar "it's the end of the world!!" moments over the years and the RAF generally seems to weather the storms...
- Pilot recruitment to the UK civil market has never been this great before. Ever.
- The RAF is smaller than it has ever been before, resulting in 'strategic shock' of losing a large pool of pilots.
- The ability to turn on the training pipeline is blunted for several reasons:
a) QFI mass is lower than ever due to the shrinkage of the training system post SDSR 2010 and the restructure of the UAS system. The only way to grow this mass is to poach pilots from the FL - requiring a reduction in FL ops and temporary reduction in student pilot output? Furthermore, factor the increased number of FTRS posts at the flying training schools; this generates a whole cadre of QFIs that the FL (particularly OCUs) will never be able to get their hands on.
b) Availability of training aircraft is smaller than before - witness numbers of Tucanos available on the line every day and sale of 3 x King Air post SDSR 2010.
c) The implementation of MFTS is 12-18 months away for EFT, BFJT and ME AFT. the student output numbers, and ac numbers, are fixed at a rate much lower than required to surge.
- We've had a very successful SDSR 15 in terms of platform numbers that will necessitate a increase in pilot mass - regardless of pilot outflow.
- 1998-2000 were peak years for RAF pilot recruitment (over 500 pilots recruited across those years). All of those pilots are now hitting their 16/38 points.
- The new pension has removed the 16/38 point (or at least value of pension at that point) for our second/third tourists. A significant retention lever has just gone.
- The first tourists are of the SDSR 2010 redundancy generation. I wouldn't underestimate the enduring damage that has done to their loyalty.
I haven't seen the full Manning picture, but suspect in the short term improving retention is the only answer. The longer term challenge of ramping up the training system will, I imagine, require some pretty innovative thinking.
As Stoppers says, the RAF generally weathers the storms, but it'll be interesting to watch how this time around.
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The full page ad running in the 15th Jan edition of RAF News is for 'Approved Training Organisation Technical Instructors' for Jet2. To provide ground and simulator based training.....in Bradford !
). It's in a nice suburb way out of Bradford, certainly nothing like the inner city, the further away from Bradford city centre the nicer it becomes with Haworth, Ilkley, Otley, etc and Leeds just a few miles away is alright, in my opinion.
Last edited by gr4techie; 20th Jan 2016 at 11:55.
In times past, the variety of opportunities available in the RAF for its pilots was a significant factor. We might not have been paid as well as airline people-tube drivers, but we were paid pretty reasonably and the job satisfaction was a key factor.
But that was in times past.
When retention was proving to be an issue, the MoD/CAA working group evolved very good civil licence credit, which would benefit those who had given about 10 years of service and wanted a different career. When 22Gp killed that off, guess what - people started working towards civil licences as soon as they could do so... Then leaving as soon as possible.
Where once there were many different front line aeroplanes and stations, there are now very few. I recently asked about retention in the ME world and was told "They're leaving in droves....".
No chance of a break from the front line to do some quality QFI-ing at a UAS these days. I had such a career break, although I didn't want it at the time. But the UAS world of the early 1990s was excellent - some top people to teach (e.g StopStart) and a good flying training syllabus. No 'grading' and those who were keen did well. But then came grading, followed by the Marston lie and the introduction of 'Strength through Joy' bolleaux with a bit of air experience - mostly from ancient FTRS pilots rather than those taking a break from the front line....
Does it surprise me that people are eager to leave for the mundane life of a people-tube driver on higher pay and better Ts&Cs? Not really - and how sad.
But that was in times past.
When retention was proving to be an issue, the MoD/CAA working group evolved very good civil licence credit, which would benefit those who had given about 10 years of service and wanted a different career. When 22Gp killed that off, guess what - people started working towards civil licences as soon as they could do so... Then leaving as soon as possible.
Where once there were many different front line aeroplanes and stations, there are now very few. I recently asked about retention in the ME world and was told "They're leaving in droves....".
No chance of a break from the front line to do some quality QFI-ing at a UAS these days. I had such a career break, although I didn't want it at the time. But the UAS world of the early 1990s was excellent - some top people to teach (e.g StopStart) and a good flying training syllabus. No 'grading' and those who were keen did well. But then came grading, followed by the Marston lie and the introduction of 'Strength through Joy' bolleaux with a bit of air experience - mostly from ancient FTRS pilots rather than those taking a break from the front line....
Does it surprise me that people are eager to leave for the mundane life of a people-tube driver on higher pay and better Ts&Cs? Not really - and how sad.